--- Log opened Mon Oct 01 00:00:56 2007
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01:13 < MrJeep> in validators, is it possible to directly call the validationmanager->setError() method ?
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05:35 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:44 < _cheerios> huomenta
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07:00 < Whisller> hi
07:16 < _cheerios> http://weblog.rubyonrails.com/2007/9/30/rails-2-0-0-preview-release
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07:43 < RossC0> Huomenta!
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08:31 < E_mE> huomenta!
08:51 < codecop> huomenta
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09:12 < Xylakant> hi all
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10:18 < E_mE> can anyone see somerhing wrong with this routing rule, because its not working when im doing a request... but i $ro->gen('sop.invoice.reprint'); does work.. ??
10:18 < E_mE> <route name="sop" pattern="^sop/" module="Sop">
10:18 < E_mE>                                 <route name=".reprint.invoice" pattern="^reprintinvoice$" module="S$
10:18 < E_mE>                         </route>
10:18 < E_mE>  <route name=".reprint.invoice" pattern="^reprintinvoice$" module="Sop" action="InvoiceReprint" />
10:20 < v-dogg> 'sop.invoice.reprint' vs. name=".reprint.invoice"
10:21 < E_mE> yes, but its in a sub-route
10:21 < E_mE> so sop.reprint.invoice should work shouldnt it?
10:21 < v-dogg> $ro->gen('sop.invoice.reprint'); wouldn't, which one do you use?
10:21 < _cheerios> hard to tell from that indenting, pastebin is our friend.
10:22 < E_mE> ok ill paste bin :)
10:22 < v-dogg> first make sure your 'invoice' and 'reprint' are in the correct order, in your paste they aren'
10:22 < v-dogg> t
10:22 < E_mE> http://www.pastebin.ca/721557
10:25 < E_mE> nope still not working
10:25 < E_mE> the $ro->gen('sop.reprint.invoice'); is generating the correct path
10:26 < E_mE> just when i click on the link its generating its giving me 404 error
10:26 < v-dogg> module and action names are incorrect?
10:26 < E_mE> nope correct
10:27 < _cheerios> something about the pattern usage; pattern="^sop/", usually it's "^/sop" and pattern="^reprintinvoice$" would be pattern="^/reprintinvoice$"
10:28 < E_mE> found it.... pattern needed to have pattern="^/sop/"  
10:28 < E_mE> thanx _cheerios
10:28 < E_mE> you jogged my memory
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12:04 < E_mE> wow, i can hear mice walk in here today 
12:10 < _cheerios> where are you typing from, jail?
12:10 < E_mE> wow... that is whitt =P
12:12 < E_mE> though my offices are from the 60's oro so... so there very well might be mice
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12:22 < Wombert> oi
12:22 < Wombert> guys
12:22 < Wombert> I need heeeeeeelp
12:22 < E_mE> ?
12:23 < E_mE> coffee problems
12:23 < Xylakant> what can we do ;)
12:24 < MrJeep> yeah ?
12:26 < Wombert> http://agavi.org/irclogs/agavi-200709.log
12:26 < Wombert> go to the end of the document
12:26 < Wombert> then scroll up to 
12:26 < Wombert> 17:11 < Wombert> impl: heeelp
12:26 < Wombert> and read from there :)
12:26 < Wombert> it's really not much to read
12:26 < Wombert> just need help with naming those parameters
12:27 < Wombert> preferredly from native speakers
12:27  * Wombert looks at RossC0 
12:27  * _cheerios thumbs up v-dogg's hellish notation
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12:29 < v-dogg> heh
12:30 < Wombert> but let me sum it up again :p
12:31 < Wombert> right now, parameter "error_messages" to the FPF can have a list of... rules... used to insert validaiton error messages into the form
12:31 < Wombert> however, we actually need three different configurables
12:31 < Wombert> 1) a list of rules for normal validation errors
12:31 < Wombert> 2) a list of rules for errors that apply to more than one element (e.g. equals validator)
12:32  * RossC0 starts to read
12:32 < Wombert> thanks RossC0, much appreciated
12:32 < Wombert> 3) a list of rules for all other errors (i.e. those that did not match either of the rules above, or those that did not have a corresponding field in the form, mostly because you set a "lolz" error by hand to indicate some other error to the user)
12:33 < RossC0> ok
12:33 < Wombert> 1 and 2 are used to insert messages relative to the element in question (for 2, it is the first of the several fields), and 3 is used to insert messages relative to the form (so you can have them at the top of the form, not above the content layer or so)
12:33 < Wombert> also, we need two more things
12:34 < Wombert> a) a flag indicating that FPF should use rules from 1) even for multi field errors
12:34 < Xylakant> isn't all of this a pure display thing?
12:34 < Wombert> b) the name of the request attribute where FPF puts all those validation incidents it could ultimately not insert... so you can output them by hand as a last resort (should usually not be necessary)
12:34 < Wombert> we need names for those parameters, Xylakant
12:35 < RossC0> 1) simple_field_errors : simple validation messages (one_to_one)
12:35 < Xylakant> yeah, i gathered that from the logs
12:35 < RossC0> 2) complex_field_errors 
12:35 < RossC0> 3) custom_field_errors
12:35 < RossC0> :D
12:37 < Xylakant> but what i'm wondering is wether the order/position should not be fixed (always attached directly to the field) and the positioning could be done with CSS. 
12:37 < Xylakant> might get a little tricky in some situations though.
12:37 < Wombert> Xylakant: you can use xpath rules
12:37 < Wombert> so you can insert errors... directly behind the input element
12:38 < Wombert> or go up two elements and insert as last child there
12:38 < Wombert> and so on
12:38 < RossC0> yup - xpath ftw
12:38 < Wombert> you can also match different elements
12:38 < Wombert> so that it behaves different for select fields
12:38 < Wombert> or for fields that are in a <div class="lolz">
12:38 < Xylakant> yes, I understand what you're trying to achieve
12:40 < RossC0> Wombert - could we namespace it?  i.e. My complex form handler has a name for which custom_field_error to use?
12:40 < Wombert> ?
12:40 < RossC0> then in my global_filters have multiple configs for placing error messages 
12:41 < RossC0> so that we can set a name for the insertion rule to use in the validation.xml 
12:42 < RossC0> and that insertion xpath is in gloabl_filters.xml
12:42 < RossC0> that make sense?
12:42 < RossC0>  / worthwhile :D
12:43 < Xylakant> wouldn't it be possible to have markers in the html content <span id="error_for_field"></span> that get replaced
12:43 < Xylakant> that would require additional markup though
12:44 < Xylakant> maybe stripping it if no error occured
12:44 < Xylakant> sort of how phptal does it
12:44 < Xylakant> or rather 'sort of phptal works'
12:44 < Xylakant> that would eliminate the need for the configs as well
12:45 < Xylakant> but you could have someone develop the templates who does not know about agavi at all
12:47 < Wombert> RossC0: I'm not sure I understand
12:48 < Wombert> you mean different rules for different forms?
12:49 < RossC0> Wombert: yes - but in the Validation xml for a form if you want to use a custom insertion of an error message - you just set the name of the insertion to use 
12:49 < Wombert> Xylakant: that is of course possible as well, using the simple xpath rule //span[id='error_for_${elementId}'] and the locaiton "replace"
12:50 < Wombert> RossC0: the idea was that you do that in the view, at runtime
12:50 < Wombert> since you can change, extend etc all of the rules at runtime
12:50 < Wombert> so if that one form is different from the others, you can easily give it special rules that way
12:50 < Wombert> of course, you could also use the xpaths for that and check the id of the form or so
12:50 < RossC0> yes but allowing naming of rules makes it simple
12:51 < Wombert> yes, but it also creates a tight coupling between the validation and that filter
12:51 < Wombert> which is not a good idea
12:51 < RossC0> yes, but then there already is coupling between the form, validation and fpf
12:51 < Wombert> not exactly
12:51 < Wombert> the form works without any of those
12:51 < Wombert> the validation works without any of those
12:52 < Wombert> the fpf does as well (okay, yes, it needs the validation manager, but if no validaiton was done, then it still works)
12:52 < RossC0> that would still happen
12:52 < Wombert> but if we introduce a FPF-specific feature to the validation... really not good
12:52 < RossC0> sure but these are features that are used together
12:53 < RossC0> all I'm saying is it might be cool to add a custom name  /field  to VM that FPF could use
12:53 < RossC0> so that I can write less code
12:53 < RossC0> :D
12:54 < RossC0> anyway I'm not even sure that the configs global_filters could handle it
12:55 < RossC0> but its something to think about in ze future
13:03 < Xylakant> isn't all of this too complicated? I can't imagine a use case that can't be handled through replacement.
13:03 < Wombert> it's not complicated at all
13:03 < Xylakant> and that would require no config, would have no dependencies to the view or anything
13:04 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/102490
13:04 < Wombert> that's the most basic version
13:04 < Wombert> each field with errors then gets an <ol> behind it with all the errors in <li>s each
13:04 < Wombert> piece of cake
13:05 < Wombert> plus, you don't need to have the placeholders in the form
13:05 < Xylakant> minus: I need to tweak my agavi conf if my markup changes
13:06 < Wombert> nope
13:06 < Wombert> you can still use your approach!
13:06 < Wombert> then you don't have to change anything
13:06 < Wombert> if you want to use placeholders
13:06 < Xylakant> but then, you 'plus' doesn't count any more
13:07 < Wombert> well
13:07 < Wombert> if you have placeholders... then you can only do it that way
13:07 < Wombert> what if you cannot express something usijng a placeholder
13:07 < Wombert> and what about multi field errors
13:07 < Wombert> like an equals or so
13:07 < Wombert> it's just too difficult
13:07 < Wombert> and you have error specific stuff in the form... uncool!
13:08 < Wombert> with the current implementation, you can have both
13:08 < Wombert> which is good
13:08 < Wombert> you have the freedom of choice
13:08 < Wombert> in the true spirit of Agavi ;)
13:08 < Xylakant> flexibility always adds complexity :)
13:10 < Wombert> zomg
13:10 < Wombert> We should, IMHO, drop T_IMPORT and change the namespace implementation
13:10 < Wombert>  to use T_USE.
13:10 < Wombert> ...
13:10 < Wombert> THANK YOU PHP
13:12 < Wombert> ( http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/563 )
13:15 < Xylakant> :)
13:15 < Xylakant> when is php6 scheduled?
13:16 < _cheerios> sometime next year
13:16 < MikeSeth> what, did you run into Coallier's article on 5.3 namespaces?
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13:16 < MikeSeth> ok
13:17 < MikeSeth> what's wrong with this picture
13:17 < MikeSeth> http://blog.assembleron.com/2007/10/01/zend-framework-and-favorit/
13:18 < E_mE> how can i submit a form request into a new Javascript window?
13:18 < MikeSeth> I dont think you can
13:19 < E_mE> feck hooks!
13:20 < Xylakant> well, why not? 
13:20 < Xylakant> open the new javascript window and do an ajax request ;)
13:21 < E_mE> can you stop webbrowsers from printing URL's on the pages etc?
13:21 < E_mE> ajax request what though?
13:21 < E_mE> its a form POST
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13:22 < MikeSeth> well steal the form contents
13:22 < _cheerios> hack the system with lunix sk1llz
13:22 < MikeSeth> the form itself can not be detached from the window object it resides in, so you can't submit it elsewhere
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13:24 < Xylakant> E_mE: you can read the input fields content, that won't work with fileuploads though
13:24 < Xylakant> and you can then submit that data with an ajax request
13:25 < Xylakant> and put the result in a new window. 
13:25 < Xylakant> I'm a bit wondering what you're trying to achieve though
13:30 < Wombert> open the window in onsubmit and use the same name in target
13:33 < Xylakant> interesting solution
13:34 < Xylakant> isn't that a race condition, i.e. what happens if the browser is too slow opening the window
13:40 < E_mE> im going to have to do the print as a PDF because of the web browsers stupid URL and other details being prompted
13:41 < E_mE> does fpdf work as a model in agavi with no problems?
13:41 < Wombert> people can switch off the URL, date etc printing
13:42 < E_mE> in firefox?
13:48 < Xylakant> yes
13:59 < E_mE> do i just need to activate FPF for it to start working?
13:59 < RossC0> MikeSeth: is it Zend = new PEAR(2007) ?
14:02 < Wombert> FPF? err?
14:03 < E_mE> the one that automatically fills the forms
14:05 < MikeSeth> RossC0: well at least the author admits the damn thing isnt a framework..
14:06 < RossC0> yup
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14:11 < Xylakant> i'm a bit puzzled about the argument that the bad thing about a framework is 'that they make you think in a certain way'
14:12 < Xylakant> for me, the good thing about a framework is that it makes all the developers here do the things in the same way
14:13 < Xylakant> if i think back to the days where all dev here did projects "the way they liked it best"...
14:13  * Xylakant shivers
14:15 < Xylakant> so, yes, a framework takes away a little flexibilty and enforces a certain way of doing things by making that way 'the easy way', but that's not a bad thing at all.
14:20 < Wombert> E_mE: ah. yes. sure.
14:20 < Wombert> so
14:20 < Wombert> pokes RossC0, MikeSeth, Xylakant
14:20 < Wombert> names
14:20 < Wombert> for those config params
14:20 < Wombert> NOW!
14:20 < Wombert> :)
14:20 < Wombert> PLEASE!
14:20 < Wombert> :)
14:21 < RossC0> RossC0: 1) simple_field_errors
14:21 < RossC0> RossC0: 2) complex_field_errors 
14:21 < RossC0> RossC0: 3) custom_field_errors
14:21 < Wombert> they're not custom tho
14:21 < Wombert> not necessarily anyway
14:21  * Xylakant is fighting hard against vista
14:21 < RossC0> customisable
14:21 < Wombert> could also be those that didn't match anyof the expressions in 1 and 2, RossC0 
14:21 < Wombert> or if no 2 was set up, just 1
14:22 < Wombert> also, isn't _errors a little misleading, me thinks
14:22 < Wombert> should we group them three together in one param
14:22 < Wombert> i.e. "error_messages", then children "normal", "multi_field", "other" or something
14:22 < RossC0> simple, complex, default?
14:22 < RossC0>  / other
14:23 < RossC0> simple, multi_field, other ?
14:31 < MikeSeth> wha
14:31 < MikeSeth> whaaa
14:34 < _cheerios> one, two, mystery
14:35 < _cheerios> single,multi,fallback
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14:49 < MikeSeth> recommended way to edit the manual XMLs?
14:55 < E_mE> does PHP throws a Division by zero error if you try to devide zeros?
14:56 < MikeSeth> yes
15:15 < E_mE> does fpf work if you press the back button??
15:19 < Wombert> ?
15:20 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I found the ideal way to edit docs
15:20 < Wombert> MikeSeth: shoot
15:20 < MikeSeth> xmlmind xml editor - you can edit it wysiwig
15:20 < MikeSeth> it kicks ass0rz
15:20 < Wombert> lolz
15:20 < Wombert> :>
15:21 < Wombert> we're all using that to edit them :p
15:21 < Wombert> and no, it sucks, since it's buggy sometimes
15:21 < Wombert> and also the xml it produces is horrible
15:21  * MikeSeth ;-(
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15:51 < MrJeep> it is possible, with the routing, to generate an url with the full path
15:51 < MrJeep> i mea something like http://www.somethign.com/path/param ...
15:52 < Xylakant> yes
15:52 < MrJeep> or do I have to use getBaseHref() . gen(..)
15:52 < Xylakant> pass 'relative=false' as parameter
15:52 < Xylakant> to genUrl()
15:52 < MrJeep> ok thnx
15:53 < Xylakant> well, pass it as an option, not as a parameter :P
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15:54 < Xylakant> so $ro->gen('route', null, array('relative' => false));
15:54 < Xylakant> should do it
15:59 < MrJeep> yeah it's working :D thnx
16:02 < Wombert> hey splatch` you there?
16:08 < MrJeep> how would you call a table used to store previously entered password
16:08 < MrJeep> I'm out of idea for a quick short name
16:08 < MrJeep> because member_saved_password is.. well.. don't like it
16:10 < Wombert> do you really need a table for that
16:11 < Wombert> store them in a separate field
16:11 < MrJeep> background :
16:11 < MrJeep> some image will b e password protected
16:11 < MrJeep> once the user enter the password, i want to store it so he won't have to enter it times and times again
16:11 < MrJeep> it's not about username/password informations
16:14 < Xylakant> cu all
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16:23 < _cheerios> MrJeep: getPlainImageMemberPassword(), or getPimp() for short.
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16:24 < MrJeep> hahahaha
16:24 < MrJeep> :P
16:24 < MrJeep> good one :P
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18:01 < MrJeep> anyone here could look at my code and tell me if I'm on the good way
18:01 < MrJeep> preferably
18:01 < MrJeep> someone with experience :P
18:06 < splatch`> Wombert: yes
18:07 < Wombert> did darek have time yet to send me the stuff
18:07 < splatch`> ok
18:10 < impl> neeeeed designnnnn
18:10 < _cheerios> then get some, duh!
18:35 < Wombert> MrJeep: just show it :p
18:35 < Wombert> don't have much time myself right now tho
18:36 < Wombert> impl: still need those names :S
18:38 < MrJeep> Wombert: I have to send the code 
18:43 < _cheerios> put in on eBay. you'll get an opinion alright.
18:43 < JanK_> what are the basic steps to create an action which outputs an image? 1. Create an output_type 'png' with the proper Content-Type. 2. Create an action 3. Set the output_type in the view (how?) 4. echo the image data from the view
18:44 < MrJeep> _cheerios : yeah sure
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19:05 < JanK_> anyone?
19:21 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@82.153.7.16] has joined #agavi
19:22 < E_mE> hihi
19:24 < MrJeep> JanK_ : in view : $this->getResponse()->SetContentType('image/pgn');
19:25 < MrJeep> $this->GetResponse()->setContent($imageContent);
19:25 < MrJeep> done
19:25 < JanK_> thanks, but i better set the content type in the output_types.png?
19:25 < JanK_> output_types.xml
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19:26 < E_mA> is there a reason why when i have http://81.168.18.2:1515 with the follow code <?php print $this->getContext()->getRouting()->getBaseHref(); ?>  will the :1515 not be added???
19:26 < E_mA> wwill not add :1515
19:27 < E_mA> is there a reason why when i have http://81.168.18.2:1515 with the follow code <?php print $this->getContext()->getRouting()->getBaseHref(); ?>  will not add the :1515???
19:29 < Wombert> JanK_: yes
19:29 < Wombert> in output_types.xml
19:29 < Wombert> you got it pretty spot on
19:29 < Wombert> you can set the output type using the routing
19:29 < JanK_> yeah, got that from the sample app with the wsdl routing
19:30 < Wombert> you could also set the output type in the view's initialize()
19:30 < Wombert> but using the routing is better
19:30 < E_mA> Wombert: can you help me with my query?
19:31 < Wombert> E_mA: something broken with your server env
19:32 < E_mA> you think?
19:32 < Wombert> yes
19:32 < E_mA> ive not tampered with it
19:32 < Wombert> well
19:32 < Wombert> stoll
19:32 < Wombert> still
19:32 < Wombert> maybe a load balancer or so
19:32 < Wombert> in any case, agavi cannot determine the port
19:32 < Wombert> probably your Listen directive does not include the port number
19:32 < E_mA> listen directive? 
19:35 < E_mA> Wombert: your knowledge on webservers and PHP bemuses me at times
19:36 < Wombert> apache
19:36 < Wombert> httpd.conf
19:36 < Wombert> Listen servername must be Listen servername:1515
19:36 < Wombert> my guess
19:37 < E_mA> yeah i found some info about it
19:37 < E_mA> ill will try :)
19:38 < E_mA> thanx for your help
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19:51 < E_mA> Wombert: what ENV variable does PHP read for the server name?
19:53 < impl> Wombert: I can't come to a good conclusion about how to name that stuff
19:53 < impl> Nothing really sounds good
20:00 < E_mA> Wombert: are you sure what your saying is possible?? 
20:01 < E_mA> Wombert: someone in the apache channel doesn't appear to think it can :/
20:07 < Wombert> ...
20:07 < Wombert> show me a phpinfo
20:07 < ttj> Show me the money!
20:07 < Wombert> mhm
20:07 < Wombert> fuck
20:07 < Wombert> there was a "zap" sound from my left knee
20:07 < Wombert> and now it hurts
20:07 < Wombert> a tiny little bit
20:07 < ttj> Welcome to my world.
20:08 < E_mA> Wombert: http://81.168.18.2:1515  
20:08 < Wombert> ...
20:08 < Wombert> E_mA: and what do we see there
20:09 < Wombert> _SERVER["SERVER_PORT"] is... tadaa.... 80
20:09 < Wombert> now can you please go to your httpd.conf
20:09 < E_mA> i thought of trying to use HOST
20:09 < Wombert> and add the correct port number to the Listen directive
20:09 < E_mA> yes... but it needs to accept connection on port 80 as well :)
20:09 < Wombert> then set up a virtual host
20:10 < E_mA> ive got:
20:10 < E_mA> Listen 80
20:10 < E_mA> Listen 1515
20:10 < Wombert> well it seems that doesn't cut it
20:11 < Wombert> and HTTP_HOST is not a solution since it is user supplied
20:11 < _cheerios> <virtualhost *:[port]> maybe?
20:12 < E_mA> mmmm... ill try :)
20:25 < E_mA> mmm... i just have to setup the whole intranet under the 1515 port
20:25 < E_mA> its not wanting to play ball
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20:27 < _cheerios> why are you not using port 80?
20:27 < E_mA> because the webserver at work that does outlook uses port 80
20:27 < E_mA> so port 1515 is used on the firewall direct the traffic to the intranet server
20:30 < _cheerios> so, likely that :1515 goes to :80 internally to some virtual/other server, which explains the SERVER_PORT reading
20:33 < Wombert> lolz, exchange over port 80?
20:33 < Wombert> no, the server port is wrong because apache is set up to listen on 80
20:33 < Wombert> does the server have an internal ip?
20:33 < Wombert> even though I doubt that the one above is the real external IP of the machine
20:33 < Wombert> you have to set up virtual hosts
20:34 < Wombert> #apache can help you with that
20:34 < _cheerios> its not, theyre doing routing
20:34 < _cheerios> the page listing had atleast two more servers listed
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20:36 < _cheerios> server port will be whatever port you call apache with, unless ofc, that's not the port anymore by the time you reach apache
20:36 < E_mA> Wombert & _cheerios: appricate your help... ive setup pure :1515 rule
20:38 < E_mA> oh actually i think i may of solved the problem :o
20:39 < E_mA> the key was two NameVirualHost with *:80 and *:1515
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20:41 < Wombert> yes
20:41 < Wombert> what I said :p
20:41 -!- arbi_ is now known as Goelo[06]
20:42  * E_mA Gives Wombert and none-pad coffee from espresso maker ;) hehe
20:42 < _cheerios> helps to have the ports set for apache to work with your domains, yep.
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20:43  * E_mA passes _cheerios some vodka ... how cold is it up there at the moment/
20:43 < E_mA> ?
20:43 < _cheerios> shrug. thermometer is broken.
20:43 < E_mA> below 0'c?
20:44 < _cheerios> +10 would be my guess
20:44 < E_mA> same as here
20:45 < _cheerios> close, http://www.foreca.fi/Suomi/ennuste/1-3
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20:45 < E_mA> how cold does it get in the winter where you are ?
20:46 -!- arbi_ [n=arbi@80.191.145.146] has joined #agavi
20:48 < _cheerios> depends. several mild winters where it's most 0..-10C. last winter was an exception with several -25 ... -30C days, record was 39.9C somewhere.
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20:51 < E_mA> wow.. thats pretty cold
20:52 < E_mA> last winter where i live we only had like mild frost 3 times in the whole winter
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20:52 < E_mA> if i s setup a frameset, having the top frame with a print button and edit button
20:53 < E_mA> the bottom frame will have the printable item which is made up from a POST request
20:54 < E_mA> if the user clicks edit whcih return the the form that the POST recieves the data from, how can i use the form population filter to fill up all the text fields again?
20:55 < Wombert> is that information stored
20:55 < E_mA> what do you mean by stored?
20:55 < _cheerios> frames? you should leave the nineties already.
20:56 < E_mA> _cheerios: well i need to be able to print an invoice which looks the same as the invoice that comes from our Sage system
20:56 < Wombert> ah
20:56 < E_mA> unless you know how to supress printing?
20:56 < Wombert> I'd try to find a way to talk to the sage system and get an invoice
20:57 -!- Goleo[06] [n=arbi@80.191.145.137] has quit [Connection timed out]
20:57 < E_mA> Sage's developer support is only given to people who pay lots of money for it or who are resellers... not to small endusers like me
20:57 < E_mA> they will tell me where to go
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20:58 < E_mA> and you need the developer API's which you dont get
20:58 -!- Goleo[06] [n=arbi@80.191.145.146] has joined #agavi
20:59 < E_mA> but what ive done is take a HTML template sage generates and fill that in with data entered by the user... this is for manual invoices btw
21:01 < E_mA> so will the form population filter reinsert the data again?
21:02 < _cheerios> your job sounds really boring
21:03 < E_mA> your telling me
21:03 < _cheerios> are the tons of typos you make daily due hitting the bottle to endure it?
21:03 < E_mA> i had to fight my boss for her to allow me to use PHP to generate a manual invoice as she kept going.. it will take too long as you could be doing something better which will be worth our money :/
21:04 < _cheerios> even my dry bread tastes good listening to what you do :D
21:04 < E_mA> what do you do?
21:04 < E_mA> well, it pays the bills... so i can buy slightly moister bread
21:06 < _cheerios> sitting infront of the comp getting my ass kicked by an ikea chair, mostly.
21:06 < E_mA> hehe.. do you find that your shoulder blades start to hurt?
21:07 < _cheerios> nope, I sit proper.
21:07 < E_mA> i think i need a new chair at work then
21:09 < _cheerios> there's guides for newbies on how to sit on a chair while using a computer, if you have pains
21:09 < E_mA> :O newbie! im not a newbie
21:10 < E_mA> i think my chair is not designed for computer use
21:10 < ttj> They typically aren't.
21:10 < ttj> Chairs are normally designed for sitting.
21:11 < E_mA> :o
21:11 < ttj> I know. It's a little known fact.
21:11 < E_mA> what are the wheels for ?:/
21:11 < ttj> For getting coffee without getting up.
21:11 < ttj> And alternatively for kidnapping coworkers.
21:12 < ttj> And office racing.
21:12 < E_mA> or getting really dizzy
21:12 < ttj> Nah, you don't need wheels for that.
21:12 < ttj> It's enough that the chair just spins for getting dizzy.
21:12 < E_mA> true true... i was thinking out of the box
21:12 < ttj> Ah. You obviously don't work in a box, then.
21:12 < E_mA> i was thinking about how we could go crazy... like cheese and ham toasties ;)
21:12  * ttj hugs his cubicle.
21:13 < Wombert> cubicles suck
21:13 < Wombert> they make lonely
21:13 < Wombert> !
21:13 < E_mA> i did have a office
21:13 < ttj> Wombert: I have low walls and I can see my neighbors. :P
21:13 < E_mA> but now i'm in the main office with all the sales depatment and accounts
21:13 < ttj> Plus cubicles are great since you can always go hang around in some other guy's cubicle and chat.
21:14 < Wombert> which means you cannot concentrate at all
21:14 < Wombert> since everyone's talking
21:14 < Wombert> or making phone calls
21:14 < Wombert> and its hot
21:14 < ttj> Wombert: You don't know how much.
21:14 < Wombert> and it sucks
21:14 < Wombert> been there, done that
21:14 < ttj> Standardization is pretty much just conf calls. :P
21:14 < ttj> But fortunately it's not hot since we have brilliant A/C.
21:14 < Wombert> I was referring to E_mA ;)
21:14 < Wombert> I'm sure you have
21:14 < Wombert> but then, it's never over 20 degrees anyway in finland
21:14 < E_mA> yes it is horrible
21:14 < Wombert> :p
21:14 < ttj> :P
21:15 < ttj> The only country in the world where the whole nation invests in brilliant A/C is also the only country that doesn't need it. :D
21:15 < Wombert> anyway, I've ordered really, really brilliant chairs for teh office
21:15 < Wombert> and nice desks
21:15 < E_mA> have my boss (who is the Finical controller) sitting not 2 meters from me
21:15 < Wombert> will see how that works out
21:15 < ttj> Cool.
21:15 < E_mA> chairs with wheels?!?!?!?! :D
21:15 < ttj> My boss's boss is sitting just a few rooms down. And he's a Vice President. :P
21:16 < _cheerios> i prefer cubicles over open-floor anyday to get some peace of mind
21:16 < E_mA> Wombert: you setting up your own office then?
21:16 < ttj> Ah, but we're getting this FlexiSpace crap soon. :P
21:17 < _cheerios> what dept. in nokia did you work in, ttj?
21:17 < ttj> Standardization and Industry Relations.
21:18 < E_mA> ttj: did you ever go near the "MAke a phone work for 1 year and then break down programming" department?
21:18 < ttj> No.
21:18 < E_mA> hehe =P
21:18 < ttj> I think they have that over at Motorola... *ducks*
21:18 < E_mA> just most phone seem to break quicker then not
21:19 < ttj> I think HR is monitoring me or something, so I have to say nice things about the company these days.
21:19 < E_mA> can i insult or will they come and break me hohoho!
21:20 < ttj> E_mA: They'll make your phone explode in the middle of a conversation!
21:20 < _cheerios> i have the exploding battery model, but it's not from the infernal batch.
21:20 < E_mA> what with a cute little animation on the screen =P
21:21 < E_mA> ive got an N70
21:21 < E_mA> which is rather slow
21:21 < ttj> E_mA: Ever heard of these nice signals you can pass onto the handset through the network and base station? They can make any phone anywhere in the world explode at will. NSA requested the feature.
21:22 < ttj> Right, 'tis getting very silly. Might as well try to sleep a bit before meeting ze lawyers.
21:22 < E_mA> hehehe... well.. i best get some foam 
21:23 < E_mA> sleep well...
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21:25 < Wombert> E_mA: yeah
21:25 < Wombert> speaking of crappy phones
21:26 < Wombert> my 6300 locks up if I insert the power cord too far
21:26 < Wombert> and it also locks up when I remove it once it is charged
21:27 < E_mA> at work about 3 sales managers in the past 3-4 months have had phones which have broken or lose signal loads
21:28 < _cheerios> you're too manly for a phone, Wombert 
21:28 < E_mA> his got a pink spice girls phone _cheerios...
21:28 < E_mA> or actually.. BeFour heheheheh!
21:30 < _cheerios> i havent joined the smart-phone revolution yet. i have the cheapest model from 2006, a nokia 1600.
21:30 < _cheerios> (or something 1xxx)
21:31 < Wombert> http://www.finalgear.com/news/2007/10/01/top-gear-season-10-trailer/ !
21:31 < Wombert> smartphones sux
21:31 < ttj> You suck.
21:31 < Wombert> these symbian things are so fecking miserable
21:31 < Wombert> and that multitasking
21:31 < Wombert> I just dont get it
21:31 < Wombert> and I keep hitting the wrong buttons
21:31 < Wombert> I have an N95 here for development
21:31 < Wombert> ZOMG
21:32 < _cheerios> ttj, my salary sucks. :)
21:32 < E_mA> AH You like Top Gear huh ;)
21:32 < Wombert> it wont even end the call if you slide in the keypad again
21:32 < E_mA> i do like the GPS on the N95
21:32 < Wombert> which means potentially embarassing situations
21:32 < E_mA> but its REALLY slow
21:32 < Wombert> and the GPS is sooooo useless
21:32 < ttj> How so?
21:32 < Wombert> because it needs a year or two to find out where it is
21:33 < E_mA> when it works after about 1-2 minutes waiting
21:33 < ttj> Update the software.
21:33 < Wombert> I did
21:33 < ttj> A-GPS is a lot faster.
21:33 < Wombert> it's still hopeless
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21:33 < ttj> 6110 Navigator with A-GPS is about 10-15 seconds for a fix.
21:33 < E_mA> when it does work i do like the little mapping software
21:37 < _cheerios> when do you use the GPS? does it get much use beyond when you're driving?
21:38 < E_mA> i used it on the train... but meerly out of novelty
21:43 < _cheerios> Wombert, you're doing mobile apps?
21:43 < Wombert> something in that direction
21:44 < _cheerios> do I need to tune in my GPS
21:54 < E_mA> nite nite Wombert & _cheerios
21:56 < _cheerios> <h1>301: This object has moved</h1>
21:56 < _cheerios> <b><p>Please click <A HREF="http://www.siliconvalley.com/404">here</A> to continue
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05:13 < Wombert> huomenta
05:47 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:16 < RossC0> Huomenta!!
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08:37 < RossC0> Woot!
08:37 < RossC0> <3 XPath!
08:37 < RossC0> <parameter name="ancestor::label/ancestor::li[contains(@class,'left')]">
08:37 < RossC0> roar!
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08:53 < E_mE> huomenta!
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08:58 < Wombert> RossC0: it rocks, doesn't it
08:58 < Wombert> :)
08:59 < RossC0> Wombert: when it works yes :D
08:59 < Wombert> I'll hop into the office and then I'll pick param names for the new features and commit commit commit :)
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10:57 < Wombert> RossC0: but it's not the <li> that has class="left", right?
10:58 < RossC0> yeah it is
10:58 < Wombert> wouldn't li[@class='left'] do the trick then
10:59 < Wombert> (prolly faster, too)
10:59 < RossC0> no because it also may have other classes:  inline 
10:59 < RossC0> ah sorry
10:59 < RossC0> re read the initial comment!
11:01 < Wombert> RossC0: aaah! clever
11:03 < Wombert> btw
11:03 < Wombert> anyone seen the Halo 3 ads lately
11:03 < Wombert> damn they are nice
11:03 < Wombert> oh and RossC0: http://www.finalgear.com/news/2007/10/01/top-gear-season-10-trailer/
11:04 < RossC0> COOL!
11:04 < RossC0> :D
11:04 < Wombert> the r8 and the 911
11:05 < Wombert> nice
11:06 < Wombert> and seems aston v8 racing thing + gt3rs + gallardo into... france or whatever again
11:06 < Wombert> aaah it's gonna be friggen ace once again
11:06 < Wombert> anyway
11:07 < Wombert> should we use flat or nested params for those errors now?
11:07 < Wombert> i.e. three arrays on the top level, or three arrays inside... dunno... "error_messages" ?
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11:08 < _cheerios> ho-ho, huomenta
11:09 < Wombert> hai
11:09 < Wombert> [13:06] Wombert: anyway
11:09 < Wombert> [13:07] Wombert: should we use flat or nested params for those errors now?
11:09 < Wombert> [13:07] Wombert: i.e. three arrays on the top level, or three arrays inside... dunno... "error_messages" ?
11:11 < _cheerios> whatever doesnt give you nasty stomach pains at 3am
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11:26 < RossC0> Wombert: example of nested ?
11:27 < Wombert> <parameter name="error_messages">
11:27 < Wombert>   <parameter name="multi_field">
11:32 < E_mE> Wombert: did you see the episode with the bucati (i think thats how its spelt) that can go like 300MPH or something silly??
11:32 < Wombert> bugatti
11:32 < Wombert> veyron
11:32 < E_mE> or the episode where they travelled through south of the USA 
11:32 < E_mE> yes thats the one i believe
11:32 < E_mE> insane car
11:35 < E_mE> Wombert: check out http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_pictures/6423241.stm   you may of seen it
11:35 < Wombert> yes
11:37 < E_mE> when you going to buy one ;)
11:37 < Wombert> nevar!
12:01 < _cheerios> hihi @ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a40BQ8ThsTc
12:02 < E_mE> did json_encode() get introduced in version 5.2+
12:04 < _cheerios> read the docs
12:05 < E_mE> aye.. was just confirming... but appears taht pecl has a json extension :D
12:06 < Wombert> yeah, _cheerios 
12:06 < Wombert> so appaling
12:06 < Wombert> do you know the original ad?
12:06 < Wombert> it's pretty cool, but it's also a blatant lie :p
12:06 < _cheerios> yeah, it's an apple ad, i saw it.
12:07 < _cheerios> what makes the original ad a blatant lie?
12:07 < _cheerios> by the looks of the original it was from the 80s
12:07 < Wombert> this iphone stuff :p
12:07 < Wombert> nah it was from 1998
12:07 < Wombert> I think
12:08 < Wombert> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Think_Different
12:08 < E_mE> i wrote a marketing project on the iMac when it first appeared back in 98...
12:08 < E_mE> and had a Rev. B my self
12:10 < Wombert> 1997
12:10 < E_mE> pretty sure it was 98, because i left school in 98
12:11 < E_mE> maybe my memory is too doped
12:11 < _cheerios> ah, seems i've missed on all the brainwashing material
12:11 < E_mE> yes it is 1998
12:11 < Wombert> nope
12:11 < E_mE> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imac
12:12 < Wombert> On September 28th, 1997, during the broadcast premiere of Toy Story, Apple unveiled a new advertising campaign that attempts to inspire people to new heights, and to choose Apple as the brand of computer that will help them to do so.
12:12  * Wombert wins
12:12 < Wombert> :p
12:12 < Wombert> and remember
12:12 < Wombert> IT MUST BE TRUE IF IT'S ON THE INTERNETS
12:13 < E_mE> ah i think we was talking about different things hehe.. i was talking about imac and you are refereing to think different
12:13 < CIA-11> david * r2105 /branches/0.11/src/response/AgaviWebResponse.class.php: Added AgaviWebResponse::unsetCookie(), closes #577 (thanks Ross Lawley for the original patch)
12:13 < E_mE> so we both win.. wooo!
12:13 < Wombert> yeah ;)
12:16 < _cheerios> ace recruiting video http://www.xobni.com/blog/2007/10/01/growing-xobni-were-hiring/  (lolz@using ze german!)
12:19 < Wombert> lolz
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12:56 < Whisller> hi :)
13:13 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/544 opinions?
13:13 < Wombert> it's a chicken and egg situation
13:14 < Wombert> if we validate after the security filter has run, isSecure and getCredentials cannot access request data to determine their return values
13:14 < Wombert> if we validate before isSecure, we're probably doing things even though they were not supposed to be done (because the user did not have the credentials)
13:15  * Wombert eats his fruit salad and ponders
13:18 < v-dogg> "Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
13:19 < Wombert> mmmh
13:19 < Wombert> Galia Melon
13:19 < v-dogg> haha: http://users.kent.net/~pinky/ponder.html
13:24 < Wombert> Uh, I think so, Brain, but balancing a family and a career ... oooh, it's all too much for me.
13:24 < Wombert> haha
13:50 < _cheerios> if calling request data in baseview initialize, what form has the validated data? ,$this->context->getRequest()->getRequestData() ? if accessing rd, should it be done in base v's setupHtml then, not initialize?
13:52 < Wombert> no, get the rd from the container
13:52 < Wombert> not from the global request data
13:52 < Wombert> see, that's why I want to make the change in #544
13:52 < Wombert> because that might be dangerous
13:56 < _cheerios> ah, k. good to know.
13:58 < E_mE> anyone here use mootools?
13:58 < _cheerios> sure
13:59 < E_mE> im using a Ajax object... successfully got a request.. but i want to retreieve the data its recieving... ive looked at the source and documentations but im puzzelled on how to pass the database back to a var
14:00 < E_mE> data back to a var*
14:00 < _cheerios> #mootools
14:00 < E_mE> they only help you if you are developing other elements for mootools.. its a developers channel
14:01 < E_mE> but i can try
14:01 < _cheerios> they help out if you ask questions that arent born of lazyness
14:02 < E_mE> see see :)
14:18 < Wombert> RossC0: "error_messages" with "single_field", "multi_field", "fallback" ?
14:19 < E_mE> isn't there a website that generates you progress wheels?
14:19 < E_mE> or is there a special name for the apple progress wheel
14:19 < Wombert> I'd like a website that generates me meaninfgul names for stuff
14:19 < Wombert> zomg
14:20 < E_mE> hehe... then terminology would be history
14:21 < RossC0> Wombert: roger
14:21 < RossC0> looks good
14:21 < RossC0> fallback = default ?
14:22 < Wombert> no, that's the one that inserts into the form, not next to elements
14:22 < _cheerios> multi should be cheater </planetarion reference>
14:22 < Wombert> that's the "other" thing
14:23 < RossC0> need a better name than fallback
14:23 < _cheerios> is there a default on top of those 3 ?
14:23 < RossC0> block?
14:23 < RossC0> group?
14:23 < RossC0> other?
14:23 < RossC0> :D
14:23 < Wombert> no, but I could imagine that we allow rules directly inside "error_messages", for the lazy ;)
14:24 < _cheerios> single_field, multi_field and when all else fails, force_field !
14:26 < Wombert> force field, huh?
14:26 < Wombert> you're funny or what :p
14:27 < Wombert> STAR TREK NERD!
14:27 < Wombert> they all don't appropriately describe what they're about, that's my issue
14:29 < _cheerios> too much thinking, too little doing!
14:29 < _cheerios> what is this, Sweden?
14:29 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["beat me out, it's just a bunch of nerds here."]
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15:18 < MikeSeth> http://qdb.us/109019
15:18  * MikeSeth cries
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15:21 < Wombert> okay
15:21 < Wombert> MikeSeth, RossC0 
15:21 < Wombert> idea
15:21 < Wombert> three params
15:21 < MikeSeth> Wombert: http://qdb.us/109019
15:21 < Wombert> error_messages (generic ones, for the form)
15:22 < Wombert> field_error_messages
15:22 < MikeSeth> I dont know what you're talking about. Start from scratch?
15:22 < Wombert> multi_field_error_messages
15:22 < Wombert> mmh no those are zomg
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15:23 < RossC0> Wombert: YES
15:23 < Wombert> MikeSeth: fuck the root password and go shopping with the CC number xD
15:23 < RossC0> GO
15:23 < RossC0> GO
15:23 < RossC0> GO
15:23 < Wombert> too long though, RossC0
15:23 < Wombert> but getting there, me thinks
15:24 < Wombert> and it introduces the question about behavior
15:24 < Wombert> should the generic ones be used on the elements as well if the others are not present?
15:25 < Wombert> so you could have <parameter name="self::html:form"> as first and <parameter name="self::*"> as second
15:25 < Wombert> or so
15:25  * Wombert ponders
15:28 < Wombert> also... should we have a config flag for the multi field errors using the single field error rules
15:28 < RossC0> right I g2g and pick up the little one!
15:29 < Wombert> or should we just do it so that multi field errors use the single field error rules if no multi field ones are present
15:29 < Wombert> okay :) bai RossC0 
15:29 < RossC0> kTHXBAI
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15:40 < malax> Huomenta!
15:41 < Wombert> hai
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15:45 < Wombert> what do you guys think about
15:45 < Wombert> "error_messages", "field_error_messages" and "multi_field_error_messages"
15:45 < Wombert> by default, it uses error_messages for everything
15:46 < Wombert> and if you have no multi_lala, it uses field_error_messages
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15:52 < _cheerios> sounds good
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15:56 < E_mE> bye bye
15:56 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
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16:00 < MikeSeth> haha
16:00 < MikeSeth> there you are
16:00 < MikeSeth> look zombies another recruit!
16:00 < MikeSeth> hello and welcome to the conspiracy
16:17 < v-dogg> have you already worked your magic or is conversion still in progress?
16:18 < MikeSeth> has it ever mattered?
16:19 < MikeSeth> i've lost two converts. one just disappeared, and another is a perl pervert
16:19 < v-dogg> :)
16:20 < Wombert> cld2 is new tho!
16:20 < Wombert> welcome
16:20 < Wombert> or is that the... perl... guy... :p
16:21 < v-dogg> haha
16:24 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I've just dragged him in
16:25 < Wombert> last q
16:25 < Wombert> if there are no rules for multi-field error messages
16:25 < MikeSeth> you guys indoctrinate him. I have to go home and deal with the root password shit
16:25 < Wombert> should FPF use the same rules as for normal error messages
16:25 < Wombert> OR
16:25 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I dont get it are you implementing multiple fields in FPF?
16:25 < Wombert> should FPF simply treat them like normal errors
16:25 < Wombert> no, MikeSeth, I'm adding insertion of error message into forms to FPF
16:25 < Wombert> the last piece missing in the puzzle
16:26 < MikeSeth> Wombert: oh. Well. You mean validation rules right?
16:26 < Wombert> but of course, while you may just want to add error messages to regular elements behind the element or whatever, your requirements for multi field errors (e.g. the message saying that those two password fields were not equal... or that the date given using the three dropdowns is out of range) may be different
16:26 < Wombert> MikeSeth: yes
16:27 < MikeSeth> Wombert: Since its a matter of input syntax, you can rely on lack of multiple rules to interpret the error as single, if I understand the question right.
16:28 < Wombert> yes
16:28 < Wombert> correct
16:28 < Wombert> put
16:28 < Wombert> but
16:28 < Wombert> should I
16:28 < MikeSeth> leave your enter key alone? :)
16:28 < Wombert> a) do another insertion run for the multi field errors, but with the same rules
16:28 < Wombert> b) include the multi field errors in the single errors list and do one run
16:28 < Wombert> there is a difference, since you can give a container to wrap all errors of one field
16:28 < Wombert> *field
16:30 < cld2> sorry, reading. my wife was giving me the business about the dog. Thanks for the welcome :)
16:30 < Wombert> :)
16:30 < MikeSeth> I suppose a) because you or someone else would probably want to apply custom transformation to the list of errors
16:30 < Wombert> where you from, cld2 
16:30 < cld2> vegas
16:30 < Wombert> I'm doing a) for now, MikeSeth 
16:30 < cld2> you?
16:30 < Wombert> Munich, Germany
16:31 < Wombert> which means I really need to leave now and hook up with some friends at the Oktoberfest
16:31 < MikeSeth> Wombert: makes more sense to me as well. If you lump the whole thing into one run it'd be a bitch to extend it
16:31 < Wombert> I'm sure MikeSeth will take care of you just fine and help you see the light
16:31 < MikeSeth> as I have done to.. countless.. others
16:31 < Wombert> precisely
16:31 < cld2> have fun drinking. Im very jealous
16:32 < Wombert> I won't get drunk ;)
16:32 < MikeSeth> I'm going to get fucked up and ponder an application that's gonna make me monies
16:32 < Wombert> need to get some more work done later
16:32 < Wombert> that said, I'll be back in prolly two hours or so
16:32 < Wombert> I hope you guys are still around then because I
16:32 < MikeSeth> i gotta catch the cab, bb in like an hour or so
16:32 < Wombert> a) want to show that new feature to MikeSeth 
16:33 < MikeSeth> Wombert: would you object if I restructure the guidebook? the chapter layout is inconsistent, I cant seem to produce readable text
16:33 < Wombert> b) see the smile on cld2's face (well, not literally)
16:33 < Wombert> MikeSeth: sure, lets discuss this when we're both back
16:33 < MikeSeth> yessir
16:33 < MikeSeth> <3
16:33 < Wombert> cld2: can you hang in there until we are back
16:33 < MikeSeth> bb
16:33 < Wombert> I promise you it is going to be worth the wait
16:33  * MikeSeth &
16:33 < Wombert> look around yourself until then when you like
16:33 < cld2> Wombert: for sure
16:33 < cld2> im here all day
16:33 < Wombert> and please, be our guest
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16:34 < Wombert> there's bavarian beer in the fridge
16:34 < cld2> I "work from home"  = get paid to fart around
16:34 < Wombert> just make sure you use branches/0.11 if you check out straight from svn
16:34 < Wombert> cool
16:34 < Wombert> laters
16:34 < cld2> have fun
16:34 < cld2> im going to start reading
16:35 < malax> Wombert: Did you now there is a Oktoberfest in World of Warcraft tomorrow? *giggles*
16:35 < Wombert> dear god
16:35 < Wombert> cld2: start with the intro
16:35 < Wombert> it's mostly PR blah blah but... stilll :p
16:35 < Wombert> and the sample app from SVN
16:35 < cld2> yeah, doing so
16:35 < Wombert> err, well, not necessarily SVN
16:35 < Wombert> cool
16:35 < cld2> can I get it all from pear
16:35 < cld2> or do I need svn?
16:35 < Wombert> the others here can also help you in case of questions
16:35 < Wombert> of course
16:36 < Wombert> www.agavi.org has instructions, or the manual
16:36 < cld2> yup.
16:36 < Wombert> ace
16:36 < Wombert> laters ->
16:36 < cld2> im no good at svn, mercurial has ruined me
16:36 < cld2> bye
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17:28 < cld2> is it possible that agavi is going to be way to complicated for me. Im still newish to php
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17:39 < MikeSeth> FAILURE
17:39 < MikeSeth> it's what's for dinner!
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17:59 < _cheerios> Page not Found - We are sorry! Your IP address is monitored and we have decided you have used our website improperly. Your access is denied for 3 hours. ...
17:59 < _cheerios> www.tabularasa.com/ - 26k - Cached - Similar pages - Note this
18:06 < cld2> MikeSeth: is it possible that agavi is going to be to complicated for me. Im still newish to php and Im still trying to 100% wrap my head around OOP I have the majority of logic for my site coded and Im using a few objects like mdb2 and html_quickform and Im now at the point where I need to start doing the design and like I said id like to keep the html out of the php.
18:07 < cld2> but I still think im miss using OOP. as if im treating the objects like functions and still doing basicly procedural coding
18:10 < cld2> heh, sounds like therapy
18:25 < _cheerios> you will know when the time is right to use something else, like agavi. if you want to ship anything in schedule, use your current skillset.
18:26 < cld2> _cheerios: good call. ill have to put agavi on the back burner or maybe just schedule a do over a few months while I come up to speed
18:34 < _cheerios> i suggest following http://www.dzone.com/ to see how others solve the similar problems as you do. helps to give a hint on if the methods you use are outdated and when it's time to let go and move forward.
18:40 < cld2> _cheerios: thanks very much. 
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18:56 < E_mE> huomenta-noon
18:59 < _cheerios> is Heroes s2 good?
19:17 < E_mE> Heroes?
19:17 < E_mE> Saxondale is good ;)
19:30 < E_mE> what are peoples opinions on moving from XHTML strict to Transitional?
19:39 < impl> I don't see any reason to
19:39 < impl> strict is nice
19:41 < E_mE> its just the iframe would be nice
19:42 < E_mE> but ive found digitarald.d's uploading code
20:21 < Wombert> re
20:24 < Wombert> impl: you agree to that
20:24 < impl> mm?
20:30 < Wombert> impl: error_messages
20:30 < Wombert> field_error_messages
20:30 < Wombert> multi_field_error_messages
20:30 < Wombert> each optional, each a fallback for the preceding
20:31 < Wombert> err, following
20:31 < Wombert> :p
20:31 < impl> I guess so
20:31 < Wombert> so you can use only error_messages, but its used for the "global" errors, as well as per element errors (with the form and the element as the context node, respectively)
20:31 < Wombert> sounds okay?
20:32 < impl> Yeah
20:32 < impl> (I really think that FPF should be split into multiple filters, probably, but as for the best way to do such a thing... agh. Beats me.)
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20:36 < ttj> Heh, they made me an R&D Specialist. :P
20:36 < Wombert> is that... good?
20:36 < ttj> I don't have anything to do with R&D... :P
20:37 < Wombert> hmh
20:37 < Wombert> does that mean more money?
20:37 < Wombert> can you afford that S5 now? :p
20:37 < ttj> But at least my salary is up 62% YoY.
20:37 < Wombert> 62%?
20:37 < Wombert> dude
20:38 < Wombert> that does sound like you can afford an S5 now :p
20:38 < ttj> Nope. :P
20:38 < Wombert> an A5? :p
20:38 < ttj> It has more to do with the fact that my salary a year back was very shitty. :P
20:38 < Wombert> oh :p
20:39 < ttj> But I'm satisfied. It's not the big income that counts but instead the fact that you keep your costs down. :-)
20:41 < E_mE> Wombert: will agavi automatically tell you if a file has an error when uploaded?
20:41 < Wombert> that's good
20:43 < Wombert> mh
20:43 < Wombert> I ate 300 grams of roasted almonds today
20:43 < Wombert> :S
20:44 < ttj> I can't remember what I ate.
20:44 < ttj> A pizza, at least.
20:44 < ttj> Cute waitress, nice smile.
20:44 < E_mE> i had Hot Thai prawn and pineapple curry
20:44  * E_mE is inlove with hot food!
20:45 < ttj> Anyway, need to hit the sack.
20:45 < ttj> Later.
20:45 < CIA-11> david * r2106 /branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php: 
20:45 < CIA-11> larger refactoring of FPF to clean up some parts, and ability to insert
20:45 < CIA-11> validation error messages into the form - for "normal" field errors, multi field
20:45 < CIA-11> errors, and generic errors (i.e. those that did not have a matching field in the
20:45 < CIA-11> form, or those that could not be inserted into the document because no xpath
20:45 < CIA-11> rule matched), each also acts as a fallback for the following. docs and samples
20:45 < Wombert> I need to leave teh office
20:45 < CIA-11> to follow. closes #303
20:45 < Wombert> go home
20:46 < Wombert> watch prison break and heroes (zomg!)
20:46 < Wombert> and hit the sack
20:46 < E_mE> have good evening all
20:54 < Wombert> yup
20:54 < Wombert> train ->
20:55 < E_mE> wombert... Train :o
20:56 < E_mE> what about your fast zippy cars ;)
20:57 < Wombert> the engine does not get warm before I arrive at the office
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20:58 < Wombert> or if it does, it means being stuck in traffic forever
20:58 < Wombert> in either case, it is not healthy for the car
20:58 < Wombert> plus there are no parking spaces here
20:58 < Wombert> so I use the pretty good public transport
20:58 < Wombert> anyway
20:58 < Wombert> laters
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22:22 < Wombert> hai
22:26 < Wombert> so
22:26 < Wombert> who tried out that new FPF feature already :)
22:26 < Wombert> MrJeep maybe? :)
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05:32 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:22 < _cheerios> huomenta <3<3
07:26 < _cheerios> Short story: Chrylser had been trying to unify its various systems and subsystems for payroll and had failed and failed. Eventually, a group of consultants were brought in who had invented a particular agile technique, extreme-programming. Of course, the project failed, but that didn't keep the consultants from spreading the XP word throughout the world.
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07:57 < RossC0> huomenta!
08:12 < _cheerios> yo :)
08:14 < RossC0> word up _cheerios
08:14 < _cheerios> :)
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09:31 < E_mE> huomenta!
10:03 < _cheerios> RossC0, with capistrano, can you have it run tests and only deploy if the test ran ok?
10:04 < RossC0> _cheerios: if you script it sure
10:04 < RossC0> but just pre deployment probably isn't the best time to check if your app works!
10:05 < RossC0> probably best to CI instead
10:05 < _cheerios> CI?
10:05 < RossC0> so run tests after checkin
10:05 < RossC0> Continuous Integration
10:23 < _cheerios> with post-commit hooks added to run tests/stuff, do you have the results emailed when ready, or?
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11:11 < E_mE> im all cool now ;) I'm sitting on a ball instead of a chair ;) ... 
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11:27 < _cheerios> doctrine can't export decimal columns? gah
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12:18 < _cheerios> any ideas why on my libs/agavi/ dir, which i deleted and then re-added, causes problems (files can't be found / config errors) when loading?
12:28 < RossC0> _cheerios: did you reload the same version?
12:28 < RossC0> and did you clear the cache?
12:28 < _cheerios> a slightly newer one, yep
12:28 < RossC0> ok what are ze errors?
12:29 < _cheerios> Configuration file "/code/fr/app/config/factories.xml" specifies unknown class
12:29 < _cheerios> "AgaviWebRequest" for entry "request"
12:29 < _cheerios> i checked the created configs, they look fine. I have the same agavi installation in an external dir, and using that, no errors.
12:31 < RossC0> no AgaviWebRequest?
12:33 < _cheerios> the file is there, but that's the error
12:37 < RossC0> this the latest version of Agavi?
12:37 < _cheerios> i've had this errors before, when i do the same thing.
12:38 < RossC0> _cheerios: without debugging your code I'm not sure I can help
12:38 < shoan> RossC0: hey, is work on the testing branch stalled?
12:39 < _cheerios> RossC0, I don't think it's a code problem. Linux related, unless it's some Agavi loader bug.
12:39 < RossC0> hmm _cheerios maybe pastie your factories.xml
12:39 < RossC0> shoan: yeah haven't had time to add more tests
12:40 < RossC0> actually using Watir to test the system via ze browser
12:41 < shoan> RossC0: are there any complete tests in the branch?
12:41 < shoan> i looked around and most were marked incomplete
12:41 < _cheerios> http://p.caboo.se/private/zv2dxazdimxqg6dehujdvq
12:42 < RossC0> ah no mine are with the sample app
12:42 < RossC0> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/ross-testing/samples/tests/app/modules/Default/functional/LoginTest.php
12:44 < RossC0> _cheerios: Same order as mine
12:45 < RossC0> and libs/agavi is in the path
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12:45 < RossC0> only diff is mine doesn't have any params
12:46 < _cheerios> i know. it makes no sense. i wonder if it has to do with HDD mounting settings? *shrug* Here's the full error: http://p.caboo.se/private/j2yiyqraad4ziapoftim1q
12:46 < _cheerios> probably won't be around if I reboot. Just messes up with devvin'.
12:47 < RossC0> _cheerios: try adding that class to your autoload.xml and see if that catches it
12:49 < _cheerios> the cache updates correctly, but it can't find it
12:49 < _cheerios> 'AgaviWebRequest' => '/code/fr/libs/agavi/request/AgaviWebRequest.class.php',
12:53 < RossC0> restart apache?
12:53 < Wombert> RossC0: new FPF feature is checked in
12:54 < RossC0> new features?
12:54 < Wombert> the params are "error_messages", "field_error_messages" and "multi_field_error_messages"
12:54 < Wombert> each a fallback for the following one
12:54 < Wombert> so you can put everything in just "error_messages" but then your xpath needs to check if you got a <form> element or something else
12:54 < _cheerios> RossC0, ace. It was apache caching the filepaths. Fixed.
12:57 < RossC0> cool 
12:57 < RossC0> Wombert: excellent - so no changes needed for my configs
12:57 < RossC0> now need to find a multi field error
13:00 < Wombert> RossC0: I recommend you set up field_error_messages as well
13:01 < shoan> _cheerios: are you using apc?
13:01 < Wombert> because if there is an error in the vm that has no corresponding element, because you set it by hand with zomg as name or so, it's gonna use the form as the context node when inserting that, and not an element
13:01 < _cheerios> shoan, yes
13:01 < RossC0> ok cool field_error_message
13:01 < Wombert> RossC0: do you have an equals validator
13:01 < RossC0> I ditched it
13:01 < Wombert> RossC0: yes but keep error_messages
13:01 < shoan> _cheerios: i faced similar probs with apc on
13:01 < Wombert> and mind you, field_error_messages
13:02 < shoan> each rebuild required a server restart
13:02 < Wombert> RossC0: to test that, "break" the xpath of field_error_messages
13:02 < Wombert> RossC0: do you have... mmmh... do you have a validator with more than one arg
13:02 < RossC0> ok Wombert - just got to fix this last Watir test and I'll look into
13:02 < Wombert> or a datetime validator with dropdowns
13:03 < RossC0> oww example?
13:03 < RossC0> could use that one
13:03 < RossC0> ;)
13:03 < Wombert> datetime?
13:03 < RossC0> Wombert: I'll update in an hour and report back then!
13:03 < RossC0> bbl
13:03 < Wombert> k
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13:39 < E_mE> i think ive just tasted the most disgusting coffee of all time
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15:31 < E_mE> how do i prevent the following error: -- The view "Default_LoginInputView" ddoes not implement an "ExecuteJson()" method to serve the output type "Json", and the base view "ProjectBaseView does not implement an "executeJson" method to handle the situation.  --
15:31 < E_mE> it appears that my session has ended and wont let me perform it due to me not being logged in... but how can i direct it to the login?
15:32 < RossC0> E_mE add handlers for LoginInputView
15:33 < E_mE> and automatically redirect to the normal method?
15:33 < Wombert> well you have to return something  in the ajax an read that and then on the client show a login box or whatever
15:33 < Wombert> that stuff is why I hate ajax apps so much
15:33 < Wombert> you re(!)do half of the app logic on the client side
15:34 < RossC0> i.e. {'redirect': url}
15:34 < E_mE> ahhh okay.. ill copy that ..
15:35 < E_mE> thank you :)
15:36 < RossC0> then in your js if it fails / or returns redirect then redirect the page
15:36 < RossC0> bbl
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15:54  * E_mE Hugs Agavi + JSON
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16:26 < E_mE> bus time! bye
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17:52  * Wombert pokes MikeSeth 
17:52 < Wombert> you there?
18:03 < _cheerios> Wombert, did you watch Heroes S0201? Is S2 any good?
18:03 < Wombert> so far... not really
18:04 < Wombert> I think its starting slow
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18:04 < Wombert> should pick up momentum soon tho
18:04 < Wombert> prison break is much better :>
18:04 < E_mE> evening all
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18:19 < RossC0> what-o
18:33 < E_mE> evening RossC0
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19:04 < _cheerios> days go by so quickly lately
19:07 < _cheerios> yesterday was friday, before that monday. now it is wednesday evening.
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19:43 < _cheerios> If you are a reader of TechCrunch, Read/WriteWeb, or ZDNet you may already know that there is a preview of the next version of del.icio.us. What you might not know is that the next version of Delicious is built with symfony.
19:44 < _cheerios> pretty big catch: http://www.symfony-project.com/blog/2007/10/02/delicious-preview-built-with-symfony
19:45 < _cheerios> RossC0, can we use delicious anymore knowing this? ;)
19:46 < RossC0> lol
20:04 < Wombert> _cheerios: rest assured
20:04 < Wombert> much cooler sites were and are built with Agavi
20:05 < _cheerios> but, but, that's like one of my favorite sites on the whole internet
20:05 < _cheerios> and, now, it's... tainted
20:07 < Wombert> write your own w/ agavi
20:07 < Wombert> shouldn't take more than a day :p
20:07 < Wombert> + doctrine...
20:07 < Wombert> piece of cake
20:14  * RossC0 looking forward to new del.icio.us
20:14 < RossC0> not sure about the symfony melarky - but theres deflected glory - they use so good bits of Agavi ;)
20:15 < RossC0> right night all
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20:23 < _cheerios> “When I worked at Microsoft I heard this over and over and over again from various engineers and program managers who STILL haven’t competed effectively with WordPress, Flickr, Skype, YouTube, or any of the other things over the years I’ve heard this “we can build that in a few weeks” kind of arrogant attitude attached to.”
20:49 < Wombert> _cheerios: but you would agree that there is a substantial difference in complexity between delicious and wordpress/flickr/skype/youtube
20:54 < _cheerios> without knowing skype at all, thus leaving it out of this, I don't see delicious being much less complex than say how Flickr was some years back. By now they've added so much cool javascript stuff, that it's hard to talk about their featureset without writing a Bible! Basic YouTube, complex? Not really. Wordpress? *shrug* I went blind looking at the code.
20:55 < Wombert> sure its complex
20:55 < Wombert> much more
20:55 < Wombert> youtube... channels
20:55 < Wombert> all them tags and the search
20:55 < Wombert> ratings
20:55 < Wombert> external players
20:55 < Wombert> content delivery
20:55 < Wombert> comments
20:55 < Wombert> user management
20:56 < _cheerios> Bleh. Lets talk about something more interesting. Silence was better. :)
21:12 < Wombert> yes
21:13 < Wombert> maybe this
21:13 < Wombert> I just realized I'm getting ill
21:13 < Wombert> :<
21:13 < Wombert> will have a big ass cold tomorrow
21:27 < CIA-11> david * r2107 /branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php: added missing phpdocs
21:41 < _cheerios> go to sleep then
21:49 < _cheerios> ^ can any self-respecting programmer follow such? ;)
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22:23  * MikeSeth appears
22:32 < Wombert> hai
22:33 < Wombert> I'd like to implement something tomorrow that would get rid of the request lock barf thing
22:33 < Wombert> should work as far as I can tell
22:33 < Wombert> the idea is that the controller has a pointer to the global request data and thus can pass it to the container it creates
22:34 < Wombert> that would also mean (I think) that a container can run without external interference from a to z
22:34 < Wombert> and we need to figure sth out for http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/544
22:35  * Wombert pokes MikeSeth 
23:02  * MikeSeth smacks Wombert 
23:02 < MikeSeth> damn you to hell, what was I telling you to do all along?!
23:03 < MikeSeth> the whole request locking thing is wrong, it shouldnt be there
23:06 < MikeSeth> "I've just looked at the code and now I remember my original point S
23:06 < Wombert> no no
23:06 < Wombert> the request is still gonna be locked
23:06 < MikeSeth> yes
23:07 < Wombert> but you can create containers with the rd without it bar(k|f)ing at you
23:07 < Wombert> http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2007/02/natural-selection-1.php you'll love this
23:07 < MikeSeth> what I am trying to say is
23:08 < MikeSeth> the request should not be locked globally. it's inconsistent because some things (like the execution filter) need it to start an action
23:10 < Wombert> well
23:10 < Wombert> that would not be necessary anymore then
23:11 < MikeSeth> is there an actual reason to make the global request object globally available through the context?
23:12 < MikeSeth> besides, I can't agree that all actions need to be able to be created with the global request parameters. At least, I can't see the use case.
23:14 < Wombert> yes sure, the FPF needs it for instance
23:14 < Wombert> well
23:14 < MikeSeth> the FPF executes outside actions/views/models
23:14 < Wombert> that slot in the sidebar that reads a cookie... etc
23:15 < Wombert> yes, but it still needs the global rd
23:15 < Wombert> tat
23:15 < Wombert> that's why we lock it down otherwise ;)
23:15 < MikeSeth> the problem with locking is that you either flip the lock every time or leave it on for the most part.. running into stupid things like barf lock when you spawn your own actions
23:16 < MikeSeth> my gut tells me this is a problem with the architecture
23:16 < MikeSeth> something doesnt fit
23:18 < MikeSeth> if you copy the ref to the rd in the container, you're effectively going around the lock, aren't you?
23:20 < Wombert> nah, into the controller
23:21 < Wombert> its a private property
23:21 < Wombert> so people still cannot access it
23:21 < MikeSeth> so you allow the execution filter to create actions without tripping the lock?
23:21 < Wombert> it's an architectural problem yes
23:21 < Wombert> but not one we can solve
23:21 < Wombert> yes, well, yes
23:22 < Wombert> like this
23:22 < Wombert> controller initialize grabs a copy of the rd
23:22 < Wombert> actually, startup would
23:22 < MikeSeth> well then in principle, the problem is that some code should be able to access the global rd unconditionally
23:22 < MikeSeth> and some code shouldn't
23:22 < MikeSeth> and some should in some cases
23:22 < Wombert> then http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/controller/AgaviController.class.php#L129
23:22 < Wombert> we give the rd to the container
23:23 < Wombert> because right now the container grabs the rd from the request...
23:23 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/controller/AgaviExecutionContainer.class.php#L298 here
23:25 < Wombert> for v2 were gonna make it all different
23:25 < Wombert> no doubt
23:25 < Wombert> but for now, we gotta solve the problem as best as we cfan
23:25 < Wombert> can
23:26 < Wombert> I think we could then lock down the request in the dispatch filter
23:26 < Wombert> and unlock it afterwards
23:33 < MikeSeth> I think I need to meditate on this. It should be possible to solve this without breaking existing code but eliminating the logical inconsistency
23:33 < MikeSeth> by the way
23:33 < MikeSeth> can validators validate files and cookies as well?
23:34 < MikeSeth> uploaded files I mean
23:36 < Wombert> yes
23:36 < Wombert> everything is safe to use
23:36 < Wombert> even http headers
23:37 < Wombert> if you want to read them, you need to validate them
23:37 < Wombert> that's why I am so anal about this request lock. it really provides good safety
23:37 < Wombert> not like some other frameworks... sfXssFilter and stuff
23:37 < MikeSeth> I swear to dog, I can feel the solution on the tip of my tongue but I can't reach it
23:38 < MikeSeth> you know what David?
23:38 < MikeSeth> tainting
23:38 < MikeSeth> mandatory validation
23:39 < MikeSeth> unless you validate specific request data item, you can't access it
23:39 < MikeSeth> no more locks, no more hacks
23:42 < Wombert> err
23:42 < Wombert> that's what we have right now ;)
23:43 < Wombert> but we still need the original, unvalidated data
23:43 < Wombert> for the FPF, for instance
23:44 < MikeSeth> huh? mandatory validation? I ca access unvalidate $rd items in any action
23:44 < MikeSeth> can*
23:44 < MikeSeth> unvalidated*
23:44 < Wombert> yes because we have three modes
23:45 < Wombert> one where you can always access all data
23:45 < Wombert> one where you can only access data if no validators exist (intended for development)
23:45 < Wombert> and the mode where you have to validate everything
23:45 < MikeSeth>  someone should document this then :D
23:48 < MikeSeth> I need to meditate on this.
23:49 < MikeSeth> it's really a great puzzle
--- Day changed Thu Oct 04 2007
00:02 < Wombert> hmm
00:02 < Wombert> well I think this rd/lock thing is relatively clear now
00:02 < Wombert> quesiton is
00:02 < Wombert> when do we validate now?
00:02 < Wombert> isSimple() must be called very early in the game
00:03 < Wombert> no chance we can validate by then
00:03 < Wombert> I want under all circumstances avoid that unsafe rd is available in action or view initialize methods
00:03 < Wombert> no problem either BUT
00:03 < Wombert> what if someone... needs it... there...
00:03 < Wombert> view... easy, validation has run then
00:03 < Wombert> we just need to lock
00:04 < Wombert> in case of action... maybe someone needs the data to determine the isSecure or getCredentials status
00:04 < Wombert> so should we move validation to happen earlier
00:04 < Wombert> i.e. before the security filter?
00:05 < MikeSeth> isSimple always seemed a bad idea to me
00:06 < MikeSeth> anyhow I just thought about this a little bit
00:06 < MikeSeth> the access is zoned distinctly into two types
00:06 < MikeSeth> actions and views, which should only be able to access validated parts of the rd
00:06 < MikeSeth> and everything else that should be able to access the unfiltered global request
00:07 < MikeSeth> in other words, if it has a validator associated, then asking for unvalidated item is a violation
00:07 < MikeSeth> in FPF however, there's no validator associated with the filter itself
00:08 < MikeSeth> and models, methinks, should not be able to get access to rd at all
00:08 < MikeSeth> conclusion: deglobalize the raw rd
00:09 < MikeSeth> actions and views should work with a proxy object formed after the validation
00:09 < MikeSeth> everything else is a special case. Alll code that isnt processing the rd directly should request an unsafe copy explicitly
00:10 < MikeSeth> maybe with a really long lanme function to deter people from using it casually
00:11 < MikeSeth> name*
00:12 < MikeSeth> by the way in simple actions validation and action execution is skipped, isnt it?
00:12 < MikeSeth> that implies a simple action should never access rd in first place
00:13 < Wombert> which is the case
00:14 < MikeSeth> by the way, arent isSecure(), getCredentials() etc supposed to be nonvolatile?
00:14 < MikeSeth> if thats the case, order of calling does not matter
00:15 < MikeSeth> if that isnt.. then it should be
00:15 < MikeSeth> this whole problem will go away if you stop thinking about it in terms of the global request object and its lock
00:16 < MikeSeth> any code inside actions and views should access a local copy - perhaps a proxy object that grants/denies access according to the validation rules, executing validators on the fly if necessary
00:16 < Wombert> yes
00:17 < Wombert> well that's all the case already
00:17 < Wombert> you mean
00:17 < Wombert> if they are supposed to be deterministic?
00:18 < MikeSeth> theyre always deterministic, unless you use a random number to decide their output
00:18 < MikeSeth> I meant that their output is independent of any other conditions
00:18 < MikeSeth> that is nonvolatile
00:20 < Wombert> ah well okay I guess that depends on what you take as "input" for those methods
00:21 < Wombert> I'd have used the arguments alone, which they don't have ;)
00:21 < Wombert> anyway, no
00:21 < Wombert> maybe you need to pull the credentials necessary to view an element from the database
00:22 < Wombert> or from 2am to 3am, the action is not secure
00:22 < Wombert> or or or or
00:22 < Wombert> :)
00:22 < MikeSeth> in such case, partial validation is needed
00:22 < Wombert> question is... does it hurt if
00:23 < Wombert> a) we move validation further up, so it is performed BEFORE the security filter runs
00:23 < Wombert> b) filters cannot access the global rd anymore
00:23 < MikeSeth> yes, validation is expensive and should not be performed until execute()
00:23 < MikeSeth> filters SHOULD be able to access the global rd
00:24 < MikeSeth> we're talking specifically about actions and views
00:24 < Wombert> but then you cannot use any request data to decide if an action is secure
00:24 < Wombert> well I'd just cover the entire execution flow of a container under the lock
00:24 < MikeSeth> you can if you have partial validation on the fly :)
00:25 < Wombert> partial... what... zomg!
00:25 < MikeSeth> well
00:25 < MikeSeth> basically
00:25 < MikeSeth> there is an illusion that the validation is needed in one case
00:25 < MikeSeth> but in fact it satisfied two different conditions
00:25 < MikeSeth> a) that action is never executed if any of its validators fail
00:26 < MikeSeth> b) that request parameters which werent validated successfully are not accessed by the application programmer
00:26 < MikeSeth> current implementation only solves a, and not b
00:26 < MikeSeth> at least if I ignore what you said about multiple access modes
00:27 < Wombert> it does solve b
00:27 < Wombert> that was one of the primary motivations of the new validaiton system
00:27 < Wombert> and in fact, its the sole reason why the request lock exists
00:27 < MikeSeth> but the request lock does NOT solve this problem
00:27 < MikeSeth> it merely impedes it
00:27 < Wombert> yes
00:28 < Wombert> I really appreciate your effort BUT
00:28 < Wombert> we cannot solve the problem now
00:28 < Wombert> we need to work around it
00:28 < Wombert> I just want to make it a little nicer and a little more consistent and a little safer and all without breaking BC
00:28 < MikeSeth> the proper solution would necessarily involve deglobalization of the request 
00:28  * Wombert hugs MikeSeth 
00:29 < Wombert> yes, but we cannot do that for 0.11 or 1.x
00:29 < MikeSeth> ...unless you use reflection to figure out who's calling $context->getRequest() :D
00:29 < MikeSeth> too ugly.
00:30 < MikeSeth> hmmm
00:30 < MikeSeth> we could work around it without breaking shit up!
00:30 < Wombert> why do action filters need unvalidated data
00:32 < MikeSeth> I think they do
00:32 < Wombert> for?
00:32 < MikeSeth> I can foresee a scenario in which an action filter relies on request data - perhaps even to preserver state
00:33 < MikeSeth> though.. with output types in mind, one has to be very specific about what are action filters supposed to do in first place
00:34 < MikeSeth> for instance, if I inject banners in an action filter, I better be able to look at the user's HTTP headers
00:34 < MikeSeth> how about this
00:34 < MikeSeth> the global request object receives an ability to limit access by a list of validation rules
00:35 < MikeSeth> it has one current list, and a stack of such lists 
00:35 < MikeSeth> when the execution filter initializes an action, it pushes th its validators to the request object's stack, making the current list active
00:36 < MikeSeth> the request object verifies, in case there's an active validation list, that all access to the data is subject to validators
00:36 < MikeSeth> when the action ends, the execution filter tells the request object to pop the validators
00:36 < Wombert> uuuuuuuuh
00:37 < MikeSeth> you break zero code, kill the lock, and the request object spits at you if you are inside an action trying to read something that wasnt validated
00:37 < MikeSeth> its exactly the same as barf lock, but inverse and moved to the request object itself :)
00:38 < MikeSeth> this is WAY better than flipping the locks, satisfies both conditions and requires no new data, only new code
00:39 < MikeSeth> plus im always afraid that something will go wrong and the lock would be flipped twice when it shouldnt, causing chaos
00:41 < MikeSeth> man this makes sense
00:41 < MikeSeth> the request object should be enforcing data integrity
00:42 < MikeSeth>  http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/544
00:42 < MikeSeth> this is terrible! even MORE special conditions for lowering or raising the lock
00:44  * MikeSeth pokes Wombert 
00:44 < MikeSeth> did I cause a race condition in your head? :(
00:46 < Wombert> its just not feasible, MikeSeth 
00:46 < Wombert> we cannot do this change now
00:47 < MikeSeth> Actually I think we can. Userland code should not break at all.
00:51 < Wombert> sure?
00:51 < Wombert> peoples validators?
00:52 < MikeSeth> well yeah
00:52 < MikeSeth> from the outside everything would stay the same
00:52 < MikeSeth> on the inside there would be some changes
00:52 < MikeSeth> first, the execution filter pushes and pops the action's validators into rd before/after the action respectively
00:53 < Wombert> which is ugly... we moved away from that stack nonsense because it is eeeeevil
00:53 < Wombert> but carry on
00:54 < MikeSeth> second, the request object itself validates access to the request data according to the currently active set of validation rules
00:54 < MikeSeth> the validation data is shared between the request object and the action's execution filter/container
00:55 < MikeSeth> so if the action tries to do something with the request data before the validators were fully ran, the request object should be able to run them partially and determine whether access is allowed
00:55 < MikeSeth> however, when the main execution stage begins and all validators are verified, the request object knows about it and doesnt perform validation again
00:56 < MikeSeth> this way the edge conditions for all validators or just some specific ones at different stages of execution don't collide; and objects requested with $context->getRequest() would still enforce the current restrictions
00:57 < MikeSeth> I also think that the stack system for rules is safe here because actions and views are the bottom of the execution chain; I cant think of anything an action does that would require it to undo the current validation rules imposed on the request object
00:58 < Wombert> what if I run an aciton inside an action
00:58 < Wombert> boom
00:58 < MikeSeth> no
00:58 < MikeSeth> the execution filter pushes a new set of validators on the stack
00:58 < MikeSeth> action ends
00:58 < MikeSeth> rules are popped
00:58 < Wombert> ewww
00:59 < MikeSeth> you're back in the parent actions with your own validators
00:59 < MikeSeth> either that, or deglobalize the request and work on proxy objects..
01:01 < MikeSeth> of course things would crash if for some reason an action/view code dives into Agavi code somewhere and Agavi code tries to read the global request while the action's rules are still on
01:01 < MikeSeth> ...or Context's getRequest() could blatantly lie and return a proxy object depending on whether the call was from userland or not
01:03 < MikeSeth> either way the point is
01:03 < MikeSeth> actions/views should not be able to access the global object directly
01:03 < MikeSeth> only a safe copy should be available
01:07 < Wombert> -> teh lock :>
01:08 < MikeSeth> well thats where the problem is
01:08 < MikeSeth> the lock is killing off the entire request object
01:08 < MikeSeth> but in this prolem's context, there's no request object, just individual request items
01:09 < MikeSeth> because of that, it is impossible to create a container when the object is locked, so then there's the barf lock
01:09 < Wombert> yes but my upcoming change is gonna fix that
01:10 < MikeSeth> yep, but it is still a fix
01:10 < MikeSeth> not a cardinal elimination of the problem
01:11 < MikeSeth> the lock would still cover the wrong parts and cause trouble in other places
01:15 < MikeSeth> by the way
01:15 < MikeSeth> Deep Forest = kickass dev. music
01:16 < Wombert> http://agileweb.org/post/13296224
01:19 < MikeSeth> ahaha awesome
01:27 < Wombert> mh
01:27 < Wombert> really need to hit the sack now
01:27 < Wombert> I'm really stupid for staying up so long
01:27 < Wombert> especially as I'm actually getting ill and I wanted to go to bed early to avoid that as much as I can :p
01:27 < Wombert> lets continue this tomorrow, MikeSeth 
01:28 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/ now tumbling btw
01:28 < Wombert> bai
01:28  * Wombert hugs MikeSeth 
01:29 < MikeSeth> <3
01:29 < MikeSeth> feel well
01:29 < MikeSeth> gg
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06:00 < _cheerios> huomenta
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06:12 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:59 < Whisller> jo :)
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07:12 < E_mE> huomenta!!  im off t o work :)
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07:28 < RossC0> huomenta!
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08:25 < E_mE> huomenta!
08:30 < RossC0> huomenta
08:33 < E_mE> RossC0:very interesting RSS feeds... i had a little fiddle around this morning...
08:35 < _cheerios> Definitions of fiddle on the Web:
08:35 < _cheerios>     * avoid (one's assigned duties); "The derelict soldier shirked his duties"
08:35 < _cheerios>     * commit fraud and steal from one's employer; "We found out that she had been fiddling for years"
08:35 < _cheerios>     * play the violin or fiddle 
08:36 < _cheerios> Doctrine pains me. They moves a method from table to collection and I get no response now. :|
08:37 < RossC0> E_mE: no worries - it'll keep your eye on the game
08:45 < E_mE> is there a way of deactiaving FPF on actions/views?
08:48 < _cheerios> before $table->getPrimaryKeys(), now it's new Collection($table)->getPrimaryKeys(), which returns zip. *grr*
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08:58 < v-dogg> E_mE: $req->setAttribute('populate', false, 'org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter');
08:59 < E_mE> thanx v-dogg
09:00 < E_mE> im getting exceptions saying tha bull and copy are not defined
09:00 < v-dogg> and if you use strict MVC separation you'll do that in the view
09:00 < E_mE> is this the case where i need to use numbers instead of words? like &123;
09:01 < v-dogg> yup
09:01 < v-dogg> or utf-8
09:01 < E_mE> or can i define it somewhere?
09:01 < E_mE> how do i declare utf-8?
09:02 < v-dogg> make all your data (php files and db data utf-8) and send correct headers and http meta
09:03 < E_mE> are there tools to do this?
09:03 < v-dogg> yes but I don't know anything about them
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09:17 < E_mE> what does line 2: Start Tag expected, "<" not found mean???
09:17 < v-dogg> means your html is invalid :)
09:18 < _cheerios> #html
09:18 < RossC0> E_mE: turn off FPF and then Validate the Source - in FF its ctrl+A
09:20 < E_mE> thats select all RossC0 hehe
09:20 < E_mE> you mean copy it to w3c validator
09:20 < RossC0> ctrl+shift+A
09:21 < RossC0> :-[
09:21 < E_mE> do you have a particular tool installed?
09:22 < E_mE> the web developer one im thinking
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09:27 < E_mE> one bastard <br /> tag was messing it up :S
09:30 < E_mE> still getting the error with FPF though
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10:39 < v-dogg> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/579
10:43 < RossC0> v-dogg: so what is the default value for: $userParameters['test'] in the callback?
10:45 < RossC0> or does: $this->context->getRouting()->gen('test'); work without the isset in the callback and test is not set?
10:51 < v-dogg> $this->context->getRouting()->gen('test'); always generates /foo (no optional params)
10:51 < v-dogg> even when the cb only does $userParameters['test'] = 'automatic';
10:52 < v-dogg> but $this->context->getRouting()->gen('test', array('test'=>'manual')); generates /automatic/foo if the cb sets the parameter (isset test ignored)
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11:27 < v-dogg> uh.. reading routing::gen() source is not easy :)
11:28 < v-dogg> I found the problem but I have no idea how to fix it
11:28 < v-dogg> kaooooos!
11:31 < E_mE> i got a resoultion to the problem i was having with the FPF
11:31 < E_mE> using &amp;bull; instead of &bull;
11:32 < v-dogg> woot?
11:32 < E_mE> doing &amp;bull; has stopped allowed it to work
11:32 < v-dogg> if that works (a bullet char is shown in your browser) your browser is acting silly
11:33 < E_mE> v-dogg: why do you have to be so right =P 
11:33 < E_mE> it now says &copy;
11:33 < v-dogg> like it should :)
11:34  * E_mE smashes head agaisnt the wall
11:35 < v-dogg> there are two fpf config parameters (<parameter name="parse_xhtml_as_xml">false</parameter> and <parameter name="dom_resolve_externals">true</parameter>) but I'm not going to tell you about them because they might have unwanted side-effects
11:36 < v-dogg> I just fixed my routing callback issue. wonder what I broke at the same time :)
11:40 < E_mE> nah i dont want to stop FPF from behaving properly ;)
11:41 < v-dogg> then utf-8 is the easiest way
11:42 < v-dogg> what do you use now? some latin/iso8859 variant ?
11:44 < _cheerios> New study says one should sleep 6,5-8,5hrs/day (no less, no more) to not cut one's odds to die by 25% compared to those whom sleep proper.
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11:52 < Wombert> friggen frigg
11:52 < Wombert> just a little ill but
11:52 < Wombert> BIG ASS HEADACHE
11:52 < Wombert> BOOOOOH
11:52 < Wombert> I HATE IT
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12:18 < v-dogg> buhuuu..... I didn't fix the problem
12:18  * v-dogg sobs
12:18 < v-dogg> I just broke it even more
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12:20 < _cheerios> :D
12:30 < Wombert> E_mE: don't use entities
12:30 < Wombert> I hope you are using UTF-8
12:30 < Wombert> then you can just insert literal copyright and bullet characters into your code
12:31 < Wombert> alternatively, use numeric entity codes
12:31 < Wombert> &copy; etc are only defined in HTML, not in XML, so to know what &copy; means, FPF would need to load the HTML DTD and validate the document against it, which is slow
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12:33 < Wombert> who of you guys has the time to test a patch for me
12:33 < Wombert> it changes the way the request data is given to a container
12:34 < Wombert> there should not be any side effects for anyone, but still...
12:34 < Wombert> I made some stuff protected and some stuff private and some stuff final in the process
12:38 < v-dogg> oh, feck.
12:39 < v-dogg> I can't add normal get params in the callback
12:39 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/103655
12:40 < E_mE> if i want to create an output type that can be a image/jpg or image/png how would i go about this... im creating a action/view which will display the image a user has uploaded
12:40 < Wombert> pokes v-dogg RossC0 MikeSeth MrJeep 
12:40 < E_mE> or will i need to test for image format and return the required format?
12:40 < Wombert> does any of you guys have a custom request implementation
12:40 < Wombert> where you fiddle with request data
12:41 < RossC0> Wombert: would do but have meeting at 2
12:41 < Wombert> kay
12:43 < E_mE> or do i need to setup the output_type in the action?
12:43 < Wombert> E_mE: no
12:44 < Wombert> in the routing rule, use output_type="asdksad"
12:44 < E_mE> but what i the image is varied?
12:44 < E_mE> a jpg or png could be uploaded
12:44 < Wombert> well the file has an extension right? :p
12:45 < E_mE> ah yes... of course.. i could do a regex in the routing :D
12:45 < Wombert> <route pattern="^/images/(id:\d+).(type:(png|jpg))$" module="..." action="..." output_type="image_${type}" />
12:45 < Wombert> WUAHAHAHAH
12:45  * Wombert hugs Agavi
12:46 < E_mE> what did you mean by don't use entities earlier
12:46 < E_mE> :o Wombert you master 
12:46 < Wombert> don't use &copy;
12:46 < Wombert> use the literal copyright character
12:46 < Wombert> or use the numeric form
12:46 < Wombert> &#160; instead of &amp; for example
12:46 < E_mE> ive converted to numeric version now :)
12:46 < Wombert> k
12:48 < v-dogg> 160 is nbsp
12:48 < E_mE> Wombert: i can put all the executePng() executeJpg() into my one TempImageImageView.class.php ??
12:48 < Wombert> yes of course
12:48 < Wombert> but mind you
12:48 < Wombert> v-dogg: right, sorry
12:49 < Wombert> I think an output type "image" would do just fine as well
12:49 < Wombert> and then you set the content type header by hand
12:49 < Wombert> after all, your likely doing the same sutff for all images
12:49 < Wombert> you guys all saw http://agileweb.org/post/13296224 right?
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12:54 < _cheerios> *g*
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13:31 < MikeSeth> nomnomnom
13:40 < Wombert> haha MikeSeth 
13:40 < Wombert> BUKKIT
13:40 < Wombert> :(
13:40 < Wombert> I finally figured out why the images inthe store don't load
13:40 < Wombert> now that that is sorted
13:40 < Wombert> I think I'll buy at least one WOOT poster
13:41 < E_mE> heheeh thats great 
13:43 < Wombert> but I'd much prefer a NOMNOMNOM mug :(
13:46 < MikeSeth> there is a mug?
13:47 < Wombert> http://www.cafepress.com/goopymart/2060886
13:47 < Wombert> if the images dontload
13:47 < Wombert> open one of them and accept the cert
13:48 < MikeSeth> theres no nomnomnom mug :(
13:48 < Wombert> yeah :(
13:48 < Wombert> but three new imgages
13:48 < Wombert> zomg
13:48 < Wombert> you saw them right
13:48 < MikeSeth> yep
13:48 < Wombert> I even blogz0red them! http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14097755
13:48 < Wombert> oh
13:48 < Wombert> okay :>
13:49 < MikeSeth> isnt this the same blpog engine as Ross uses?
13:49 < Wombert> it is
13:49 < Wombert> it's hosted
13:49 < Wombert> www.tumblr.com
13:49 < Wombert> start your own!
13:49 < Wombert> :)
13:49 < Wombert> you can even point your own domain to it
13:50 < Wombert> so ace
13:50 < MikeSeth> blog.mikeseth.com :D
13:50 < Wombert> basecamp haven't been  able to do that in... three? years
13:50 < Wombert> but then, they don't use agavi :p
13:51 < Wombert> is that wordpress?
13:51 < Wombert> it looks appaling :/
13:51 < Wombert> it it haz index.php in teh url zomg!
13:51 < Wombert> :>>
14:03 < Wombert> MikeSeth: akdfhjaSF
14:03 < Wombert> can you try http://pastie.caboo.se/103655 plz kthxbai
14:09 < MikeSeth> sec plz
14:09 < MikeSeth> way away with phriends
14:10 < MikeSeth> wait
14:11 < MikeSeth> $context->getRequest()->getRequestData() returns a *clone* of the globla rd, right?!
14:11 < Wombert> no
14:11 < Wombert> it returns teh global rd
14:11 < Wombert> the containers each have a clone
14:11 < Wombert> oh wait xD
14:11 < Wombert> haha
14:12 < MikeSeth> if you return clones, then filters etc wont be able to communicate through the request cuz they'd be writing into a private copy of rd
14:12 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/103701
14:13 < Wombert> you communicate via attributes on the request
14:13 < Wombert> we're talking about the request's request data holder object
14:13 < Wombert> only that is locked and stuff
14:14 < MikeSeth> aha
14:14 < Wombert> the patch does not change the behavior, it only changes the way the containers get the global request data holder, and eliminates the request lock exception when you try to access global data
14:14 < Wombert> err... when you create a new container and execute it in your code
14:14 < Wombert> right now, there also is no exception anymore when the request is locked; it always returns an empty RDH in that case
14:15 < MikeSeth> oh so basically you're just screening the requestData oject itself, not its parent request object?
14:16 < Wombert> yes
14:16 < Wombert> always been like that
14:18 < Wombert> I think... mmh
14:18 < Wombert> we should throw the exception
14:18 < Wombert> since now the only case where Request::getRequestData() is called is in userland code
14:18 < Wombert> and userland code can simply try{}
14:18 < Wombert> should there really be the case where you need to try to call it
14:18 < Wombert> which I cannot imagine
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14:18 < Wombert> and it gives users that certain guidance again
14:19 < MikeSeth> in Actions/Views/Models, no. 
14:19 < MikeSeth> there should be no reason for them whatsoever to touch the global request. If such kind of funcitonality is required it must be done in filters
14:20 < MikeSeth> though isnt that a little bit harsh..
14:21 < Wombert> if you ask me, the dispatch filter should lock down the request and unlock afterwards
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14:24 < MikeSeth> this proves to be an interesting trip
14:24 < MikeSeth> I want to read more source code, bb
14:27 < MikeSeth> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviDispatchFilter.class.php#L18
14:27 < MikeSeth> wrong comment crept in, left over from a template
14:27 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/103710 new patch
14:28 < E_mE> ajax is a fecking arse to debug when uploading images!!!
14:29 < MikeSeth> E_mE: you're welcome!
14:29 < MikeSeth> Wombert: point by point
14:30 < E_mE> 			The View &quot;foodandherbs_UploadImageInputView&quot; does not implement an &quot;executeJson()&quot
14:30 < E_mE> ; method to serve the Output Type &quot;json&quot;, and the base View &quot;ProjectBaseView&quot; does
14:30 < E_mE>  not implement an &quot;executeJson()&quot; method to handle this situation
14:30 < MikeSeth> Controller gets an instance of the global request - OK
14:30 < E_mE> i keep getting that, but im not calling Input
14:30 < Wombert> a pointer, yes, MikeSeth 
14:30 < E_mE> im calling Json on the return
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14:31 < v-dogg> E_mE: I'm guessing you only have executeWrite defined and your request is GET
14:31 < MikeSeth> Wombert: uhhh I cant read it as a patch.. need to read more source code
14:32 < MikeSeth> E_mE: on the return of what?
14:32 < v-dogg> E_mE: you return 'Json' from the action?
14:32 < E_mE> its a POST request
14:33 < E_mE> yes v-dogg
14:33 < MikeSeth> E_mE: post => executeWrite()
14:33 < E_mE> ill pastebin
14:34 < E_mE> http://www.pastebin.ca/725542
14:34 < MikeSeth> Wombert: 
14:34 < MikeSeth> -        public function initialize(AgaviContext $context, array $parameters = array())
14:34 < MikeSeth> +        public function initialize(AgaviContext $context, AgaviRequestDataHolder $rd, array $parameters = array())
14:34 < MikeSeth>  in ExecutionContainer
14:34 < MikeSeth> wouldn't that break existing code?
14:35  * MikeSeth smacks E_mE 
14:35 < MikeSeth> you're missing the point!
14:35  * MikeSeth hugs E_mE 
14:36 < MikeSeth> E_mE: what you return from the action's execute*() method is the name of the view that should be called
14:36 < E_mE> yes im aware of that
14:36 < MikeSeth> And you have a view named Json?
14:36 < E_mE> but it keeps trying to get uploadImageInputView
14:36 < E_mE> yes
14:36 < MikeSeth> but json should only be an output type
14:37 < MikeSeth> you implement it as executeJson() method in the view
14:37 < E_mE> its weird because i do get json responses but i also get that error 
14:37 < v-dogg> E_mE: and you are _sure_ it is a POST request?
14:37 < v-dogg> I bet it isn't 
14:37 < E_mE> public function executeJson(AgaviRequestDataHolder $rd)
14:37 < E_mE> 	{
14:37 < E_mE> 			$imageName = $this->getAttribute('imageName');
14:37 < E_mE> 			
14:37 < E_mE> 			$this->getContainer()->getResponse()->setContent(json_encode($imageName));
14:37 < E_mE> 	}
14:37 < Wombert> do you have custom execution containers, MikeSeth? :p
14:37 < E_mE> ill pastebin v-dogg
14:38 < Wombert> but yes, I'd move that to a separate method
14:38 < Wombert> i.e. setRequestData()
14:38 < MikeSeth> Wombert: no, but I use them in some cases. I encapsulate my graph generation actions with it
14:38 < Wombert> MikeSeth: and you are not doing $controller->createExcecutionContainer() ????
14:38 < Wombert> zomg!
14:38  * Wombert smacks MikeSeth 
14:38 < E_mE> http://www.pastebin.ca/725547
14:38 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I know I do
14:38 < MikeSeth> Wombert: heh
14:38  * MikeSeth hugs Wombert 
14:39 < E_mE> ah lots of love around... *hugs all*
14:39 < MikeSeth> E_mE: OUCH MY EYES
14:39 < MikeSeth> javascript :<
14:39 < MikeSeth> E_mE: again, why do you have a UploadImageJsonView?
14:39 < E_mE> yes
14:39 < v-dogg> E_mE: just to humor me, put "throw new Exception('I SAID POST!')" in to your executeRead()
14:40 < E_mE> ok
14:40 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: it's funny how we are looking at two radically different aspects of the same code
14:40 < MikeSeth> you're debugging it in your mind, and I am trying to make sure there's no architectural problem
14:41 < v-dogg> there is, but first we have to figure out why it keeps calling the Input view :)
14:42 < v-dogg> and this happens to mee all the time: I forget to define executeRead and the default view (Input) is called
14:42 < MikeSeth>  I think I've just learned something new
14:42 < E_mE> whats disturbing is im getting json response as well as a response with an error
14:43 < MikeSeth> E_mE: it's probably an output leak from somewhere
14:43 < MikeSeth> E_mE: either way uncomment executeRead() and make sure
14:44 < v-dogg> does your javascript make two requests?
14:44 < E_mE> v-dogg: your are right there is a executeRead() as well..
14:44 < Wombert> MikeSeth: whats that
14:44 < v-dogg> I'm not going to even try to understand your Yahoo code :)
14:44 < MikeSeth> Wombert: whats what?
14:44 < Wombert> what you laerned
14:44 < v-dogg> E_mE: cool, I like being right
14:45 < MikeSeth> Wombert: that working on other people's code, debugging may proceed in two directions. It's very obvious; but when you work on your own code, you only debug towards technical problems with the code, without easily assuming that your code has architectural problems
14:46 < E_mE> v-dogg: still doesnt answer my executeWrite() is also firing
14:46 < MikeSeth> E_mE: both are called on the same request?
14:46 < MikeSeth> E_mE: <v-dogg> does your javascript make two requests?
14:47 < E_mE> MikeSeth: no... it only has YAHOO.util.Connect.asyncRequest('POST', '/foodherbs/upload/', uploadHandler);
14:47 < MikeSeth> E_mE: open firebug and *CHECK*
14:48 < Wombert> NOOOOOO
14:48 < Wombert> trailing slashes are evil
14:48 < Wombert> remember that
14:48 < Wombert> always
14:48 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has quit []
14:48 < E_mE> ok
14:49 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has joined #agavi
14:49 < MikeSeth> Wombert: apache only makes it worse..
14:51 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I'll try this patch in the evening. Wanna see if it breaks 
14:51 < v-dogg> Wombert: you saw my tickety wickety?
14:51 < Wombert> v-dogg: no sire
14:52 < v-dogg> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/579
14:52 < Wombert> what's the value of the param there
14:52 < Wombert> maybe it is set after all?
14:52 < Wombert> I think it has a pre and a postfix too, aye?
14:53 < Wombert> mh
14:53 < Wombert> this headache is not going away anytime soon
14:53 < Wombert> so...
14:53 < Wombert> office =>
14:54 < Wombert> bbiab
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14:59 < E_mE> ggrrrr the file is getting uploaded... so the damn POST is happening!
15:01 < E_mE> sorry... just inbit of stress... i will figure this little shit out
15:04 < v-dogg> firebug can maybe help you sort out what triggers the READ request
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15:05 < E_mE> ive been using firebug all this time :)
15:05 < E_mE> thats how i know that im getting an exception reponse and json response
15:06 < E_mE> because it keeps asking me to save the json data onto my disk and then the response in firebug is full of agavi exception xhtml
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15:09 < RossC0> E_mE: what you doing?
15:11 < E_mE> i found the error, my form has an action="/foo/upload" and an ajax request for /foo/upload is also happening :)
15:11 < E_mE> RossC0: im using YUI to upload an image 
15:11 < E_mE> and it keeps doing two requests
15:13 < MikeSeth> u
15:13 < RossC0> E_mE: you need to stop the form submit  and just do the Ajax.
15:13 < RossC0> But can you upload a file with YUI?
15:14 < E_mE> http://thecodecentral.com/2007/09/04/asynchronous-file-upload-yuis-approach
15:15 < RossC0> ok is it submitting the form and doing the ajax?
15:15 < E_mE> im not 100% sure
15:16 < E_mE> i'm alittle clouded at the moment.. to much real coffee i think
15:20 < E_mE> maybe i need an updated version of YUI
15:21 < RossC0> your input is a button right?
15:21 < RossC0> not a submit?
15:21 < E_mE> <form action="<?php echo $ro->gen('foodherbs.uploadimg'); ?>" enctype="multipart/form-data" method="post" id="imageForm">
15:21 < E_mE> 				<input type="file" name="ingredientImage" />
15:21 < E_mE> 				<br />
15:21 < E_mE> 				<input type="button" id="uploadButton" value="Upload"/>
15:21 < E_mE> 		</div>
15:22 < RossC0> a yes would have sufficed
15:23 < RossC0> E_mE: i found the error, my form has an action="/foo/upload" and an ajax request for /foo/upload is also happening 
15:23 < RossC0> is the page changing?
15:23 < RossC0> i.e is the form submitting outside AJAX Requests?
15:25 < E_mE> i believe so
15:25 < E_mE> but when i look at XHR in firebug it says there are no requests
15:26 < E_mE> but i'm recieve JSON data
15:26 < E_mE> and also getting a responce from executeRead() 
15:26 < E_mE> executeWrite() is returning the JSON
15:31 < RossC0> E_mE: where are you getting the response?
15:31 < RossC0> in firebug or in ze browser?
15:32 -!- eremit_ is now known as eremit
15:32 < E_mE> both
15:32 < RossC0> zomg
15:32 < RossC0> ok can you stop the submit event in js
15:32 < E_mE> its asking me to save the JSON data to disk
15:32 < RossC0> bingo
15:32 < RossC0> well ignore that
15:33 < E_mE> ok :)
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15:44 < E_mE> i have a feeling the YUI purposely sends two requests
15:45 < E_mE> how can i cancel the normal form request
15:45 < E_mE> because its the JS that is fireing the submit
15:46 < v-dogg> you had some onSubmit event handler, right?
15:46 < v-dogg> with mootools you'd do event.stop() or something like that
15:47 < RossC0> E_mE: #yui ;)
15:48 < E_mE> thanks :D
15:56 < E_mE> weird its ment to return an error :/
15:56 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@213.23.52.58] has joined #agavi
15:57 < Wombert> you cannot upload files with ajax
15:59 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
16:01 < E_mE> it is uploading the image
16:01 < E_mE> but i think its firing another request purposefully
16:02 < E_mE> but now i need to capture the JSON data and prevent it from trying to get the user to download the json
16:03 < Wombert> user download? wtf
16:03 < Wombert> you sure your form does not get submitted...
16:05 < E_mE> ah i moved the <input type="button" /> outside of the form..
16:06 < RossC0> wtf
16:06 < RossC0> no
16:06 < RossC0> no
16:06 < RossC0> no
16:06 < RossC0> no
16:06 < RossC0> E_mE: just upload the file normally
16:06 < RossC0> simplicity
16:06 < RossC0> rulez
16:07 < RossC0> woot wombert - your tumblr is native!
16:07 < Wombert> wha-hat?
16:08 < Wombert> if the upload should be without the page "stalling", make an iframe, E_mE, and <form target="thatiframe">
16:08 < RossC0> blog.bitxtender.com has propogated
16:08 < Wombert> yah
16:08 < RossC0> woot
16:08 < Wombert> cool aint it
16:08 < Wombert> but I need a nicer header
16:08 < Wombert> and a footer where I link to ze ross and to mike and to v-dogg 
16:08 < Wombert> SPEAKING OF WHOM
16:08 < E_mE> ill try and solve this first and if i cant. i want go simple
16:08 < Wombert> WHY DID YOU STOP BLOGGING MISTER MÄKINEN
16:08 < RossC0> you see my ticket / patch?
16:08  * Wombert slaps v-dogg 
16:08 < E_mE> im somewhat glued on getting this working hehe
16:08 < Wombert> ... E_mE then just stop the form from submitting
16:10 < E_mE> how?
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16:12 < E_mE> RossC0 & Wombert go to http://test.thecodecentral.com/demos/asyncupload/  run firebug and watch how it works
16:12 < E_mE> its odd
16:12 < Wombert> E_mE: because the form is still submitted
16:14 < E_mE> but it works for him
16:15 < E_mE> i think i know why
16:15 < E_mE> because he is not asking JSON data be returned on the POST request, he is asking for Error Data from the GetRequest
16:16 < E_mE> so uses executeWrite() for the upload
16:16 < E_mE> and uses executeRead() to find out the error status of the upload
16:16 < E_mE> where I am returning JSON with the filename in executeWrite()
16:16 < E_mE> which is proberbly freaking it out
16:18 < E_mE> so i must generate the time() and submit it as well with the write request and then use the GET to see if the file has arrived
16:19 < E_mE> can i tempoarily save data from the executeWrite() somewhere and when executeRead() comes along it can pick it up for status?
16:22 < E_mE> im sorry guys... i do apprciate what your saying... just kind of in my war path :S
16:23 < Wombert> uuuuuh?
16:23 < Wombert> what error status
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16:24 < RossC0> So does the YUI think actually submit the form normally?
16:24 < E_mE> go to the link i pasted above and activate firebug and do a image upload
16:25 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit [Client Quit]
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16:25 < E_mE> you will see the upload.php will have a response of {"hasError":true, "foo":"bar"}
16:25 < E_mE> which is infact a GET request
16:25 < E_mE> where as the POST doesn't reply at all... 
16:25 < Wombert> let me guess
16:26 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit [Client Quit]
16:26 < Wombert> because your form does a get submit
16:26 < Wombert> you do not stop it from doing so
16:26 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
16:26 < Wombert> and the post does eventually reply when the upload is done...
16:26 < RossC0> hmm stupid demo crashed my ff
16:26 < E_mE> my POST is replying with JSON Data
16:26  * RossC0 picks up his football and goes home
16:26 < E_mE> which is wrong
16:27 < E_mE> RossC0: ditto i got to get my bus in 10  minutes
16:27 < Wombert> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
16:27 < Wombert> NOOOOOOOOOOOOO
16:27 < Wombert> NOOOOOOOOOO
16:27  * Wombert cries
16:27 < E_mE> but i will be beatting this up on the bus ;)
16:27 < RossC0> why doesn't trac let you seal a ticket closed
16:27 < RossC0> dam spammers
16:28 < E_mE> cya later guys... thanks for your help :)
16:28 < E_mE> sorry to be apain ;)
16:28 < RossC0> laters
16:28 < RossC0> Wombert: http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/303
16:28 < RossC0> :D
16:28  * RossC0 passes the football to Wombert
16:28 < Wombert> RossC0: nope
16:28 < RossC0> nope
16:29 < RossC0> why?
16:29 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
16:29 < Wombert> use xpath to select the parent node
16:29 < RossC0> I tried
16:29 < RossC0> hmm wait
16:30 < RossC0> self::*[@id]/ancestor::li
16:30 < Wombert> ha!
16:30 < Wombert> you forgot the namespace
16:30 < RossC0> whaaa?
16:31 < Wombert> self::*[@id]/ancestor::html:li
16:31 < Wombert> or
16:31 < Wombert> self::*[@id]/ancestor::${htmlnsPrefix}li
16:31 < Wombert> we're using XML, remember ;)
16:31 < RossC0> whaa
16:31 < Wombert> <html xmlns="http://w3.org/xhtml">
16:31 < RossC0> but this works:
16:31 < Wombert> !
16:31 < RossC0> ancestor::label/ancestor::li[contains(@class,'left')]
16:31 < Wombert> oO
16:31  * RossC0 confused
16:31 < RossC0> ah no
16:31 < RossC0> wait
16:31 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
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16:32 < RossC0> that doesn't insert the error message in a different position
16:32 < RossC0> but does identify correctly
16:32 < RossC0> and sets the classes differently
16:33 < RossC0> so I don't think I can use xpath?
16:33 < RossC0> oww wierd
16:34 < Wombert> eh?
16:34 < RossC0> Wombert: explain!
16:34 < RossC0> self::*[@id]/ancestor::html:li
16:34 < RossC0> works and inserts it correctly
16:35 < RossC0> but ancestor::label/ancestor::li[contains(@class,'left')] also works but inserts it relative to self
16:35 < RossC0> how come?
16:35 < Wombert> uh?
16:35 < Wombert> other rules?
16:35 < RossC0> yeah 2 rules
16:36 < RossC0> I have a rule that checks the ancestor li - if it has the class left then insert some different html
16:36 < RossC0> it inserts relative to self and not to the ancestor li
16:36 < RossC0> However,  self::*[@id]/ancestor::html:li inserts relative to the li
16:36 < RossC0> how come?
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16:41 < Wombert>  relative to the li?
16:41 < Wombert> do you have other rules?
16:41 < Wombert> can you show me the cfg
16:41 < RossC0> tell a lie
16:41 < RossC0> it just works
16:42 < Wombert> without the html: it shouldn't work under any circumstance
16:42 < RossC0> well ancestor::label/ancestor::li[contains(@class,'left')]  works
16:42 < Wombert> unless _maybe_ you dont have xmlns in the <html>
16:42 < Wombert> that's why there is ${htmlnsPrefix}
16:42 < RossC0> <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml"  xml:lang="en" lang="en">
16:42 < Wombert> it does "html:" for you or just "", automatically
16:42 < RossC0> right I g2g
16:43 < RossC0> train
16:43 < Wombert> mmmh
16:43 < Wombert> kay
16:43 < RossC0> I'll pester you about it tomorrow
16:43 < Wombert> please do
16:43 < RossC0> but wierd no?
16:43 -!- RossC0 [n=lawleyr@80.4.120.163] has left #agavi []
16:43 < Wombert> sounds yeah
16:43 < Wombert> lolz
16:43 < Wombert> :>
16:43 < Wombert> hugs RossC0
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16:44 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
16:44 < Wombert> MikeSeth: oh bollocks its all falling to pieces
16:45 < Wombert> Warning: __clone method called on non-object in /Users/dzuelke/Sites/_projects/agavi/branches/0.11/src/controller/AgaviController.class.php on line 142
16:45 < Wombert> :S
16:45 < Wombert> with soa
16:45 < Wombert> p
16:45 < Wombert> ZOMGGGG!
17:31 -!- Chonsu [n=martin@87.79.35.58] has quit ["Leaving."]
17:33 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
17:34 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["moo()"]
17:51 < Wombert> FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKING HELL
17:56 -!- _cheerios [n=jacklo@cs181066248.pp.htv.fi] has joined #agavi
17:57  * _cheerios feels like the wheel is spinning too fast lately
17:58 < Wombert> O RLY
17:58 < Wombert> :p
17:59 -!- impl [n=impl@compass.rdu-0.ip6.cynigram.com] has joined #agavi
18:06 < Wombert> impl: zomg help plz
18:11 < Wombert> SOLVED WOOOOZ WOOOOZ WOOOT :>
18:11 < Wombert> impl: have you seen http://agileweb.org/post/13296224
18:11 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
18:16  * Wombert smacks impl 
18:16 < Wombert> WHERE ART THOU
18:29 < _cheerios> heh @ first words of Hiro in season2
18:31 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@82.152.207.176] has joined #agavi
18:32 < E_mE> hi hi
18:33 < Wombert> WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS NONSENSE BOOOOOOOH
18:36 < Wombert> NOOOOOOOOOO
18:36 < Wombert> NOOOOOO THIS CANNOT BE TRUE NO NO NO NO NO NO NO
18:37 < Wombert> I HATE THIS FUCKING WORLD
18:37 < Wombert> I HATE IT
18:37 < Wombert> EVERYTHING
18:37 < Wombert> BOOOOH
18:38 < E_mE> :S
18:38 < E_mE> here here headache suffering one
18:40 < Wombert> there is relief tho
18:40 < Wombert> tumblr is so ace
18:40 < Wombert> I could tumble my mood right away :>
18:40 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/
18:40 < Wombert> :>>>
18:41 < Wombert> oh well then
18:41 < Wombert> we clone the rd JIT
18:41 < Wombert> WHICH FUCKING SUCKS AND RIPS OPEN ANOTHER VECTOR OF ATTACK
18:41 < Wombert> but who cares
18:41 < E_mE> what tumblr??
18:42 < Wombert> AND WHO CARES THAT I WASTED TWO HOURS ON THIS FECK
18:42 < Wombert> FUBAR
18:42 < Wombert> FU
18:42 < Wombert> BAR
18:42 < Wombert> arrrrrrrrrrrgh
18:43 < E_mE> ahhh i;m quoted on your blog! :o
18:43 < E_mE> chair!
18:44 < Wombert> heh 
18:46 < E_mE> hows mr Wommy you are on the nutter side of mad today?
18:47 < E_mE> why*
18:47 < Wombert> I'M ON THE FECKING NUTTY NUTS SIDE OF MAD ALSÖDJASLKDASHLD
18:47 < Wombert> asd
18:47 < Wombert> #arrrrrgh
18:47  * E_mE Throws ice cold water of womberts head!
18:48 < Wombert> BUGGER OF WITH THAT SHIT ZOMG
18:48 < Wombert> ZOMG IT DOES NOT WORK
18:48 < Wombert> I COULD SO FREAK OUT
18:48 < Wombert> AAAAAAH
18:49 < E_mE> well if you got a headache ice cold water will give you brain freeze and give you somewhat relief for a few moments ;)
18:52 < E_mE> anyhow.. time for me to slap the YUI upload again
18:55  * impl smacks Wombert back
18:55 < Wombert> I swear to god I'm about to go ballistic
18:55 < impl> what on earth
18:56 < E_mE> his been throwing his toys out the pram for ages
18:56 < impl> Wombert: haha@video
18:57 < E_mE> i think its a creative spurt :)
19:02 < Wombert> impl: help
19:02 < Wombert> :(
19:02 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/103836
19:02 < Wombert> request data disappears now
19:02 < Wombert> whyyyyyyy
19:03 < impl> +                                // mmmh I smell awesomeness... clone the RD JIT, yay, that's the spirit
19:03 < impl> +                                $this->requestData = clone $this->requestData;
19:03 < impl> I suspect this line
19:03 < Wombert> has to be
19:03 < Wombert> no
19:03 < impl> also
19:03 < impl> shouldn't setRequestData clone?
19:03 < Wombert> nope
19:03 < impl> if you're doing things that way
19:03 < Wombert> that's too early
19:03 < Wombert> I had it that way
19:04 < impl> unf
19:04 < Wombert> the idea is that $this->requestData is a ref to $request's
19:04 < impl> constant("$rdhc::SOURCE_PARAMETERS") <-- ew
19:04 < Wombert> has to be that way, too :p
19:04 < impl> h8 no late static binding
19:04 < impl> h8 it!
19:04 < impl> I know it :( but PHP makes me sad
19:04 < Wombert> wouldn't help :p
19:05 < impl> Sure it would... you could just say $rdhc::SOURCE_PARAMETERS
19:05 < Wombert> well that's just that syntax thing
19:05 < Wombert> they're fixing that with 5.3 IIRC
19:05 < impl> cool :o
19:05 < Wombert> static calls in this fashion
19:05 < Wombert> not LSB related tho
19:05 < impl> so why do we have a factories for RDH?
19:06 < impl> factories definition
19:06 < impl> (or is it?)
19:06 < Wombert> checked
19:06 < Wombert> the clone is identical
19:06 < Wombert> WHAT IS GOING ON
19:06 < Wombert> well
19:06 < Wombert> maybe you want YourCoolWebRequestDataHolder
19:06 < Wombert> which also has... mh... $_SERVER values
19:06 < Wombert> that's just a new source and some code
19:06 < impl> ahokay
19:07 < Wombert> but then it needs to make an instance of that class and stuff
19:07 < impl> I'm really too tired to analyze this :s about to fall asleep (I need to get out of this pattern but whatever)
19:08 < impl> sry
19:08 < Wombert> I don't get it
19:08 < impl> I bet it's something stupid though ;x
19:08 < Wombert> wtf
19:08 < Wombert> string 'SoapFault exception: [SOAP-ENV:Server] Unknown Product "" in /Users/dzuelke/Sites/_projects/agavi/branches/0.11/samples/pub/soap-test.php:24
19:08 < Wombert> GAH
19:09 < Wombert> no
19:09 < Wombert> NO
19:09 < Wombert> NOOOOOOO
19:09 < Wombert> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
19:09 < Wombert> I MUST KILL
19:09 < Wombert> ADJKLAJDLASJKDLASKLDAJ
19:09 < ttj> KILLKILLKILL!
19:09 < Wombert> Index: /Users/dzuelke/Sites/_projects/agavi/branches/0.11/samples/app/config/factories.xml
19:09 < Wombert> ===================================================================
19:09 < Wombert> --- /Users/dzuelke/Sites/_projects/agavi/branches/0.11/samples/app/config/factories.xml	(revision 2101)
19:09 < Wombert> +++ /Users/dzuelke/Sites/_projects/agavi/branches/0.11/samples/app/config/factories.xml	(working copy)
19:09 < Wombert> @@ -33,7 +33,7 @@
19:09 < Wombert>  		
19:09 < Wombert>  		<validation_manager class="AgaviValidationManager">
19:09 < Wombert>  			<parameters>
19:09 < Wombert> -				<parameter name="mode">conditional</parameter>
19:09 < Wombert> +				<parameter name="mode">strict</parameter>
19:09 < Wombert> FOR FUCKS SAKE
19:09 < Wombert> A WHOLE EVENING
19:09 < Wombert> WASTED
19:09 < Wombert> this is not my day
19:09 < Wombert> no, no, certainly not.
19:09 < impl> oh eads 
19:09 < impl> :9
19:10 < impl> COLON NINE
19:10 < ttj> Deep Colon Nine.
19:10 < impl> lawll
19:10 < Wombert> wha-hat?
19:10 < v-dogg> :)
19:11 < Wombert> I dare you crazy fockers if you are making fun of me...
19:11 < ttj> You know... Deep Space Nine...
19:11 < ttj> Deep Colon Nine...
19:11 < Wombert> zomh
19:11 < Wombert> -h+g
19:11 < Wombert> adasd
19:11 < Wombert> too nerdy for me
19:11 < ttj> :P
19:11 < ttj> But hey! When're you coming to Finland?
19:11 < Wombert> when are you coming to germany
19:11 < Wombert> for instance to the international php conference 2007
19:11 < ttj> Hmm... What about a compromise? Milan!
19:11 < Wombert> you are a R&D specialist now
19:12 < Wombert> you can surely errr... justify going there
19:12 < ttj> November 17th.
19:12 < Wombert> v-dogg is coming, too
19:12 < Wombert> no, no, november 6
19:12 < Wombert> frankfurt
19:12 < Wombert> it's ace
19:12 < Wombert> !
19:12 < ttj> But I'm already going to Milan. :-(
19:12 < v-dogg> November 17th is my birthday
19:12 < ttj> v-dogg: Come to Milan!
19:12 < v-dogg> heh
19:12 < ttj> Roundtrip from Helsinki-Vantaa: 42e.
19:12 < v-dogg> hahaha
19:13 < Wombert> he's not gonna sleep
19:13 < Wombert> just bar hopping and then back
19:13 < v-dogg> you going to party all night and then fly back?
19:13 < Wombert> you finns are so feckin crazy
19:13 < ttj> I'm flying there Saturday afternoon, then hitting the bars and when the bars close at ~4, I'm heading back to the airport and flying back at 6:50. :P
19:13 < v-dogg> like they'll let you go into the plain :D
19:13 < ttj> Sure they will!
19:13 < Wombert> lolz
19:13  * Wombert is taking bets
19:14 < ttj> 300e says I'm not allowed in the plane!
19:15 < ttj> Bah, where is Micol. The only native Italian I know of who is living in the region. And now she's disappeared. :-(
19:16 < Wombert> okay can uhm
19:16 < CIA-11> david * r2108 /branches/0.11/src/ (7 files in 2 dirs): 
19:16 < CIA-11> Controller now gives containers a copy of the global request data holder. This
19:16 < CIA-11> means "request_lock_barf" is no longer used; you can create containers in your
19:16 < CIA-11> code and they will have the actual request data in them. Rejoice. Refs #544.
19:16 < CIA-11> Also cleaned up the locking code and made it more secure. And did related bug
19:16 < CIA-11> fixes.
19:16 < Wombert> can someone test this
19:16 < Wombert> like... impl... and... MikeSeth... and v-dogg, if he can be bothered
19:16  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
19:17  * Wombert hugs ttj, too
19:17 < Wombert> I think I'll move to finland one day
19:17 < Wombert> when I'm weird enough
19:17 < ttj> :P
19:17 < _cheerios> HOMELAND OF THE CRAZIES
19:17  * Wombert hugs _cheerios, too
19:17 < ttj> I'm not crazy, I'm just eccentric.
19:18 < Wombert> of course, of course...
19:18 < ttj> Hmm... Still need to do the exercise for Legal Aspects in Computing... :-/
19:19 < _cheerios> ttj, i saw a good foreword on that on piratebay!
19:19 < ttj> :P
19:19 < ttj> _cheerios: There's actually a related seminar course and one of the possible topics is the FinnReactor case. :P
19:21 < Wombert> home =>
19:21 < ttj> Where's the commitment?!?
19:22 < ttj> Leaving this early!
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19:30 < E_mE> how can you set output_type in an action?
19:30 < v-dogg> I'm not crazy, I'm big-boned!
19:31 < v-dogg> E_mE: you do it in view::init
19:31 < E_mE> mmmm
19:32 < E_mE> or is it better to send the content type out in the view 
19:33 < v-dogg> $this->container->setOutputType($this->getContext()->getController()->getOutputType('pdf'));
19:33 < E_mE> thanx :D
19:46 < E_mE> whats the best way to get plain text back to the browser without using die() in your view
19:46 < E_mE> i want just raw data from a variable
19:48 < JanK_> E_mE: i think i've done this be returning the data
19:49 < JanK_> and setting your output type could prolly better be done using routes (.pdf ending for example)
19:49 < JanK_> or for one special route
19:50 < E_mE> i just want for example nothing more and nothing less then " 912391923921-day2.jpg "  (excluding ")
19:50 < E_mE> but if i send it ask JSON it asks me to download it hehe
19:50 < E_mE> silly thing
19:50 < E_mE> or silly me purhpase
19:52 < v-dogg> I'd imagine it just a matter of sending the right headers
19:53 < v-dogg> Content-Type: text/plain
19:53 < E_mE> i send text\json
19:53 < E_mE> ill try that
19:55 < E_mE> eeek im getting <pre>&lt;!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/loose.dtd"&gt; &lt;html&gt;&lt;body&gt;&lt;p&gt;1191527776393-Day 7a.jpg&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/body&gt;&lt;/html&gt; </pre>
19:55 < E_mE> with text/plain
19:56 < E_mE> maybe i need to create a new renderer which does nothing?
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20:01 < v-dogg> that has nothing to do with the renderer
20:01 < v-dogg> but I'm off to bed. hope you get it sorted
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20:03 < E_mE> nite v-dogg
20:05 < E_mE> is \d+ in regex for getting numbers?
20:08 < Wombert> <parameter name="output_types"><parameter>html</parameter></parameter>
20:08 < Wombert> for FPF in global filters config
20:09 < E_mE> you talking to me Wombert?
20:13 < _cheerios> google regex, E_mE :)
20:15 < E_mE> ahead of you.. :)
20:27 < E_mE> Wombert: will agavi automatically upcase the first Letters of view names for example Jpg_Image output type... if i pass jpg_Image will it account for it?
20:27 < Wombert> eh?
20:27 < Wombert> you mean the execute function?
20:28 < E_mE> well you sexy code: <route pattern="^/images/(imagename:\S+?).(type:(png|jpg|jpeg|gif))$" module="foodandherbs" output_type="${type}_Image" action="TempImage" />
20:28 < E_mE> you did, it breaks if the first letter of the extension is a captial it breaks
20:28 < Wombert> no
20:28 < E_mE> okay... ill need to program that in :) woo
20:29 < Wombert> first of all, use lowercase names for the output types
20:29 < Wombert> second
20:29 < Wombert> function names are case insensitive in php
20:29 < Wombert> so you can have executehtml
20:29 < Wombert> or executeHTML
20:29 < Wombert> or whatever
20:29 < Wombert> no need to code anything
20:29 < Wombert> and as I said
20:29 < Wombert> it might be better to have an image output type and set the content type header in the view
20:30 < E_mE> yeah... good point
20:30 < E_mE> i just need to do a check on the imagegif() imagejpg() etc
20:33 < Wombert> ?
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21:06 < E_mE> YYYEESSSSS! After 10 odd hours the upload finally WORKS :D
21:07  * E_mE dances 
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21:18 < splatch`> Wombert: do you got .psd files from kazek?
21:18 < Wombert> splatch`: no :(
21:18 < Wombert> and I please need the vector originals (eps or whatever it is) for the logos!
21:18 < splatch`> Wombert: i kick him :)
21:19 < Wombert> splatch`: thanks :)
21:19 < splatch`> btw maybe i'll change work :)
21:19 < Wombert> again?
21:19 < splatch`> not again! From May, i worked in one company
21:20 < splatch`> Wombert: give me you mail
21:22 < Wombert> dz@bitxtender.com
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21:36 < Wombert> splatch`: cool, thanks
21:36 < Wombert> I sent him a reply with a question :)
21:39 < splatch`> night..
21:41 < splatch`> bye :)
21:42 < Wombert> :> bai
21:42 < ttj> Haha, ~11.5 hours of work and three hours of school today so far.
21:43 < Wombert> sounds horrible
21:43 < Wombert> how was your day then, ttj 
21:43 < Wombert> xD
21:43 < ttj> Quite horrible. But hopefully it'll get better.
21:44 < Wombert> isn't it past midnight already in weirdoland
21:44 < ttj> Yep.
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22:07 < ttj> SIR? :o
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05:06 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:28 < _cheerios> huomenta
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07:11 < E_mE> huomenta... me ----> work!
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07:19 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
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08:23 < E_mE> huomenta!
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09:29 < Wombert> y0y0
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09:54 < RossC0> Yo Wombert
09:57 < E_mE> Wombert: you solve your problem yesterdday?
09:57 < E_mE> RossC0: I finally got the upload to work after hours of hacking away from a bloody axe
10:08 < _cheerios> did you find your fiddle that you lost yesterday morning, E_mE ?
10:10 < E_mE> yes... axe was the only alternative... but its done me well :)
10:10 < E_mE> well my day today will be little bit more intersting then doing a manual invoice form ;) it involves making a Despatche Cases report :D
10:10 < E_mE> almost orgasmic
10:10 < E_mE> ;)
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10:29 < RossC0> waa
10:29 < RossC0> FPF just gone mental
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10:45 < RossC0> Wombert: having problems with Ajax and FPF
10:46 < RossC0> Notice: Trying to get property of non-object
10:46 < RossC0> if(!$targets->length) {
10:46 < RossC0> is it because I dont have a html namespace?
10:48 < Wombert> hmmmm
10:48 < RossC0> brb
10:50 < RossC0> back
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11:43 < shoan> del.icio.us switched to symfony :o
11:43 < shoan> omg
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12:01 < E_mE> bbl
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12:31 < CIA-11> dominik * r2109 /branches/0.11/src/util/AgaviVirtualArrayPath.class.php: remove unneeded code path
12:32 < CIA-11> dominik * r2110 /branches/0.11/src/util/AgaviVirtualArrayPath.class.php: whitespace fix
12:32 < CIA-11> dominik * r2111 /branches/0.11/src/core/Agavi.class.php: $cfg = $cfg = 1 is probably the same as $cfg = 1 ;)
12:39 < RossC0> Wombert: fixed my ajax problem was namespaces
12:39 < RossC0> not sure why I have to keep declaring them - seems screwey
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13:24 < RossC0> Wombert: r2108 broke my app
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13:26 < RossC0> caching started trying to serialise PDO data that it didn't previously i.e. 2107
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13:54 < Wombert> ^re
13:55 < Wombert> RossC0: namespaces?
13:55 < Wombert> reproduce case? :p
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13:56 < Wombert> you mean html:lolz?
13:56 < Wombert> well that's because your document is XML and there is a namespace declaration via <html xmlns="..." />
13:58 < RossC0> well it sucks
13:59 < RossC0> :<
13:59 < RossC0> anythoughts on the r2108 ?
13:59 < Wombert> can you explain what happens
14:01 < RossC0> well I update and I get a PDO serialisation error
14:01 < RossC0> doesn't happen if I turn caching off
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14:01 < RossC0> so caching is getting different data
14:03 < Wombert> where is the pdo stuff stored
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14:04 < RossC0> I dont store any pdo stuff
14:06  * Wombert ponders
14:08  * RossC0 ponders with wombert
14:08 < Wombert> can you show me the error or anything
14:08 < RossC0> sure
14:08 < Wombert> do you have slots in the cache?
14:08 < RossC0> yes
14:08 < Wombert> but they are not included in the cache
14:09 < RossC0> well in some
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14:10 < E_mE> how many requests can Agavi do per second?
14:13 < RossC0> E_mE: depends
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14:17 < Wombert> lolz
14:17 < Wombert> http://api.flickr.com/services/feeds/photos_public.gne?tags=cats&format=lol
14:17 < Wombert> :>>>
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14:24 < E_mE> RossC0: well just returning a standard "Echo "hello World"; from a request
14:24 < E_mE> would be intresting to test it :)
14:24 < RossC0> why?
14:24 < E_mE> someone has tested some of the other frameworks for there speed
14:24 < RossC0> ok...
14:24 < E_mE> and zend is responding with 25/req sec
14:24 < Wombert> ...
14:25 < Wombert> dear god please not this discussion
14:25 < E_mE> its the first time i discussed it... heheh
14:25 < E_mE> i just read someones blog
14:25 < Wombert> some idiot's blog you mean
14:25 < Wombert> if you output "hello world"; then 99,999995% of the time spent on the request is eaten up by the framework
14:25 < Wombert> in your real life application, most of the time spent on the request is eaten up by your application code, database calls, you name it
14:26 < Wombert> so forget these "benchmarks", they are totally useless
14:27 < E_mE> see see
14:27 < E_mE> i guess your right since the end result of hte project the Framework will have such little impact on the running of the site
14:28 < Wombert> it will have an impact, and a measurable one
14:28 < RossC0> E_mE: cost / benefit
14:28 < E_mE>  but the coder of the site will proberbly be making a bigger one
14:28 < Wombert> but it should not matter as the benefits are elsewhere
14:36 < E_mE> can i execute my agavi intranet via the CLI on the server with CRON?
14:38 < v-dogg> only from a http client, afaik
14:38 < v-dogg> routing needs $_SERVER stuff that isn't there when executing php-cli
14:39 < Wombert> a web app?
14:39 < Wombert> depends on what you need to do
14:39 < Wombert> you can create a new context of course
14:40 < v-dogg> do we have a working consolecontroller?
14:40  * Wombert looks the other way
14:40 < Wombert> no but not needed ;)
14:41 < v-dogg> ok, please enlighten me
14:54 < E_mE> i could get CRON to open run a wget request for a page which in hand fires the query to email everyone the CSV file of the sales :D
14:54 < Wombert> you can call agavi using the command line
14:55 < E_mE> how?
14:55 < E_mE> creating a whole new context?
14:55 < Wombert> yes
14:55 < E_mE> how would i go about this?
14:58 < Wombert> make a lolz.php
14:58 < Wombert> where you get an instance of context... mmmh... "cron"
15:01 < E_mE> sp will lolz.php need to call require('pub/index.php'); then get the context
15:01 < E_mE> or call the same information as whats in index.php
15:01 < Wombert> !?
15:01 < Wombert> no it is a copy of index.php
15:01 < Wombert> but creates a different context
15:01 < E_mE> but instead of AgaviContext::getInstance('web') it would be AgaviContext::getInstance('cli')
15:02 < Wombert> yes
15:02 < E_mE> where do i set up the cli side of things
15:02 < Wombert> and then ->getController()->dispatch(new AgaviRequestDataHolder(array(AgaviRequestDataHolder::SOURCE_PARAMETERS => array('module' => 'Maintenance', 'action' => 'SendSalesCsvReport'))));
15:02 < Wombert> or so
15:03 < E_mE> and nothing more?
15:03 < E_mE> then write as normal in SendSalesCsvReport
15:03 < E_mE>  AgaviContext::getInstance('cli')   <-- the cli in there has no relavents in any config files?
15:05 < Wombert> well you can set up different factories for that context
15:05 < Wombert> command line is relatively complicated that's why we don't have much stuff bundled for that
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15:06 < Wombert> you can use "AgaviConsoleRequest" for the request, for example
15:06 < Wombert> but its empty and does nothing
15:06 < Wombert> if you want to give cmdline args or so, in any case, have the behavior dynamic, you need to write your own stuff for that probably
15:06 < E_mE> how do i define the configuration?
15:06 < E_mE> in factory?
15:07 < E_mE> wont it automatically always execute the <configuration> load of attributes
15:08 < Wombert> yes
15:08 < E_mE> and then use <configuration environment="development">
15:08 < Wombert> so you can have <configuration context="cli"><request>AgaviConsoleRequest</request></configuration>
15:08 < E_mE> but i could change that to CLI
15:08 < Wombert> err... <configuration context="cli"><request class="AgaviConsoleRequest" /></configuration>
15:09 < v-dogg> 17:40 < v-dogg> do we have a working consolecontroller? s/controller/request/
15:09 < E_mE> should work in a basic form now?
15:09 < Wombert> yes, should
15:09 < Wombert> you give dispatch() instructions on what to do
15:10 < Wombert> also check out http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/480
15:11 < E_mE> thank you :D
15:18 < E_mE> wow my boss actaully thought it was a good idea to use agavi/php to send out the sales case report :o
15:18 < E_mE> thats the first!
15:29 < E_mE> Wombert: will have to fill AgaviConsoleRequest with code for this to work?
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15:35 < E_mE> Wombert: how can i apply the path to my version of Agavi Src?
15:42 < Wombert> don't
15:42 < Wombert> thats a maintenance nightmare
15:42 < Wombert> what if I add those to agavi
15:42 < Wombert> make MyCustomConsoleRequest etc
15:44 < E_mE> im getting this error so far, with just having AgaviConsoleRequest
15:45 < E_mE> Fatal error: Call to undefined method AgaviConsoleRequest::getRequestUri() in /usr/local/src/agavi/src/routing/AgaviWebRouting.class.php on line 96
15:46 < E_mE> you going to update agavi and then ill need to SVN update?
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15:52 < MrJeep> is there an option in routing to specify a subdomain
15:52 < MrJeep> ?
15:52 < Wombert> when generating?
15:53 < MrJeep> yeah
15:53 < Wombert> or for matching
15:53 < Wombert> do you have a rule that matches subdomains?
15:53 < Wombert> E_mE: come on man...
15:53 < Wombert> of course you have to have them all
15:53 < Wombert> otherwise, you'll be getting those errors
15:53 < Wombert> and as I said
15:53 < MrJeep> nop, I'm just wondering (big thinking going on)
15:53 < Wombert> do not call them AgaviConsoleRouting etc
15:53 < MrJeep> I guess load balancing  can be done with subdomains right ?
15:53 < Wombert> but yes it's possible
15:54 < Wombert> for gen(), you'd do it with a routing callback and onGenerate
15:54 < Wombert> piece of cake really
15:54 < MrJeep> ok
15:54 < Wombert> well you don't even need a callback
15:54 < Wombert> $ro->gen(null, array(), array('authority' => 'google.com', 'scheme' => 'https'));
15:54 < E_mE> im not calling the routing... ill pastebin what i got
15:55 < Wombert> then you have the current URL but with https://gogle.com/
15:58 < E_mE> Wombert: http://www.pastebin.ca/726883
15:59 < E_mE> i aint calling any routing
15:59 < E_mE> or am i being stupid?
15:59 < Wombert> are you not listening?
15:59 < Wombert> I just said you need them all!
15:59 < Wombert> otherwise, you get those errors
16:00 < Wombert> look at the error again you pasted
16:00 < Wombert> what does it tell you
16:00 < E_mE> im then getting exception... but let me look
16:00 < Wombert> no, I mean the error message
16:01 < E_mE> says it cant find a method in AgaviConsoleRequest..
16:02 < Wombert> yes, and which method
16:02 < Wombert> and what class calls that method
16:03 < E_mE> webrouting.. 
16:03 < E_mE> so ive now added AgaviConsoleRouting
16:03 < Wombert> right
16:03 < Wombert> and what's the name of the method
16:04 < E_mE> getRequestUri()
16:04 < Wombert> yup
16:04 < Wombert> exactly
16:04 < E_mE> so i need to create it?
16:04 < Wombert> nooooo
16:04 < Wombert> of course not
16:04 < Wombert> think about it for a second
16:05 < Wombert> there are no request urls on a command line app, right?
16:05 < E_mE> so i need to have AgaviConsoleRouting firing at AgaviConsoleRequest()
16:05 < Wombert> so you also need a different routing class for the cli context that does not assume a web call
16:05 < Wombert> yes
16:05 < Wombert> and please
16:05 < Wombert> as I said twice before
16:05 < Wombert> do not call them AgaviConsoleRouting
16:05 < E_mE> customise it
16:06 < Wombert> and do not put them into your agavi dir
16:06 < Wombert> put them into your app dir
16:06 < Wombert> otherwise, you get problems when updating agavi
16:06 < Wombert> plus you'd need to move the changes with you as you update agavi
16:06 < Wombert> etc etc etc
16:06 < Wombert> never patch or modify your agavi install unless you want big ass headaches
16:06 < E_mE> no of course
16:06 < E_mE> aye aye captain :D
16:07 < Wombert> good boy :)
16:07 < E_mE> okay ill create a customer ConsoleReuting
16:07 < E_mE> Hay hay! I'm a junior... not boy! :o
16:08 < E_mE> will i need to make a custom AgaviConsoleResponse too?
16:09 < Wombert> everything that's in the patch
16:10 < E_mE> will i need to write all the code to make it work too?
16:11 < Wombert> yup, just copy it all over
16:11 < E_mE> :)
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16:12 < E_mE> so to make my self clear, i need to create AgaviVinoConsole...Request/Routing/Response in my own folders in app/
16:12 < E_mE> then copy everything that the patch has locally
16:13 < Wombert> I suggest app/lib/routing
16:13 < Wombert> app/lib/request
16:13 < Wombert> app/lib/response
16:13 < Wombert> yup, and then copy the code in there
16:13 < Wombert> b the way
16:13 < Wombert> wrong naming scheme there :p
16:13 < Wombert> VinoAgaviConsoleRequest etc
16:13 < Wombert> much better
16:14 < E_mE> do i need to autoload them as well
16:14 < E_mE> in the autoload.xml
16:14 < Wombert> yup
16:14 < E_mE> :D :D
16:24 < E_mE> is there a simple way of getting rid of those damned +'s in the patch file hehe
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16:44 < ttj> "You're perfect, yes, it's true / But without me you're only you (you're only you) / Your menstruating heart / It ain't bleeding enough for two... / It's a midlife crisis... / It's a midlife crisis..."
16:54 < Wombert> I need new cool dev/design blogs
16:54 < ttj> Unfortunately I don't blog about nerd stuff. :P
17:01 < ttj> Wow, I'm in your blog, Wombie... :P
17:01 < Wombert> woot :>
17:05 < ttj> Hmm... I completely missed the tumbelog thingy.
17:16 < Wombert> it's fun
17:22 < ttj> Does it have some sort of nifty mobile client?
17:22 < ttj> Or can I post to it via email?
17:22 < Wombert> yes and yes
17:22 < Wombert> www.tumblr.com
17:22 < ttj> Cool.
17:29 < ttj> Jennifer Paige - Crush
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19:14 < Wombert> impl!
19:14 < Wombert> :>
19:14 < impl> hallo
19:14 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14355981
19:14 < Wombert> sooo
19:14 < Wombert> fucking
19:14 < Wombert> nice
19:15 < Wombert> (hint: click teh thxbye :p)
19:15 < impl> rofl
19:16 < impl> That is awesome
19:18 < Wombert> you should start a tumblelog too
19:20 < Wombert> should use LOLZ and KTHXBAI tho :p
19:22 < impl> what's a tumblelog?
19:22 < Wombert> like mh
19:22 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/ :)
19:22 < impl> It looks like a blog with big fonts and less crap about how emo you are and how much life sucks
19:23 < Wombert> yes
19:23 < Wombert> it's fucking ace
19:23 < Wombert> :>
19:23 < Wombert> and good fun
19:23 < impl> lawlk
19:23 < Wombert> even tho I do blog about how much life sucks :p
19:23 < Wombert> maybe start from the bottom, not many posts so far :>
19:23 < Wombert> you have pre-made types of posts like image, video, conversation, quote, normal text and link
19:24 < impl> ahh
19:24 < Wombert> you can also syndicate in your digg stuff or delicious or any rss feed
19:24 < impl> This sounds too Web 2.0 for me
19:25 < Wombert> it really is so ace :>
19:25 < Wombert> like when I was mad at Agavi for pwning me yesterday for hours and so on
19:25 < Wombert> I blogged http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14238356
19:25 < Wombert> and then when I was victorious... http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14242500
19:25 < Wombert> :>
19:26 < impl> hehe
19:26 < Wombert> it's a cool balance between... blogging with crap about how emo you are and how much life sucks... and... mmh... this, whatsitcalled, twitter? thing
19:26 < impl> Considering the amount of nothing I do I don't think mine would have much content
19:26 < Wombert> where you say LOLZ I'M BACK FROM THE SHOWER HEY WORLD DO YOU GIVE A SHIT HUH?
19:27 < Wombert> that's the poiiint man
19:27 < Wombert> nobody can comment anyway, so don't care what you post
19:27 < Wombert> and
19:27 < Wombert> you don't have to think
19:27 < Wombert> I just find a cool link or an image or a LOLZ API and tumble it
19:27 < Wombert> does the world care?
19:27 < Wombert> I don't care :p
19:27 < impl> well seems like a waste of effort then :P
19:28 < Wombert> it looks so weird and without structure, very cool :>
19:28 < Wombert> you can post by email :P
19:28 < Wombert> come on :p
19:28 < Wombert> www.tumblr.com
19:29  * impl doesn't like 2.0nessssss
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19:39 < brainsqueezer> hi
19:39 < Wombert> hi!
19:42 < impl> Hello, there
19:43 < brainsqueezer> ummm got a question
19:43 < Wombert> please
19:43 < brainsqueezer> there is no database mapping in agavi right?
19:43 < Wombert> yes
19:43 < Wombert> (intentionally)
19:44 < brainsqueezer> intentionally?
19:44 < Wombert> sure
19:44 < Wombert> there never will be ;)
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19:44 < Wombert> you pick the database access method you like, you pick the template engine you like
19:44 < Wombert> we don't tell you how to send your emails or how to do fancy bar charts
19:44 < brainsqueezer> i see
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19:44 < Wombert> not really the domain of a framework, at least not the latter two
19:45 < Wombert> of course, agavi has support for propel and doctrine, if you like an ORM, or for PDO and AdoDB and others
19:45 < Wombert> and drivers for Smarty, PHPTAL, ezcTemplate etc if you like template engines
19:46 < brainsqueezer> good answer
19:46 < Wombert> the idea is not to lock you in
19:47 < Wombert> if we ship with a database layer, people will want it tightly integrated
19:47 < JanK__> how to validate if retyped password matches password? i've got this: http://paste2.org/p/7984
19:47 < Wombert> which means we create dependencies
19:47 < impl> JanK__: Use two <argument>s
19:48 < Wombert> JanK__: to <arguments>
19:48 < Wombert> bah
19:48  * Wombert smacks impl 
19:48 < JanK__> thanks
19:48 < Wombert> *two even
19:48  * impl anti-slaps
19:48 < Wombert> anyway
19:48 < Wombert> brainsqueezer: so that ORM we package or wrote ourselves... solves 95% of people's problems
19:49 < Wombert> which does not mean it solves all problems for 95% of the people
19:49 < Wombert> for 80% of the people, it does 95% of the job and then gets in their way
19:50 < Wombert> and for the other 20%, it's a horrible pain in the elsewhere and turns them away
19:50 < brainsqueezer> Wombert: that's a good paont but don't know if fits my needs because i need need integrration mostly between templates and database
19:51 < Wombert> if you look into agavi a little, you'll find that we don't have helpers that output <img> tags for you or create fancy effects with whatever-js-library
19:51 < Wombert> brainsqueezer: of course it does!
19:51 < Wombert> you pick the database interface you like... say... doctrine
19:51 < Wombert> in your actions, you do your business code, i.e. talking to the database etc
19:51 < Wombert> for instance... fetching product details
19:51 < Wombert> in the view/template, you output the info
19:52 < brainsqueezer> yes this is typical way
19:52 < Wombert> if a framework can only achieve that by forcing you to use THEIR database approach and THEIR template language, then it is utter crap
19:52 < brainsqueezer> but i need a way to access data from templates
19:53 < Wombert> you mean... fetch data in templates
19:53 < Wombert> without fetching it elsewhere first?
19:53 < brainsqueezer> yes
19:53 < Wombert> i.e. a pull approach?
19:53 < Wombert> why do you need that
19:53 < impl> That breaks MVC
19:53 < Wombert> sure does
19:53 < brainsqueezer> don't really know what is a pull approach
19:54 < Wombert> brainsqueezer: I cannot imagine a situation where pull works and push doesn't
19:54 < Wombert> simple
19:54 < brainsqueezer> i need a very customizable templates
19:54 < Wombert> yes, but the data presented is always the same
19:54 < brainsqueezer> templates are editable
19:54 < Wombert> you pull data from the database, then give it to the view (template) to work with
19:54 < Wombert> okay, so?
19:54 < Wombert> :)
19:54 < Wombert> the data is there either way
19:55 < brainsqueezer> yes
19:55 < brainsqueezer> but i mest allaw my client to edit templates
19:55 < brainsqueezer> without editing actions
19:55 < Wombert> yes, sure
19:55 < Wombert> that's the whole point of MVC
19:55 < Wombert> pseudo code
19:55 < Wombert> in your action:
19:56 < Wombert> $this->setAttribute('product_price', $myModel->getPriceForProduct($id));
19:56 < Wombert> in your template:
19:56 < Wombert> Price: EUR {$product_price}
19:56 < Wombert> (assuming you use smarty)
19:56 < brainsqueezer> yes that seems smarty
19:57 < brainsqueezer> but imagine a newspaper
19:57 < brainsqueezer> today a need to display news in frontpage with these topics...
19:58 < Wombert> yes
19:58 < Wombert> but that is view domain
19:58 < Wombert> so you'd build a system that allows editors to choose what's displayed
19:58 < brainsqueezer> and then iraq wat begins
19:58 < brainsqueezer> and yoy change the template to show that topic
19:58 < Wombert> no!
19:58 < Wombert> you don't change the template
19:58 < Wombert> of course not
19:59 < brainsqueezer> yes
19:59 < Wombert> you would not change the template to show a different product either do you
19:59 < Wombert> no
19:59 < brainsqueezer> u must
19:59 < Wombert> no
19:59 < brainsqueezer> must be too versatile
19:59 < Wombert> no
19:59 < Wombert> no
19:59 < Wombert> no
19:59 < Wombert> no
19:59 < Wombert> you can simply have, for example, a database table with articles that should appear on the front page
19:59 < Wombert> and your FrontpageAction grabs all these articles
19:59 < Wombert> and the view renders them
19:59 < brainsqueezer> yes
20:00 < Wombert> if the iraq story should have a huuuuge photo, fine
20:00 < Wombert> then you need to write code for it
20:00 < Wombert> changing the template to cater for CONTENT on a regular basis is stupid
20:00 < brainsqueezer> but design must be anything in the emigination of an editor
20:00 < Wombert> if that is your answer, then you're asking the wrong question
20:00 < brainsqueezer> *imagination
20:01 < brainsqueezer> any designg must be possible
20:01 < Wombert> and it can be done, without problems, with a normal MVC/push approach
20:02 < brainsqueezer> like 3 columns and in the middle 2 join together
20:02 < Wombert> yes, sure
20:03 < Wombert> you have an interface where the editors can set the layout
20:03 < Wombert> and the template displays the columns accordingly
20:03 < Wombert> with the data pulled from the action
20:03 < Wombert> that was processed in the view
20:03 < Wombert> no problem
20:04 < Wombert> do you want to build a newspaper site?
20:05 < brainsqueezer> i have done
20:05 < brainsqueezer> im working to improve it
20:06 < brainsqueezer> it is small but very interesting to design
20:06 < Wombert> cool
20:06 < Wombert> I need to run now tho :)
20:07 < brainsqueezer> but for designing best way is not a graphical editor
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20:07 < brainsqueezer> for a good result best results are done with a template editer
20:07 < brainsqueezer> *editor
20:07 < brainsqueezer> gimes more freedom
20:08 < brainsqueezer> *gives
20:08 < brainsqueezer> so best way of working is having a template where yoi can with an special syntax add columns of a topic, images videos and action parses it and decides what info to retrieve
20:12 < brainsqueezer> Wombert: have u got any way to improve it?
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20:28 < JanK__> how to only validate a value, but not export it? i've got a captcha validator which validates against the stored value, but to learn it clean, how to skip that varificated string
20:42 < _cheerios> another php orm (atleast new to me) http://junctionphp.com/
20:44 < impl> The two classes I've looked at so far haven't impressed me greatly
20:45 < impl> Let's see...
20:47 < impl> the model layout is inspired by Java beans for sure
20:49 < impl> hibernate too
20:50 < impl> http://www.hibernate.org/hib_docs/v3/reference/en/html/tutorial.html#tutorial-associations-mappinguser vs http://junction.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/Schema/JunctionUser.xml
20:50 < impl> hehe
20:53 < _cheerios> inspired, you could say!
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21:01 < Wombert> JanK__: how do you mean?
21:01 < Wombert> like on GET?
21:01 < Wombert> or what?
21:01  * Wombert wonders
21:02 < Wombert> yes, junction does not seem impressive
21:02 < Wombert> nice website tho
21:02 < Wombert> (which again proves the point that that doesn't tell anything)
21:03 < JanK__> if i get the user parameter, i just want to validate it but just forget the value given by the user. (only the varification matters)
21:05 < Wombert> don't think that's possible
21:05 < Wombert> does it matter if it's there?
21:06 < Wombert> I mean sure you could do a random validator that depends on the other one, will never match, and set the severity to none
21:06 < Wombert> but what's the point :p
21:06 < Wombert> <validator class="captcha" provides="captcha_correct" />
21:06 < Wombert> <validator class="regex" pattern="^$" depends="captcha_correct" severity="none">
21:07 < Wombert> no wait not pattern
21:07 < Wombert> pattern must be a parameter
21:07 < Wombert> but you get the idea, right
21:10 < JanK__> yeah, ok, i thought you talked about it and its just a setting, but i must be wrong
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--- Day changed Sat Oct 06 2007
01:21 -!- Whisller [n=example@77-252-56-2.ip.netia.com.pl] has joined #agavi
01:21 < Whisller> hi
01:24 < Whisller> is here someone?
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01:45 < Whisller> Wombert: are you here?
01:50 < Wombert> yo
01:51 < Whisller> I have a little problem, if you have a time. On mailing list
01:51 < Whisller> As I remember you show me how I can fix it...or it is another error huh
01:52 < Whisller> Now is "Fatal error: Out of memory (allocated 7602176) (tried to allocate 63 bytes)" 
01:52 < Whisller> http://groups.google.com/group/agavi-users/browse_thread/thread/8bce034e069cc498
01:55 < Whisller> This error is when I'm trying log in to page
01:57 < Wombert> ...
01:57 < Wombert> then increase the memory limit
01:59 < Whisller> But I set to 1000MB ;)
01:59 < Whisller> And this same
02:00 < Wombert> 7602176
02:00 < Wombert> is not 1000MB
02:00 < Wombert> that sounds like an apache limit
02:00 < Wombert> not like a PHP one
02:01 < Wombert> it's a server problem, not an Agavi problem
--- Log closed Sat Oct 06 02:06:16 2007
--- Log opened Sat Oct 06 02:06:20 2007
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02:06 < Whisller> hmm
02:06 < Wombert> 8MB memory limit, dear god, it's 2007...
02:06 < Wombert> the PHP default is 128MB now
02:06 < Whisller> So this memory limit is set on apache ?
02:06 < Wombert> yes, it seems so
02:07 < Whisller> shit
02:07 < Wombert> since you "get out of memory", and not "memory limit exceeded"
02:07 < Whisller> hmm Huh yes, I didn't saw this difference huh
02:16 < Whisller> Wombert: btw thanks :)
02:26 < Wombert> sure thing
02:28 < impl> ackackackack
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03:08 < Whisller> good night
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07:41 < splatch`> Whisller: :)
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08:17 < _cheerios> woof
08:17 < splatch`> meow
08:17 < splatch`> miau :)
08:19 < _cheerios> good morning people on the internet!
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08:28 < _cheerios> ror vs php video was pretty good :D
08:28 < _cheerios> http://www.railsenvy.com/2007/8/24/rails-vs-php
08:31 < splatch`> again?
08:35 < v-dogg> heh
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08:46 < _cheerios> http://paulgraham.com/webstartups.html saturday morning reading
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11:46 < _cheerios> Hi, my name is Frank and I'm an alcoholic.
11:49 < _cheerios> Practicing for the future.
12:33 < kaos|work> hey 
12:33 < kaos|work> can you lot pls look  at http://trac.agavi.org/wiki/Documentation/NeedsDocumentation and add what you would want to see documented ?
12:33 < kaos|work> i want to have a rather complete list first, so we can think about how to structure that entire beast
12:36 < _cheerios> you want a complete list of things that will never get done? :)
12:37 < kaos|work> well, its a lot easier to work on documentation if you have some basic path you can follow
12:38 < kaos|work> because right now its just a massive amount of things to be done, but if broken into smaller steps it's way easier to write a few words when you're bored ;)
12:40 < _cheerios> divide & conquer!
12:57 < kaos|work> command&conquer?
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13:52 < JanK__> cant i store a AgaviModel in the session? (as a user attribute)
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13:59 < JanK__> probably this is a bug in agavi? If i access a method of an object stored as a user attribute, i get the error: "The script tried to execute a method or access a property of an incomplete object. Please ensure that the class definition was loaded before unserialize gets called or provide a __autoload function"
14:00 < JanK__> i forgot to mention that i did this from a validator
14:09 < JanK__> require'ing the Model and its super classes before Agavi::bootstrap fixed the problem
14:28 < v-dogg> or you can put it in autoload.xml
14:30 < v-dogg> context->getModel figures out the file and requires it but when you reload it from session data php doesn't know how to handle it
14:35 < JanK__> adding it to the modules autoload.xml didn't solve my problem, i'll try the global autoload.xml
14:42 < JanK__> ok, i needed to put the model in the global autoload.xml, i think it should also be possible to do this in the module's autoload.xml
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15:15 < MrJeep> module autoload ?
15:15 < MrJeep> there is a module autoload now ?
15:15 < MrJeep> didn't know about it 
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15:20 < JanK__> MrJeep: if you place an autoload.xml in modules/<module>/config that will load in addition to your global autoload, as every other .xml configuration file
15:20 < JanK__> but that didn't work for my validator
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16:38 < JanK__> hey Wombert, you here?
16:38 < Wombert> hi
16:38 < JanK__> i think i've found a bug in agavi
16:39 < Wombert> oO
16:39 < JanK__> when i save a model as a user attribute, i need to add the model to the autoload.xml to unserialize it, thats no problem
16:40 < Wombert> ah, hehe
16:40 < Wombert> you can't do that out of the box
16:40 < JanK__> sure
16:40 < Wombert> no, you need to have sleep and wakeup handlers
16:40 < Wombert> otherwise it also serializes the context and ALL of agavi
16:40 < Wombert> not good
16:40 < Wombert> but good catch, I'll add that to AgaviModel
16:41 < JanK__> but when i want to access that serialized model from a validator, the module's autoload.xml is not used
16:41 < Wombert> I see
16:42 < JanK__> it works if i add the model + super classes in the global autoload.xml
16:43 < Wombert> yes
16:43 < Wombert> I don't think this is a bug
16:43 < Wombert> what you have is not a normal model, it's a global model
16:43 < Wombert> put it in app/models
16:43 < Wombert> :)
16:45 < Wombert> and call getModel() with null as the model name
16:45 < Wombert> module name, sorry
16:46 < Wombert> you know... you want to use the model outside of it's module, that is not possible... that's what global models are for :)
16:48 < JanK__> is it global usage, when i use the model from a validator which is in the same module?
16:52 < CIA-11> david * r2112 /branches/0.11/src/model/AgaviModel.class.php: Added __sleep() and __wakeup() which prevent Context serialization to AgaviModel, closes #581
16:52 < Wombert> JanK__: but that shouldn't happen
16:53 < Wombert> oh well of course :p
16:53 < Wombert> it's the session, yeah
16:53 < Wombert> yes but still, nothing I can do about it
16:53 < Wombert> I'd have to scan the modules dir for modules, then load all autoloads and so on...
16:53 < Wombert> can't do that, sorry
16:53 < Wombert> you need to use a global model
16:59 < JanK__> okay
17:00 < JanK__> i just thought its probably a agavi bug, since the validator was in the module dir, just like the other files, but i already thought that its probably caused technically
17:11 < Wombert> php unserializes the object when it restores the session
17:11 < Wombert> that happens way way way before the validator is run
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22:37  * _cheerios pokes
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--- Day changed Sun Oct 07 2007
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00:47 < Wombert> hai :>
00:51 < impl> hai
00:53 < Wombert> what's up
00:53 < Wombert> eh wtf
00:54 < Wombert> why's the china race at 8
00:54 < Wombert> and not at 6
00:54  * Wombert is confused
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05:32 < Arme[N]> Huomenta!
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07:34 < MikeSeth> oh hi i fixd ur door
07:39 < _cheerios> eh?
07:40 < _cheerios> LEWIS HAMILTON RETIRES FROM CHINESE GRAND PRIX o_O
07:48 < _cheerios> "Job vacancy: McLaren race engineer. Must be able to spot when tyres are falling to bits." :p
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08:42 < splatch`_> oi! :)
08:44 -!- splatch`_ is now known as splatch`
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12:41 < _cheerios> http://torttu.net/temp/hamilton_out.gif
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14:25  * Wombert yawns
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14:37 < CIA-11> david * r2113 /branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php: Fixed a couple of search/replace lapses, removed unnecessary logging code, added checks to user-defined xpath queries. Thanks Ross for pointing me to that, closes #580
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14:46 < CIA-11> david * r2114 /branches/0.11/src/controller/AgaviExecutionContainer.class.php: Do not store global request data copy in serialized execution containers, and restore current global request data if possible on wakeup. Refs #544
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16:48 < _cheerios> x_X
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16:58 < _cheerios> suffocating while sleeping feels too real :ugh:
16:59 < Wombert> eh?
17:03 < _cheerios> i was just napping, and that was the end of my dream
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17:16 < Wombert> ewww
17:16 < Wombert> uncool
17:16 < Wombert> home ->
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18:55 < splatch`> oi!
18:59 < impl> io~
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21:00 < _cheerios> \o/ for lunix
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--- Day changed Mon Oct 08 2007
04:41 < Wombert> huomenta
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06:43 < _cheerios> huomenta 'all
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06:57 < Whisller> Hi
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07:10 < E_mE> huomenta!! Bus >>>> Work!
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07:13 < Wombert> huomenta
07:13 < Wombert> :>
07:14  * _cheerios slaps Wombert with a what's up trout
07:15 < Wombert> nothing
07:15 < Wombert> alice is coming today :)
07:15 < Wombert> I hope she's wearing that red dress
07:15 < Wombert> mmmmh
07:15 < Wombert> www.alice-dsl.de
07:15 < Wombert> xD
07:15 < Wombert> oh she has no red dress there oO
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07:49 < RossC0> Huomenta!
07:49 < RossC0> Top Gear zomg :D
07:51 < Wombert> hai
07:51 < Wombert> yeah pretty cool but I really hope that was the last show with just one car review
07:52 < Wombert> (and you can't even buy that ugly, stupid, ugly golf thing)
07:52 < Wombert> but
07:52 < Wombert> I need a fast car
07:52 < Wombert> and then I need to go from davos to... wherever that was
07:52 < ttj> Don't we all.
07:52 < Wombert> reeeaaaaalllly nice roads duuuude
08:00 < RossC0> May was excellent
08:00 < Wombert> haha
08:00 < Wombert> but
08:00 < Wombert> they didn't talk about the cars enough
08:00 < Wombert> I think
08:01 < RossC0> Nah - its all about them and the 5th Gear Terrorists !
08:01 < Wombert> and may could have stopped the whining for a second and hit the gas and leave the others behind :p
08:01 < Wombert> hahaha
08:02 < Wombert> "when vicki butler-henderson torched our cool wall..."
08:50 < ttj> Wait a min... Wha?
08:50 < ttj> Vicki torched the CoolWall? :o
09:02 < Wombert> no :p
09:02 < Wombert> but there was a fire at a barn where lots of the top gear stuff was stored
09:02 < Wombert> cool wall is gone, and the news seats and stuff
09:03 < Wombert> arson
09:03 < Wombert> of course, they said it was fifth gear because they are jealous :p
09:03 < Wombert> WOOT
09:03 < Wombert> GUYS
09:03 < Wombert> WOOOT
09:03 < Wombert> IDEA IDEA IDEA IDEA TIME!
09:03 < Wombert> harrrr
09:03 < Wombert> this is gonna work!
09:03 < Wombert> hooray!
09:04  * RossC0 slaps Wombert - "you're hysterical man!"
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09:05 < Wombert> QUICK QUICK GIVE ME A BAG TO BREATE INTO
09:05 < Wombert> xD
09:05 < Wombert> anyway
09:05  * RossC0 administers a whisky 
09:05 < Wombert> I have an idea for this whole global request data validation lock zomg doohickey
09:06 < RossC0> ah ok
09:06 < Wombert> ExecutionFIlter::initialize()
09:06 < Wombert> there it grabs a copy!
09:06 < Wombert> woot :>
09:06 < Wombert> and then we lock it down
09:07 < Wombert> inside teh execution container
09:07 < Wombert> can't do it in the dispatch filter, unfortunately, which is a huuuuge shame, but oh well
09:08 < Wombert> oh man locking it in dispatch filter would be oh-so-ace
09:08 < RossC0> so why cant we do it there?
09:08 < Wombert> in any case, filters that need the global request data can obtain a copy in initialize
09:08 < Wombert> well look at the dispatch filter
09:08 < Wombert> 	public function execute(AgaviFilterChain $filterChain, AgaviExecutionContainer $container)
09:08 < Wombert> 	{
09:08 < Wombert> 		$container->setResponse($container->execute());
09:08 < Wombert> 	}
09:09 < Wombert> but we need the global request data in the execution filter... because global_request_data is a cache group :S
09:09 < Wombert> we could of course remove global request data from the available sources...
09:10 < Wombert> that would completely isolate execution containers...
09:10 < Wombert> an idea that I like very much...
09:10  * Wombert ponders
09:12 < Wombert> that would _really_ be great since the request would be locked once
09:12 < Wombert> and unlocked once
09:13  * Wombert ponders
09:13 < Wombert> I'd still love to have a system where the... validation manager... can simply grab the request data, but the action can't
09:13 < Wombert> I mean, hrhr, we could do that with debug_backtrace, but that sucks, really does :P
09:17 < Wombert> ponders
09:17 < Wombert> how slow is that exactly...
09:18 < Wombert> on my box, 15ms for 100 calls
09:18  * Wombert ponders
09:18 < Wombert> plus going through the array looking for objects that are instanceof AgaviAction or instanceof AgaviView
09:18  * Wombert ponders
09:19 < Wombert> no, too hacky
09:19 < Wombert> how do we do this
09:19 < Wombert> there must be a way
09:20 < Wombert> hmmmm
09:20  * Wombert ponders
09:21 < Wombert> there are exactly two problematic points
09:21 < Wombert> a) when execution filter builds cache groups, it needs to access global request data
09:21 < Wombert> b) when reading a cache, and a container (of a slot) is restored, it needs a fresh copy of the global request data
09:22 < Wombert> we could get rid of problem a) by dropping support for that
09:22 < Wombert> but we cannot get around b) as far as I can tell
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09:22 < Wombert> (currently that is done in AgaviExecutionContainer::__wakeup()
09:32 < MikeSeth> 090746 <Wombert> that would completely isolate execution containers...
09:32 < MikeSeth> YES
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09:34 < Wombert> MikeSeth: yeah :< but can't do
09:34 < Wombert> they would not be completely isolated ofc
09:35 < Wombert> $controller->createExecutionContainer() would still give a copy of the request data
09:35 < Wombert> but that works even if the request is locked
09:35 < MikeSeth> the problem is Context::getRequest() being globally accessible
09:35 < Wombert> you mean Request::getRequestData(), right
09:38 < Wombert> okay
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09:38 < Wombert> dsl test
09:38 < Wombert> bbiab
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09:44 < Wombert_> that didn't work
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10:30 < Whisller> ehhh shit
10:30 < E_mE> huomenta!
10:31 < Whisller> Wombert: I still have this bug and programmers from my client company said they found a bug :/ But fuck where, so on my server everything works fine
10:31 < Whisller> Fuck fuck fuck
10:33 < E_mE> :S
10:36 < Wombert> what?
10:40 < Whisller> Still "out of memmory", and they think is error in my application.
10:42 < Wombert> ...
10:42 < Wombert> no
10:42 < Wombert> the memory limit is 8MB or something
10:42 < Wombert> that is not enough
10:42 < Wombert> fix your server configuration
10:44 < Whisller> Can you tell me which server option they should change? Because they still are talking me "Is something wrong with your application, your application is trying to allocate 1.200mb ram THERE MUST BE BUG" and so on :/ 
10:44 < Wombert> no
10:44 < Wombert> I am not an apache or php support idiot, sorry
10:44 < Wombert> and who says your application is trying to allocate 1.2GB
10:45 < Whisller> administrations of this server
10:45 < Wombert> 01:52 < Whisller> Now is "Fatal error: Out of memory (allocated 7602176) (tried to allocate 63 bytes)" 
10:45 < Whisller> They "test everything" and want mooney for show how to fix it 
10:47 < Whisller> "ww bardzo szybko z 
10:47 < Whisller> około 12MB do około 1.2GB" -> www very fast from 12Mb to 1.2GB
10:47 < Whisller> quote
10:48 < Wombert> could be a libxml problem
10:48 < Wombert> check mailing list I wrote a suggestion
10:48 < Whisller> ok
10:51 < _cheerios> RossC0, did you watch the gltail bukkakke visualization? That one was the funniest thing to open early in the morning.
10:52 < Wombert> the WHAT?
10:52 < _cheerios> http://www.fudgie.org/
10:53 < RossC0> the urinating logs?
10:54 < _cheerios> hehe, them!
10:54 < Wombert> bukkakke?
10:54  * Wombert shakes head
10:55 < _cheerios> i so want to install gl drivers for my ati card now
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11:03 < Wombert> YOUR LUNIX COMES WITHOUT OPENGL
11:03 < Wombert> LOLZ
11:03 < Wombert> DAT IS SO NOOB
11:04 < _cheerios> NOOB!
11:24 < Whisller> Is possible to switch off, validate xml files? I'm thinking about "check is this xml is correct".
11:25 < Wombert> ...
11:25  * Wombert falls over
11:26 < Wombert> Whisller: did you even read my email to the list?
11:26 < Wombert> it says:
11:26 < Wombert> This might be a memory leak in libxml. Copy over the entire  
11:26 < Wombert> config_handlers.xml from config/defaults/ to your application and  
11:26 < Wombert> remove all "validate" attributes. That might solve the problem.
11:28 < Whisller> ok
11:28 < Whisller> :)
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12:13 < Wombert> aaah fuck
12:13 < Wombert> MikeSeth: this is not gonna work :
12:13 < Wombert> <
12:13 < Wombert> or well actually it would work
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12:45 < Wombert> mmmh
12:45 < Wombert> beer
12:45 < Wombert> and fleischpflanzerlsemmel :>
12:45 < Wombert> and fruit salad :>
12:48 < E_mE> Wombert: I'm trying to apply the AgaviConsole patch on a copy of the src/ folder and it keeps erroring.. what version was the patch file for?
12:48 < Wombert> I don't know
12:49 < Wombert> and as I said
12:49 < Wombert> don't do that
12:49  * Wombert sighs
12:49  * Wombert checks
12:50 < Wombert> look at the patch
12:50 < Wombert> it applies to the root, not to src/
12:50 < Wombert> copy everything or change the paths in the patch
12:50 < E_mE> ah see
12:50 < E_mE> i was copyin the patch into patch_src/ which was a copy of src :S
12:53 < E_mE> when it asks for file to path, do i create my own as in VinoAgaviConsoleRequest ?!
12:53 < Wombert> ?
12:53 < E_mE> |Index: src/request/AgaviConsoleRequest.class.php
12:53 < E_mE> |===================================================================
12:53 < E_mE> |--- src/request/AgaviConsoleRequest.class.php  (revision 1841)
12:53 < E_mE> |+++ src/request/AgaviConsoleRequest.class.php  (working copy)
12:53 < E_mE> --------------------------
12:53 < E_mE> File to patch: 
12:54 < Wombert> ...
12:54 < Wombert> why don't you copy the patch to patch_src/
12:54 < Wombert> fix the paths
12:54 < Wombert> and do "patch  AgaviConsole.patch"
12:54 < E_mE> ok
12:57 < E_mE> don't work... screen just stays still..
12:58 < Wombert> ?
12:58 < Wombert> you mean you press return and nothing happens?
12:58 < E_mE> press return and it just stayed still
12:58 < E_mE> so ^c it
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12:58 < Wombert> patch . AgaviConsole.patch
12:58 < Wombert> or how about "patch --help" ...
12:59 < E_mE> oh...
12:59 < E_mE> well it has created a file
12:59 < Wombert> AgaviConsole.patch.rej ?
13:00 < E_mE> no AgaviConsoleRouting.class.php in the root of src/
13:00 < Wombert> well then you ruined the paths instead of fixing them :p
13:01 < Wombert> but at least it worked...
13:01 < E_mE> hasnt created anything else 
13:01 < E_mE> or is it only ment to create that?
13:01 < Wombert> I'm sure it did
13:10 < E_mE> its not working... ill hack away at it later
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13:26 < Wombert> heyyyyy
13:26 < Wombert> rails finally caught up with agavi :> http://blog.nbwd.co.uk/assets/2007/8/29/presentation.pdf
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13:49 < Wombert> MikeSeth: got it
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14:02  * E_mE whispers quietly... looks like my patch file was dublicated 3 times into one file  somehow :/ 
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14:15 < _cheerios> http://www.jihadonyou.com/
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14:18 < E_mE> _cheerios: hehe thats nice and tasteless
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14:22 < E_mE> Wombert: i only need the routing, request and response file correct?
14:23 < Wombert> yes
14:29 < CIA-11> david * r2115 /branches/0.11/src/controller/AgaviExecutionContainer.class.php: Made global request data copy unavailable from the outside of execution containers until cloned in execute(), refs #544
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14:43 < E_mE> Wombert: its working now :) but its returning the header and menu templates :S
14:43 < E_mE> so will i just need to setup and output type in the view
14:43 < E_mE> to prevent it returning any HTML?
14:45 < E_mE> also i'm getting the following warning:  Warning: session_start(): Cannot send session cache limiter - headers already sent (output started at /var/www/segilive/app/lib/request/VinoAgaviConsoleRequest.class.php:136) in /usr/local/src/agavi/src/storage/AgaviSessionStorage.class.php on line 102
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14:51 < Wombert> E_mE: use NullSTorage
14:51 < Wombert> and yes of course you need to set up an output type for that context
14:56 < E_mE> Wombert: ive looked in VinoAgaviConsole request and cant seem to find anything relating to SessionStorage... line 136 is the end of hte file as well
14:56 < Wombert> ...
14:56 < Wombert> factories.xml
14:56 < E_mE> ahh :)
14:59 < E_mE> wwooooo thank you Wombert :D
15:00 < Wombert> now set up an output type, with a simple layout of just one layer
15:00 < Wombert> if you need layouts at all
15:00 < Wombert> you can also use the routing to match the command line arguments or so
15:00 < Wombert> not sure
15:01 < E_mE> so i create <output_type name="cli"></output_type>
15:01 < Wombert> pretty much, yes
15:02 < Wombert> and make that default
15:04 < Wombert> guys...
15:04 < Wombert> here is my approach to implementing request locking:
15:22 < Wombert> oh dear god this is so fucked up
15:50 < Wombert> okay
15:51 < Wombert> it cannot be done
15:51 < Wombert> not with our current architecture
15:51 < Wombert> I'll add view initialize() methods to the lock protection, and that's it
16:04 < CIA-11> david * r2116 /branches/0.11/src/core/AgaviContext.class.php: Added missing isset() check
16:05 < E_mE> Wombert: im executing $this->container->setOutputType($this->getContext()->getController()->getOutputType('cli')); but its throwing an error back
16:05 < E_mE> trying to call my console Redirect
16:05 < Wombert> !?!?!?
16:05 < Wombert> a) could you PLEASE WITH A CHERRY ON TOP bother to paste the error message
16:06 < Wombert> b) why don't you just set "cli" as the default output type for the "cli" context!?
16:06 < E_mE> the error message is in pure HTML shinny.php 
16:06 < Wombert> and in there, you will find a proper error message...
16:07 < E_mE> <h1>BadMethodCallException</h1>
16:07 < E_mE>                 <p>An exception of type <strong>BadMethodCallException</strong> was thrown, but did not get caught during the execution of the request. You will find information provided by the exception along with a stack trace below.</p>
16:07 < E_mE>                 <p id="message">
16:07 < E_mE>                         Redirects are not implemented for Console.              </p>
16:07 < E_mE>                 <h3>Stack Trace</h3>
16:07 < E_mE>                 <ol>
16:07 < Wombert> okay
16:07 < Wombert> there you have the problem :p
16:07 < Wombert> and that is certainly not happening because of the setOutputType call
16:07 < E_mE> i created the function which returns a exception
16:08 < Wombert> what function
16:08 < E_mE> okay... how do i set up a whole new context in output_Type.xml? or is there a readup on agavi.org on regards to it?
16:08 < CIA-11> david * r2117 /branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviExecutionFilter.class.php: Fixed global request data being accessible in View::initialize() (and in the constructor), closes #544 (best we can do with our current architecture)
16:08 < Wombert> ...
16:09 < Wombert> please, E_mE, think for one second
16:09 < Wombert> (besides the fact that it is in the docs)
16:09 < Wombert> look at your factories.xml
16:10 < Wombert> do you see the <configuration> blocks
16:10 < E_mE> yes <configuration enviroment="cli">
16:11 < Wombert> as I explained last time, you can make any configuration directives specific to a certain environment by having an environment="..." attribute
16:11 < Wombert> no, no, enviroNNNNment
16:11 < Wombert> and "cli" is not an environment
16:11 < Wombert> environments are, usually, machines where your application runs. "development-wombert", "production1", "testing"
16:12 < Wombert> you can also make most configuration directives specific to a certain context using a "context" attribute on this element
16:12 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/samples/app/config/output_types.xml
16:12 < Wombert> there
16:12 < Wombert> an example
16:12 < Wombert> ...
16:12 < Wombert> this is not easy
16:13 < Wombert> err, not difficult
16:13 < Wombert> you just PLEASE need to take your fingers off the keyboard for a second and have the will to understand it :p
16:13 < Wombert> it's very, very simple
16:13 < E_mE> thanks Wombert... okay... 
16:13 < E_mE> ill print it off and read it on the bus :)
16:14 < Wombert> <configuration context="cli">
16:14 < Wombert>   <output_types default="cli">
16:14 < Wombert>     <output_type name="cli" />
16:14 < Wombert>   </output_type>
16:14 < Wombert> </configuration>
16:14 < Wombert> this is then only valid for the "cli" context (NOT!!!! environment)
16:15 < Wombert> you bootstrap an environment at the beginning to give your application a sandbox to play in
16:15 < Wombert> your application can then run in one or more contexts (even at the same time)
16:15 < Wombert> so in the "production" env, an app can be available as a "web" context, and as "cli" on the command line
16:16 < Wombert> settings.xml is not per-context, it's loaded before agavi even knows what a context is, but you can still do this
16:16 < Wombert> <exception_template context="cli">%core.agavi_dir%/exception/plaintext.php</exception_template>
16:16 < Wombert> then you have nicer exception messages on the command line
16:17 < Wombert> is this a bit more clear now?
16:17 < Wombert> (note that your <output_type> tag can also have an attribute "exception_template" for even more fine-grained control)
16:17 < Wombert> (that way, you can output different error pages for HTML, RSS, JSON)
16:18 < Wombert> but
16:18 < Wombert> I'm headed home now
16:19 < E_mE> thank you a million Wombert
16:19 < E_mE> much appreiated. sorry to stress you somewhat
16:19 < E_mE> ive copied the convo and will read it again till i make sense
16:20 < Wombert> don't be confused by the <sandbox>
16:21 < Wombert> laters =>
16:21 < E_mE> bye and thanx
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17:15 < Wombert> re
17:21 < ttj> Fw.
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20:07 < _cheerios> "Man Claims iPod Set His Pants Aflame", tagged: apple, handheld, liarliar, liarliarpantsonfire, iburn
20:07 < _cheerios> love the last one
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20:36 < CIA-11> david * r2118 /branches/0.11/src/routing/AgaviRouting.class.php: Fixed problem where routing callbacks could not set optional parameters, closes #579
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20:45 < CIA-11> david * r2119 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: changelog update
21:18 < _cheerios> there's a term for me on wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_poor
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23:32 < Wombert> hai impl 
23:47 < v-dogg> puuh...
23:47 < v-dogg> so.. tired.. and bored...
23:49  * v-dogg @ army repetition course
--- Day changed Tue Oct 09 2007
00:23 < Wombert> eww
00:24 < Wombert> how long
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01:45 < jake> did things get figured out for console mode?
01:57 < jake> I'm specifically thinking about cron jobs
02:00 < jake> I see contexts as being an available option, I'm just wondering how the framework deals with php-cli vs mod_php, since php itself distinguishes between the two
02:01 < impl> I'm not sure
02:01 < impl> It is theoretically supported
02:01 < impl> practically though ... nfc
02:04 < jake> heh, I'll have to play with it. command line is always a problem
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06:46 < shoan> huomenta
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07:20 < RossC0> Huomenta!!
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08:04 < _cheerios> http://www.surfare.net/~toolman/temp/diagram.html
08:04 < _cheerios> only missing a drag and drop interface to it, and a very useful tool we have
08:16 < RossC0> ?
08:16 < RossC0> ah works in FF
08:18 < _cheerios> there was a note about safari, if you were using that.
08:19 < MikeSeth> omg transition visualization
08:19  * MikeSeth <3's
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08:29 < E_mE> huomenta!
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09:31 < MikeSeth> mmmmp
09:31 < MikeSeth> do I need to do something special to get the read validators to work?
09:53 < MikeSeth> teh bug!
09:54 < MikeSeth> You can't have validators with the same name in read/write contexts
09:54 < MikeSeth> if you do that, the write validator will override the read validator, and will not be executed because of method checks
09:54 < MikeSeth> opinions plz?
09:54 < _cheerios> wtf
09:55 < RossC0> waa?
09:57 < MikeSeth> http://pastebin.ca/730543
09:57 < RossC0> validateCommon, validateRead, validateWrite
09:57 < RossC0> ah hmm
09:57 < RossC0> ignore me
09:58 < RossC0> erk
09:58 < RossC0> change the name?
09:58 < MikeSeth> Yep.
09:59 < RossC0> as a stop gap and file a ticket / if you have time add a patch
09:59 < RossC0> :D
09:59 < RossC0> but that is crazy
09:59 < MikeSeth> happens because of this:
09:59 < MikeSeth> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/validator/AgaviValidationManager.class.php#L264
10:07 < MikeSeth> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/582
10:13 < _cheerios> doctrine site with a new look. those guys are working hard!
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10:16 < MikeSeth> Wombert: http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/582
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10:19 < kaos|work> MikeSeth: this is not fixable
10:19 < kaos|work> at least not cleanly
10:20 < kaos|work> validator names must be unique
10:21 < kaos|work> there is no exception to it ... the validation system itself doesn't know if the validator is in read or write or whatever context
10:21 < kaos|work> and since you can access  validators by names
10:21 < kaos|work> using the same name twice simply wont work
10:22 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: makes sense
10:22 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: the loader should prevent things like this and throw an Exception
10:22 < kaos|work> yup
10:22 < kaos|work> that it should do indeed
10:23 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: would you adjust the ticket? or better yet do me a password reset
10:23 < kaos|work> hehe, k
10:37 < CIA-11> dominik * r2120 /branches/0.11/src/routing/AgaviRouting.class.php: Proper fix for #579
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10:46 < Wombert> MikeSeth: in case you didn't read it, the locking in dispatch filter cannot be done
10:46 < Wombert> with our current architecture, we cannot do any of what was planned
10:46 < Wombert> it's simply not doable
10:46 < Wombert> a huge army of chicken and eggs
10:47 < Wombert> I went over it in detail yesterday and every time I had a solution I encountered a problem
10:47 < Wombert> until I realized that, for several reasons, it's unfeasible anyway
10:57 < E_mE> wombert ive setup the output_layers and environments and contexts as you described, i now understand it thank you... just need to mentally link it all together..  i've now created executeConsole(); in the View but my template data is not being returned to the screen
10:57 < MikeSeth> Wombert: so you're just gonna leave it like that until 2.x?
11:03 < Wombert> MikeSeth: yes
11:03 < Wombert> E_mE: are you loading a layout?
11:05 < Wombert> do you have sth like setupConsole() or setupCli() (what's the OT called?) in your base view that does loadLayout() etc?
11:06 < E_mE> i did setup a setupConsole()
11:07 < E_mE> and use loadlayout but said it couldn't find it... but im guessing i need to create a <layouts name="cli_default"><layers><layer name="content" /></layers></layouts>
11:08 < Wombert> ah yes of course
11:08 < Wombert> no need for the <layers> btw
11:08 < E_mE> :D
11:10 < Wombert> alternatively you can return the response content from the view
11:10 < Wombert> saves you writing templates
11:10 < Wombert> oh and by the way
11:10 < Wombert> if you use a template
11:10 < Wombert> it would use the...  html one right now
11:10 < Wombert> you need to tell the layer to look elsewhere
11:11 < Wombert> e.g. <parameter name="extension">.console.php</parameter>
11:11 < Wombert> (assuming you use php templates)
11:13 < E_mE> so you think im better off just sendinga  setContent() in the view?
11:13 < Wombert> no, just return "lala";
11:13 < Wombert> it depends
11:13 < Wombert> if you need to return one-liners, the view might be enough
11:22  * Wombert yawns
11:22 < Wombert> office ->
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13:14 < E_mE> just to wobble my memory
13:14 < E_mE> if i have a static public function sendmail() in a class
13:14 < E_mE> and create a autoload on the class
13:15 < E_mE> and run $sm = $this->getContext()->getModel('vinoMail'); and then run $sm::sendmail() ... this is not allowed due to the static state of the function?
13:19 < MikeSeth> no, it's a syntax limitation
13:20 < MikeSeth> call_user_func(array($sm, 'sendmail'), ..)
13:20 < MikeSeth> also, models are singleton instances, why use static methods
13:21 < E_mE> okay... ive learnt me lesson
13:48 < kaos|work> hmmm, mike ... i've just been thinking about that validator issue
13:49 < kaos|work> and even throwing an error message is harder then i thought
13:50 < kaos|work> since this would break "extending" configs, since you couldn't overwrite the validator anymore
13:51 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: then the validators should only be loaded for the current mode
13:52 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: there's no reason to load write validators for the read mode
13:52 < kaos|work> yeah, but i don't know the mode when compiling the configs
13:53 < MikeSeth> they're all loaded into flat namespave aren't they?
13:53 < kaos|work> yup
13:53 < kaos|work> and when storing them for each mode
13:53 < MikeSeth> all I can think of is a fat warning comment in the manual and demo app validation files
13:54 < kaos|work> it's still problematic finding out if one should overwrite or throw an error
13:55 < kaos|work> i can definitly throw an error for simple cases like same name in read and write
13:55 < kaos|work> but with the scenario
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13:55 < kaos|work> validator defined in a base file with modes read & write
13:56 < kaos|work> and the validation file "extends" the original validator once for read and once for write
13:56 < kaos|work> but i should probably just throw an error there since this would break as well
13:56 < kaos|work> hmm
13:57 < MikeSeth> maybe you should do it barf lock style
13:57 < MikeSeth> by default, throw exceptions at name collision
13:57 < MikeSeth> whoever needs the extended functionality can flip the lock
13:58 < kaos|work> well, the "functionality" just doesn't work
13:58 < MikeSeth> fixable though?
13:58 < kaos|work> maybe
13:58 < kaos|work> needs some refactoring i guess
14:10 < kaos|work> hmm, ok, i can throw errors for validators defined in the same <configuration> block
14:10 < kaos|work> and always overwrite validators defined in parent configuration blocks
14:19 < kaos|work> hmm
14:19 < kaos|work> i think i can even fix the issue completely
14:19 < MikeSeth> hmmm?
14:20 < kaos|work> the validators get initialized quite later in the execution filter
14:20 < kaos|work> where the method is known already
14:20 < kaos|work> and then i can use some name mangling internally to differentiate between the validators
14:27 < E_mE> Wombert: do i need to include anything to make PDO work with the cli context? i keep getting Fatal error: Class 'PDO' not found in /var/www/segilive/app/models/vinoDatabaseModel.class.php on line 38
14:28 < Wombert> E_mE: your cli php does not have pdo compiled in
14:28 < Wombert> maybe you're using the wrong php binary
14:28 < E_mE> :: WAH ::
14:32 < E_mE> Wombert: thank you... i just forgot the extension=pdo.so in my cli php.ini... d'oh!
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15:04 < RossC0> Wombert: - How'd I use the equals validator and error messages?  
15:04 < RossC0> currently its not outputting an error message just the markup
15:05 < Wombert> 2tics
15:07 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: if that's the case then the validators may be loaded only for the active method, which fundamentally solves the problem without breaking compatibility and limiting flexibility
15:07 < kaos|work> MikeSeth: that's my plan
15:08 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: kick ass :D
15:10 < Wombert> RossC0: 
15:10 < Wombert> what's the problem again? :p
15:10 < Wombert> can you show your filter config
15:13 < RossC0> sure
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15:43 < CIA-11> david * r2121 /branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php: Fixed an issue where FPF would not fall back to more generic error message insertion rules, refs #303
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16:25 < E_mE> bye
16:25 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
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17:44 < v-dogg> huomenta
17:44 < Wombert> hai
17:44 < Wombert> back home?
17:45 < v-dogg> nah, not until friday
17:45 < Wombert> booh
17:45 < Wombert> but you have internets? :>
17:45 < v-dogg> sure, I'm an officer :p
17:46 < v-dogg> did you think I'd go to war with out my brand new laptop?-)
17:46 < Wombert> oO
17:46 < Wombert> of course you are :)
17:46 < Wombert> what rank
17:47  * Wombert looks at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_military_ranks which, of course, cracks him up
17:47 < v-dogg> hm.. lemme find out what it is in English
17:47 < Wombert> hahah no!
17:47 < Wombert> tell me the finnish name :>
17:48 < v-dogg> sub-lieutenant
17:48 < Wombert> Vänrikki Fänrik?
17:48 < v-dogg> sorry, aliluutnantti :)
17:49 < Wombert> navy?
17:49 < Wombert> oO
17:49 < v-dogg> well, not really. costal artillery has navy ranks
17:49 < Wombert> aaaaah
17:49 < Wombert> see
17:50 < Wombert> that's typical finnish weirdness
17:50  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
17:50 < v-dogg> hah :)
18:00 < v-dogg> "navy" is actually a bad translation. literally it it's Marine/Sea Forces or something and the navy is a part of it
18:01 < v-dogg> costal artillery and a few else are the other parts
18:01 < Wombert> ah
18:02 < Wombert> bummer
18:02 < Wombert> that doesn't sound weird at all
18:02 < Wombert> :<
18:02 < v-dogg> yeah, sorry about that
18:02 < v-dogg> but how are things here?
18:02 < Wombert> not much going on
18:02 < Wombert> I am bored
18:02 < v-dogg> I saw you fixed my routing bug, thank you for that
18:02 < Wombert> I think I need a girlfriend soon
18:03 < Wombert> I fixed... yes
18:03 < Wombert> no in fact I didn't
18:03 < Wombert> I ruined it and dominik fixed it :p
18:03 < Wombert> I couldn't be arsed to test it or I had spotted it
18:03 < v-dogg> haha, brilliant team work
18:03 < Wombert> (and then I would have had no idea how to really fix it)
18:03 < Wombert> it's a huge lump of spaghetti this routing thing
18:03 < Wombert> carbonara, I suppose
18:04 < Wombert> speaking of spaghetti, I'm going to italy from friday to thursday :>
18:04 < Wombert> which actually is not-so-:> because it's wooooork
18:04 < v-dogg> wow
18:04 < Wombert> yes
18:05 < Wombert> workshop with a client's team for a week in a villa :> with pool :> and 28 degrees
18:05 < Wombert> :>>
18:05 < v-dogg> working with Italiens.. wonder what that's like ;)
18:05 < Wombert> and I realized that the php conf is not too far away anymore which made me happy because I'll be meeting my favorite finnish weirdo and the rest of the gang
18:05  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
18:05 < Wombert> oh no they're not italian :p
18:05 < Wombert> we're all going there to brainstorm and things and of course to give a miserable image of ze germans in a foreign country, as usual
18:05 < v-dogg> aaaah, ok then :D
18:06 < v-dogg> hehe
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18:17 < _cheerios> Google acquired Jaiku. Finnish guys made it out good
18:18 < ttj> Wow.
18:18 < ttj> Shit.
18:18 < ttj> We should've bought them. :-(
18:26 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@82.152.207.176] has joined #agavi
18:31 < Wombert> rrrrright
18:31 < Wombert> home time, rally is
18:31 < Wombert> *really
18:32 < _cheerios> prisonbreak+heroes, ooof
18:33 < _cheerios> ttj, we need someone to get acquired from millions who is a regular in #agavi
18:33 < _cheerios> s/from/for
18:34 < ttj> _cheerios: I know a guy who is ex-NVO.
18:34 < Wombert> _cheerios: yeah here too
18:34 < Wombert> that's why I need to get home quick :p
18:34 < Wombert> laters
18:34 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@213.23.52.58] has quit []
18:36 < ttj> _cheerios: But yeah, sorry, we only do 5.7 billion M&A operations. :P
18:41 -!- EoN [n=EoN@c211-30-133-191.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Connection timed out]
18:42 < ttj> Haha. A guy I know just got his MasterCard bill. 840 euros. That's nothing special, but it was all spent on beer. :P
18:45 < _cheerios> *g*
19:22 < _cheerios> "For all versions prior to PHP 6, this parameter is called..."; time to upgrade when even the documentation mentions newer versions than what you run.
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19:33 < jake> hey Wombert, long time
19:33 < Wombert> WOW
19:33 < Wombert> JAKE
19:33 < Wombert> :>
19:33 < Wombert> you're alive
19:33 < Wombert> maaaan
19:33 < jake> heh, hey man, how's it going?
19:33 < Wombert> brilliant1
19:33 < jake> yeah, it's been a crazy year for me
19:33 < Wombert> and you?
19:33 < Wombert> still surfing the agavi wave?
19:33 < jake> Well, I'm at a new company now
19:33 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["Lost terminal"]
19:33 < Wombert> where
19:33 < jake> and I'm getting ready to integrate agavi into our system this week
19:33 < Wombert> and what are you doing there
19:33 < jake> A company called compendium blogware
19:34 < Wombert> ooooh that is excellent news!
19:34 < jake> I'm the VP of Tech
19:34 < Wombert> btw we now offer commercial support, training and consulting, should you need it
19:34 < jake> which means I write all the software :) I just started, the contractors that built the system were idiots, so now I'm trying to undo all the crap they did, without an outage
19:34 < Wombert> heh
19:34 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
19:34 < jake> oh, excellent, I didn't see anything on the site about that?
19:34 < Wombert> yeah, it's not up there yet
19:34 < jake> are you still in school?
19:34 < Wombert> nah
19:34 < Wombert> quit university
19:35 < jake> so what are you up to these days?
19:35 < Wombert> too boring and too much work
19:35 < Wombert> running teh company at full power ;)
19:35 < _cheerios> fearless!
19:35 < jake> that's great. Still in Germany then?
19:35 < Wombert> kaos|work and I've been very busy over the last months, all agavi related
19:35 < Wombert> yup
19:35 < Wombert> hey, before I forget, jake 
19:35 < Wombert> if you can, come to the php conference in november
19:36 < Wombert> some agavi folks are coming, hans lellelid of propel, and others, should be fun
19:36 < Wombert> ask MikeSeth, he transparently migrated a legacy app to agavi
19:36 < jake> phpconference.com? That one?
19:36 < jake> Yeah, I just only have 5 days to do it :)
19:36 < jake> Is the conference in English?
19:37 < jake> looks like a mix of German and English
19:38 < Wombert> lots of talks are in english
19:38 < Wombert> most people speak english
19:38 < Wombert> there's gonna be just two germans in our gang of ~ 10 people
19:38 < splatch`> hello
19:38 < jake> excellent, well I can probably talk the company into sending me
19:38 < Wombert> jake: that would be so, so, so cool
19:39 < Wombert> just be quick, not sure how many seats are left, not to mention the hotel
19:39 < jake> sure sure, I'll ask at my meeting tomorrow
19:39 < Wombert> so are you still in seattle, then?
19:39 < jake> no, I moved back to Indianapolis at the beginning of September
19:39 < Wombert> jake: cool. "many agavi experts are there" should be a good selling point ;)
19:40 < jake> I miss Seattle though, it's a great city
19:40 < jake> cool. Things have changed radically since I last used agavi, in good ways mostly
19:40 < Wombert> glad to hear you still like it
19:40 < jake> I like the mix of xml wiring and convention
19:41 < jake> I'm glad you didn't go too far with the wiring, Spring annoys the hell out of me :)
19:41 < jake> Email me me about consulting rates
19:42 < impl> Spring~
19:42 < impl> need moar enterprise
19:42 < jake> haha
19:42 < Wombert> I'd hand you some loyalty bonus points if we had such a thing, jake :)
19:42 < Wombert> nice to have you back
19:42 < Wombert> remember, you were the original inspiration of many of 0.11's concepts
19:42  * Wombert bows
19:42 < jake> impl, you ever read the daily wtf? I love enterprisey software
19:42 < jake> heh, I do love the services stuff
19:43 < impl> Yeah, every now and then I go back through it
19:43 < jake> that's why I'm going with agavi again
19:43 < jake> I need to expose our application as quickly as possible via json, xmlrpc and soap
19:43 < Wombert> we deployed two big ass soap apps with a client over the last months
19:43 < Wombert> smooth as silk
19:43 < Wombert> it even handles soap headers and everything for you
19:44 < jake> perfect. I assume you've been integrating everything back to trunk?
19:44 < Wombert> it's in branches/0.11
19:44 < Wombert> we'll be rolling RC6 as soon as we can
19:44 < Wombert> I want a final release in time for the conf
19:44 < jake> okay, I was going to start running from pear, is agavi/agavi going to get me the new good stuff?
19:44 < Wombert> yes, RC5
19:44 < jake> perfect
19:45 < Wombert> but that's a tiiiiny little bit old
19:45 < Wombert> lemme check
19:45 < jake> I love the documentation. "Agavi is not a framework for beginners"
19:45 < jake> haha
19:45 < splatch`> :D
19:45 < impl> Well it's pretty damn true :P
19:45 < Wombert> that's why people love it!
19:45 < jake> yeah it just cracks me up, you can tell a technical person wrote the docs and not a marketing person
19:45 < Wombert> check out the ohloh page ;)
19:45 < impl> 'Least until we get real documentation :P
19:46 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/CHANGELOG
19:46 < Wombert> FPF's error insertion is a major point
19:46 < Wombert> some more SOAP features
19:46 < Wombert> Doctrine driver...
19:47 < jake> so what do you think I should use for production? is 0.11RC5 going to be stable enough?
19:47 < Wombert> branches/0.11 is, too
19:47 < Wombert> no breaking changes
19:47 < E_mE> Framwork for beginners.. thats certainly true hehe.. but very good from what i've learnt...
19:47 < jake> hmm, FPF seems nice
19:47 < E_mE> not*
19:47 < Wombert> in fact, there's not gonna be breaking changes in 1.0 either
19:47 < jake> well, I'm more concerned about things just 'not working right' in 0.11RC5
19:47 < impl> Wombert: What more do we have to do between 0.11RC6 => 0.11 final?
19:47 < Wombert> jake: FPF will save you soooo much boring work
19:48 < Wombert> impl: nothing
19:48 < jake> hmm, okay, so if I uses branches/0.11 is that the most up to date?
19:48 < impl> so why are we rolling an RC6, let's just release the fucker
19:48 < Wombert> yes
19:48 < Wombert> yes impl 
19:48 < Wombert> err no impl 
19:48 < jake> yes!
19:48 < Wombert> and yes jake 
19:48 < Wombert> :p
19:48 < jake> haha. yes, please, for the love of god, release 0.11 :)
19:48  * Wombert slaps impl around with a proper release process
19:48 < impl> 5 RCs is a proper release process :>
19:48 < Wombert> we will, right after RC6, if there are no show stoppers
19:49 < jake> it's so German it hurts
19:49 < Wombert> it hurts?
19:49 < Wombert> ewww
19:49 < Wombert> that means we have to re-do the whole engineering
19:49 < jake> haha
19:49  * Wombert goes to ZE DRAWING BOARD
19:49 < jake> so, Wombert, should I pull from subversion or pear for production?
19:50 < impl> SVN should be fine
19:50 < Wombert> jake: I'd recommend an svn external on branches/0.11
19:50 < jake> okay, I can do that
19:52 < E_mE> Wombert: would there be any reasons why executeWrite() won't fire on a POST submission?
19:52 < Wombert> E_mE: are validators in place?
19:53 < E_mE> nope.
19:53 < E_mE> ive do have 2 forms on one page
19:53 < E_mE> but they are seprated
19:53 < Wombert> in slots?
19:54 < E_mE> same slot
19:54 < E_mE> but i even commented one out and still didn't repair
19:54 < Wombert> did you check isSimple()
19:54 < E_mE> no isSimple()
19:54 < Wombert> maybe your base action is simple if the container is a slot?
19:54 < Wombert> you sure?
19:55 < E_mE> no isSimple() in base action
19:55 < Wombert> in the module's base action?
19:55 < E_mE> ive recently changed from xhtml strict to transitional
19:55 < Wombert> are you sure that action is run? :p
19:55 < Wombert> you sure it's method="post"
19:56 < Wombert> you had that the other day... :p
19:56 < E_mE> <form name="mainform" id="mainform" action="<?php echo $ro->gen('foodherbs.new.ingredient', array('nodeuid' => $template['nodeuid'])); ?>" method="post">
19:56 < E_mE> =P 
19:57 < E_mE> and ive got JS calling $('mainform').submit();
19:57 < E_mE> it just goes back to the same page when i click on the submit button
19:57 < Wombert> eww.... can you leave out the js for a minute and use a normal submit button just to be sure
19:58 < E_mE> i only just added it a few hours ago
19:58 < E_mE> to see if that would help
19:58 < Wombert> it used to work?
19:59 < E_mE> it worked before i tampered around with the upload
19:59 < E_mE> which is odd
19:59 < Wombert> hmmmm
19:59 < Wombert> you really have to try without any js first
20:00 < E_mE> ill disactive all JS
20:00 < Wombert> jake: found the chapter in the manual that describes the install?
20:03 < E_mE> ugh!! ive disabled all JS and now it submits fine... the damned JS is hooking on the the POST submition :/
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20:06 < jake> yep, already done, writing app1 now
20:06 < jake> also, don't forget to send me the info on contracting
20:06 < Wombert> yes
20:06 < Wombert> can you PM me your email address
20:07 < jake> heh, no I can't. it's agavi@mobocracy.net
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20:07 < jake> I forgot my password for freenode and haven't been able to find an admin to reset it for me
20:07 < Wombert> ewww uncool
20:08 < Wombert> is it okay if I send that tomorrow in the morning
20:08 < Wombert> need to wrap up some stuff here and want to head to bed early
20:08 < jake> I know, I can't believe I forgot a password, I feel like a secretary
20:08 < jake> yeah, no worries
20:08 < Wombert> cool
20:09 < jake> oh wait, I remembered my password, but yeah that's my email :)
20:10 < Wombert> quick! tell nickserv your email ;)
20:10 < Wombert> I think you can recover it then
20:11 < jake> well, I have my password so hopefully I shouldn't need to recover it
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20:23 < jake> so, agavi project doesn't work? Did it ever?
20:23 < jake> I know module/action/etc used to work
20:24 < jake> nm, stupid instructions :)
20:24 < Wombert> jake: sure does, you just need phing
20:24 < Wombert> sorted?
20:25 < Wombert> when you create a new one with "agavi project", consider renaming the base action, view and module it created for you in app/lib
20:25 < Wombert> and also give each of your modules their own base action, module, model
20:25 < jake> heh, yeah. There's two build.php, so if you set the directory wrong (to the top level), phing still works, just not how you'd expect :)
20:25 < Wombert> oh damn it... action, view, model
20:25 < Wombert> ah yes heh
20:26 < jake> I love phing, I'm going to hug that guy when I see him in Germany
20:32 < Wombert> he's gonna be there yup ;)
20:34 < jake> you should add tokens like USERNAME and such to the build file
20:35 < jake> I guess I can just use a subversion hook
20:48 < Wombert> to which
20:48 < Wombert> you mean to the code it generates?
20:49 < jake> yeah, since the Author is the username of the person being generated, and we include the file creator in comments
20:49 < jake> but I can just use $Author$ and then propset the file
20:52 < jake> found a bug too. If you specify a template.extension in your build.properties, phing tries to use Template.tpl.tmpl. 
20:53 < jake> But it doesn't try to use it from your custom templates.dir if you have one, it tries to use src/buildtools/code_templates/
20:54 < jake> and then it tries to find WelcomeToAgaviSuccess.tpl.tmpl which fails
20:55 < jake> I'll put into trac, or if I still have commit access I can just fix and commit
21:00 < Wombert> jake: that's what custom code tpls are for :) so you can have the files look like you want
21:01 < Wombert> I don't think you have commit access anymore, we have a new SVN server
21:01 < Wombert> query
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23:41 < jake> anyone alive that has commit access?
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--- Day changed Wed Oct 10 2007
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05:31 < lordHelmchen1977> hey! do you know how it's possible to add new errors to the ValidationManager after doing the handleError()?
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06:38 < _cheerios> unf
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06:58 < Wombert> huomenta
07:04 < Wombert> lordHelmchen1977: $this->container->getValidationManager()->setError($fieldName, $errorMessage); works for example
07:04 < Wombert> best is to do that in the error view
07:04 < Wombert> field name does not have to be valid, but can be
07:06 < lordHelmchen1977> thanks - i found documentation for myself, and as ii thought: everything works fine :-)
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07:19 < Wombert> RossC0: huomenta
07:19 < Wombert> to swap to vars in PHP (saw your delicious bookmark), just do list($foo, $bar) = array($bar, $foo);
07:20 < RossC0> Huomenta!
07:21 < RossC0> ahh the bitwise swap thing
07:21 < RossC0> hope you added a comment in ze blog
07:22 < Wombert> errrr
07:22 < Wombert> in ze opera blog?
07:22 < Wombert> oO
07:22 < RossC0> ah yeah..
07:22 < RossC0> oO
07:22 < RossC0> :D
07:22  * RossC0 drinks tea
07:23 < RossC0> fatigue -1
07:23 < RossC0> :D
07:24 < RossC0> wow jaiku is joining Google
07:27 < ttj> Old stuff. :P
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08:08 < E_mE> huomenta!
08:11  * E_mE Goes Postal on banks!!
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08:49 < E_mE> i think is a first with agavi:  
08:49 < E_mE> wenseritj@VinoOnline:/var/www/segilive/pub$ php -f ./sendCaseSalesCsv.php
08:49 < E_mE> Segmentation fault
08:50 < E_mE> but its not agavi's fault ;) it appear to my be my ODBC driver
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09:54  * _cheerios chuckles on age calculation goofs
10:04 < RossC0> ?
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11:11 < _cheerios> doctrine import... :|
11:12 < _cheerios> a default value of 0 for a column doesn't get picked up.
11:46 < _cheerios> and getting latest svn brings up more bugs. joy :D
11:52  * _cheerios ...
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13:33  * _cheerios hugs awk
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13:40 < _cheerios> http://badvista.fsf.org/logos/BadVista_no_littering.png :)
13:40 < RossC0> _cheerios: hugs a hawk?
13:41 < _cheerios> rename -n 's/\.php$/\.class.php/' *.php | awk -F' ' '{print "svn mv "$1" "$4""}' | sh
13:42 < _cheerios> bulk rename using svn on cmd line
13:43 < _cheerios> still need to fix doctrine bugs to continue :/
13:47  * Wombert has commit access
13:47 < Wombert> give me patches if you like :p
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14:03 < _cheerios> Wombert, http://p.caboo.se/private/a6fjdfoxmkv9w7u0wp5sa
14:03 < _cheerios> is there a way to have that ugly !='' an other way?
14:04 < _cheerios> the first fails on NULL, so I guess that's why the second && check is there, but that fails on 0!
14:04 < Wombert> err
14:06 < shoan> commit access to what?
14:06 < Wombert> THE MOON
14:06 < Wombert> :>
14:07 < _cheerios> fixing doctrine when default value set to 0, which doesn't register currently due && $column['default']
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14:12 < _cheerios> but seems that leads to another bug, where doctrine doesn't use the default value
14:12 < _cheerios> and i think i saw a ticket for this too
14:14 < _cheerios> or, scrap that, was a final thing left unchanged in schema. the patch works for me.
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14:15 < _cheerios> RossC0, does the Flash class need an update with latest agavi svn?
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14:16 < _cheerios> $this->context->getRequest()->getRequestData()->setParameter('agavi.org.flash', $this); // not allowed anymore it seemsh
14:17 < Wombert> as I said before, I don't quite get why it is set into the request data
14:17 < Wombert> it doesn't belong there
14:17 < Wombert> it is session stuff
14:17 < Wombert> put it in the user
14:23 < _cheerios> today is such a disaster.
14:24 < Wombert> why
14:25 < _cheerios> all externals i updated had breaking changes
14:25 < RossC0> _cheerios: yeah - I updated the ticket - it bow has now depedencies
14:25 < RossC0> zomg
14:25 < Wombert> hhaa
14:25  * Wombert coughs
14:25 < Wombert> friggen candy is killing me
14:25 < RossC0>  yeah - I updated the ticket - it now has no dependencies 
14:26 < RossC0> :>
14:26  * Wombert slaps RossC0 
14:26 < Wombert> ANSWER ME!!!!
14:26 < RossC0> waa?
14:37 < CIA-11> david * r2122 /branches/0.11/ (CHANGELOG src/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php): 
14:37 < CIA-11> Fixed an issue where forms with the same action would both get error messages
14:37 < CIA-11> inserted under certain circumstances, thanks Ross for the hint. Also, errors
14:37 < CIA-11> that could ultimately not be inserted are now stored in request attribute
14:37 < CIA-11> "orphaned_errors", namespace "org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter". Refs #303
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14:46 < _cheerios> the black clouds just won't fade, now doctrine isn't inserting PK's x_X
14:46 < _cheerios> RossC0, sweet. Patched, works good.
14:49 < _cheerios> ...and no my patch did not break doctrine. omfg, how can they have such a broken version up.
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15:01 < _cheerios> can't find a working version of doctrine for this by summarily going back a few hundred revs. scary.
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15:05 < Wombert> OH GOD ZOMG ZOMG ZOMG CAN ANYONE CONFIRM IT'S 2007
15:05 < Wombert> L
15:05 < Wombert> O
15:05 < Wombert> L
15:05 < Wombert> Z
15:06 < _cheerios> what now?
15:11 < Wombert> http://www.zend.com/company/zend_news/press_releases/2007/10/zend_announces_zend_studio_for_eclipse_pre_release_version_available_under_code_name_neon
15:11 < Wombert> ah no :p
15:11 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14989131
15:11 < Wombert> this :P
15:13 < RossC0> is that neon or eclipse assuming ISO ?
15:13 < Wombert> eclipse
15:13 < Wombert> but why didn't zend change it
15:13 < Wombert> I'm sure it also has windows newlines as the default
15:13 < Wombert> which it will randomly enforce
15:14 < Wombert> messing up commits every five minutes
15:14 < Wombert> eclipse is _so_ appaling
15:14 < RossC0> ha no triangle nads to eclipse
15:14 < RossC0> I've always found it sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo slllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwww
15:14 < Wombert> triangle nads? oO
15:15 < RossC0> <3
15:15 < Wombert> wtf is that
15:15  * RossC0 blames v-dogg
15:15  * RossC0 hunts the logs
15:15 < RossC0> http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=agavi%20triangle%20nads&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
15:16 < RossC0> rotflamo
15:16 < RossC0> I can even google it!!
15:16 < RossC0> 12:38 < v-dogg> for some reason <3 always reminds me of either somebody mooning or hanging his nutty sacks under a triangle
15:16 < Wombert> LOLZ
15:17 < Wombert> nads... never hearrd that before
15:17 < Wombert> oh man you guys are sooo awesomely weird
15:17  * Wombert hugs RossC0 
15:17  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
15:17 < _cheerios> hehe
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15:23 < RossC0> http://agileweb.org/post/14990641
15:23 < RossC0> :D
15:23 < RossC0> <3 tumblr
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15:35 < RossC0> laters all
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17:21 < _cheerios> Doctors save man with vodka drip // alcohol saves lives!
17:22 < Wombert> woot?
17:22 < Wombert> link
17:22 < _cheerios> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7037443.stm
17:22 < _cheerios> aah, i feel better. just had to stop worrying about doctrine trunk being so shit.
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18:43 < Wombert> home ->
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21:09 < _cheerios> Kabutz: When people hear that I live on the island of Crete, they conjure up images of a geek sitting on the beach with a laptop -- in fact, that's exactly what I sometimes do! I take two batteries to the beach for backup.
21:09 < _cheerios> I had this romantic fantasy of living on an island, going snorkeling in the morning, eating delicious food, and playing backgammon into the night with friends. I thought of how creative I could be, unencumbered by the constant hustle and bustle of day-to-day living in a city. It turned out to be true! This morning, for instance, I went for a one-mile swim in the Cretan sea, where I saw fish, sea urchins, and lots of sardines.
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21:15 < _cheerios> Eclipse ate my code :|
21:15 < impl> It dislikes your Crete fantasies
21:16 < _cheerios> Ran out of disk when I made the wrong command on a big table :|
21:18 < Wombert> lawl
21:18 < Wombert> really no triangle nads for eclipse then
21:18 < Wombert> I like that crete story
21:18 < Wombert> I should mention that I'm going to italy for a week tomorrow
21:18 < Wombert> into a villa near florence
21:18 < Wombert> with a pool :>
21:19 < ttj> And then again on the 17th of November, eh?
21:19 < _cheerios> mmm.. vacation
21:21 < impl> Wombert: and you're not going to be on IRC, right?
21:21 < impl> nor coding Agavi
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21:27 < Wombert> impl: both, actually
21:27 < Wombert> ttj: well
21:27 < impl> unf
21:27 < Wombert> ttj: if you find me equally dirt cheap flights, I'm in
21:27 < Wombert> we have internets there, impl 
21:27 < Wombert> it's work, not holidays :p
21:27 < impl> pool == vacation
21:27 < Wombert> 17 hours of meetings scheduled for each day
21:27 < Wombert> or so
21:28 < impl> ouch
21:28 < Wombert> if you have time to use it, yes :p
21:28 < ttj> Wombert: Ah, but you're in Germany, so just grab a fast car and drive to Milan. :P
21:28 < Wombert> not quite 17, but a _lot:
21:28 < Wombert> ttj: :p
21:44 < _cheerios> btw., what was the reasoning to name files .class.php instead of just .php?
21:45 < _cheerios> is this a php4<>php5 thing, or is this a habit with other programming languages?
21:45 < impl> It came from Moavi
21:45 < impl> Mojavi
21:46 < impl> I assume just feti's naming scheme
21:47 < _cheerios> if it was for the sake of interface.php shining out in the midst of class.php's, that'd be just lame
21:48 < impl> Nah, it was like that in PHP4 too
21:48 < impl> when interfaces didn't exist
21:48 < _cheerios> another thing is this fetish with having Action and View in the files of action/ and view/
21:49 < impl> Again, Mojavi
21:49 < impl> Action should be called Controller and Controller should be called Dispatcher
21:49 < _cheerios> especially when mixing actions that consists of two or more words, these additions to the end of the filename make the list of actions harder to read
21:50 < impl> feti used to be a Java guy
21:50 < impl> so I assume the reason for that is that he wanted the class names to match the file names
21:50 < impl> and vice-versa
21:50 < impl> (I personally like that style too)
21:51 < _cheerios> it looks all orderly and logical, so i'm sure it resounds in the mind of a programmer. but then, those files never move, so it makes no sense.
21:52 < _cheerios> the directory name already infers the contents of the files
21:53 < impl> Perhaps, but if the names didn't match it would bother me soooo much
21:53 < _cheerios> match? what matches now?
21:53 < impl> The class name and the file name
21:54 < _cheerios> ah, you went beyond the surface
21:57 < _cheerios> by now, i tend to have long names for classes. must be ze influence.
21:57 < impl> Yeah, I can't abbreviate anything either
21:57 < impl> AgaviConfig bothers me to hell
21:57 < impl> but this is why we don't let me code frameworks
22:02 < _cheerios> the amount of files that comes with this mvc design just sucks the life out of you when a project goes big
22:03 < _cheerios> then it's so disappointing to look at your error,success,input,whatelse view and notice each only have like 6 lines of code, yet are all separate files
22:06 < _cheerios> a daunting and depressing view of strict order
22:08 < impl> How would you prefer it be done?
22:08 < impl> The point of MVC is for extensibility and modularity
22:08 < impl> If you don't want that don't use it :P
22:08 < _cheerios> does it have to be that bleak, the usual use-it/dont-use-it?
22:09 < _cheerios> if it's so extensible, i should be able to plugin a rendere view a config setting, that allows control of eg. Views. Where do I start?
22:11 < _cheerios> perhaps i preferred the same action to have its view a single file with respective methods / inner classes, until the time comes to pan out more.
22:13 < _cheerios> it's 2007! atleast stuff in the browser is becoming flexible.
22:23 < impl> Meta-izing a framework in PHP is not fun/realistically possible
22:29 < _cheerios> hmm, why am i still up :|
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07:16 < RossC0> ls
07:16 < RossC0> Huomenta!
07:16 < _cheerios> mount morning
07:17 < _cheerios> is there a better glimpse into an MVC project, like Agavi, with some editors / tools?
07:17 < RossC0> _cheerios: in English?
07:17 < _cheerios> thinking about the stuff i said yesterday i came to conclude it's just the tools holding me back
07:17 < RossC0> lol
07:18 < _cheerios> well, when your project grows the module folders get huge
07:18 < _cheerios> it's alot of looking around for the files you want
07:18 < RossC0> jEdit - its the best
07:18 < RossC0> :-s
07:18 < _cheerios> scenario A: i'm in IndexAction; I'd like to get a glimpse of all files related to this file
07:18 < _cheerios> and i'm not talking inheritance
07:18 < _cheerios> the list would give me the validators, the views, the templates
07:19 < _cheerios> (so i don't have to look for them / their existence / what they hold)
07:19 < RossC0> ah ok
07:20 < _cheerios> currently i have a file-browser open (the Eclipse project view).
07:20 < RossC0> eeww
07:20 < _cheerios> but that is such a slow way to look for stuff
07:20 < _cheerios> open/close view folder, OK, go back to action open/close action folder etc.
07:21 < _cheerios> tabs help some, but it still doesn't go far enough, at all.
07:21 < RossC0> get a text editor
07:21 < RossC0> or change IDE - quanta + :D
07:22 < _cheerios> do they have what I want? show meh!
07:24 < _cheerios> RossC0, I was using jEdit earlier, but it's file/project browser was so antique I couldn't take it anymore and just left.
07:24 < _cheerios> in any case, i did some googling around and found out that javascript based editors have come a long way
07:25 < _cheerios> http://marijn.haverbeke.nl/codemirror/ and http://codepress.org/
07:25 < _cheerios> esp. the latter, with working indenting, would be usable and it'd be quick to script these things with some JS, and have views about stuff EXACTLY how I'd want.
07:27 < _cheerios> a) hook up nicer Agavi views
07:27 < _cheerios> b) module/action management
07:27 < _cheerios> c) SVN integration
07:28 < _cheerios> d) could even filter the file listings, if I fancied, to display AccountsErrorView.class.php = AccountsError (while it's still the same on filesystem) etc.
07:29 < _cheerios> e) the result could be the next big open source thing in editor landscape ;)
07:29 < RossC0> hmm
07:29 < RossC0> a) - yes
07:29 < RossC0> b) console
07:30 < RossC0> c) console
07:30 < RossC0> d) ?
07:30 < RossC0> e) maybe!
07:30 < RossC0> not sure what you mean by d
07:30 < MikeSeth> im disturbed by this conversationn
07:30 < _cheerios> by console do you mean, that SVN is doable via console?
07:30 < RossC0> its quicker!
07:31 < _cheerios> non-integrated quicker than integrated? wth!? :)
07:31 < RossC0> MikeSeth: I thought you were doing an emacs Agavi thang
07:31 < RossC0> svn up
07:31 < RossC0> svn ci
07:31 < _cheerios> if i move a file, it'd be moved in SVN. instead of moving it, then noticing SVN hasnt seen the change, and you need to move it in SVN still etc.
07:32 < RossC0> zomg
07:32 < RossC0>  /quit
07:32 < MikeSeth> RossC0: it's half-written, I've never managed to finish it. emacs is a headache :)
07:32 < _cheerios> RossC0, huh? :)
07:33 < RossC0> _cheerios: you are funny in a mental kinda way
07:33 < RossC0> you could write an eclipse plugin for Agavi
07:33 < _cheerios> you are bad at compliments
07:33 < _cheerios> :D
07:33 < RossC0> :D
07:33 < RossC0> then you have all the eclipse features and agavi features!
07:33 < _cheerios> what do you use for svn management, rossco?
07:34 < RossC0> console
07:34 < _cheerios> yea, and the plugin would probably take forever to write, not do what i'd need and be really slow.
07:34 < _cheerios> explain furhter, svn up/ci isn't much.
07:34 < RossC0> well I just use the console
07:34 < _cheerios> do you always change file locations via svn first, in the console?
07:34 < RossC0> check ins, tagging, branching etc..
07:35 < RossC0> yeah - I dont move stuff about that much as to have it be a problem
07:35 < _cheerios> exactly, as it's a pain :)
07:36 < RossC0> _cheerios its an add and a delete..
07:37 < _cheerios> yes, and it's tedious and slow.
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08:09 < _cheerios> RossC0, a reason to spend more time with JS always welcome :)
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08:10 < _cheerios> doctrine trunk still broken. ugh. :|
08:14 < RossC0> _cheerios yeah they do seem to have a strange way of managing a project over there
08:16 < _cheerios> and this is their 1.0RC++ candidate!
08:16 < E_mE> huomenta! 
08:16 < _cheerios> i'll just revert. and keep it in mind that not all things are as well run as agavi :)
08:17 < E_mE> what Database interface does Doctrine use? would it be compatible with ODBC Lib
08:19 < _cheerios> http://php.net/pdo
08:20 < E_mE> PDO + PHP + unixODBC = a bad mix with selected Sage MMS Database tables...
08:20 < E_mE> annoyingly enough
08:23 < E_mE> o: doctrine website is built with symfony
08:23 < E_mE> :o
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09:01 < RossC0> yup pookey is a symfony fan
09:02 < E_mE> RossC0: you have a challenge on your hands =P
09:02 < RossC0> I'll set MikeSeth on him
09:02 < RossC0> :D
09:03 < MikeSeth> I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE
09:04 < RossC0> MikeSeth - just bowing down to a master of persuasion 
09:05 < MikeSeth> all it takes is a little anger, a little disdain and a mile of bad code you have to dive
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09:38 < E_mE> OR Threaten with broken fingers ;)
09:48 < _cheerios> RossC0, do you know doctrine internals enough to give pointers on how to fix this http://doctrine.pengus.net/trac/ticket/468 ?
09:55 < _cheerios> i made a workaround so doctrine isn't totally broken, by omitting all default='' settings in doctrine records.
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09:58 < RossC0> _cheerios: sorry dude cannot help with that one
09:58 < RossC0> pester them on #doctrine
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10:00 < Wombert> Mike!
10:02  * Wombert slaps MikeSeth 
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10:53 < E_mE> can anyone see a problem with this line of code: http://www.pastebin.ca/732882  ... because if i pass no parameters its not firing the die() function
10:53 < E_mE> ive done a var dump and im getting true's and false's
10:53 < E_mE> :/
10:54 < E_mE> ignore more
10:54 < E_mE> me...
10:54 < E_mE> had a spaz moment
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11:19 < RossC0> wow - I can insert slideshare's into my tumblr#
11:20 < RossC0> and with slideshare you can upload pdfs, ppts etc..
11:20 < RossC0> soo cool
11:20  * RossC0 goes and uploads a truck load of pdfs!
11:20 < _cheerios> Wombert, would a context setter make sense? I sometimes debug by just dumping the User object, but since all objects have the Context within it's not a pretty sight. A setContext(null) before dumping would help. Other ways?
11:21 < RossC0> _cheerios: xdebug_var_dump
11:21  * RossC0 is soo unhelpful today
11:21  * RossC0 apologises for being a moody monkey
11:23 < Wombert> yeah xdebug can limit the var display depth
11:42 < _cheerios> nice
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13:11 < _cheerios> tips on joining data from multiple db's?
13:12 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: clustering, replication or materialization
13:13 < _cheerios> as in a query, based on some criteria.
13:13 < MikeSeth> in mysql, you can do it within constraints of a single server
13:14 < MikeSeth> SELECT .. FROM foo.bar JOIN fish.cat ...
13:16 < _cheerios> got any reference page for that? that's just table joining syntax there?
13:17 < MikeSeth> no, MySQL allows you tp qualify table names with database names
13:17 < MikeSeth> you can do it anywhere you can use a table, provided that you have access privileges to the foreign database
13:19 < _cheerios> ok, this might do for now. thanks.
13:23 < RossC0> _cheerios: you doing cross database joins =-o
13:25 < _cheerios> go away evil spirit! :D
13:27 < _cheerios> aptly named db connection "uhoh"
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14:45 < E_mE> im guessing its possuble to write a CSV Renderer for Agavi?
14:46 < E_mE> or would it be more adviceable to use a external library and mount it as a model in agavi and convert an array to CSV
14:46 < RossC0> E_mE: I output CSV just as a string
14:47 < RossC0> but have an output_type for which sets the headers
14:47 < E_mE> a text/plain output type
14:49 < E_mE> or is there a text/csv type?
14:52 < RossC0> http://pastie.caboo.se/106163
14:55 < RossC0> The ISO output is so that Excel will play nice
14:56 < RossC0> You may need to ensure you convert to ISO-8859-1
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14:56 < E_mE> thank you RossC0
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16:21 < CIA-11> dominik * r2123 /branches/0.11/src/util/AgaviToolkit.class.php: 
16:21 < CIA-11> fix possible concurrency issue
16:21 < CIA-11> fixes #584
16:32 < _cheerios> possibly bugs :p
16:33 < _cheerios> must be getting close to 0.11
16:33 < Wombert_> very
16:33 -!- Wombert_ is now known as Wombert
16:33 < Wombert> if you're lucky, we're rolling RC6 tonight
16:35 < MikeSeth> WAT
16:35 < MikeSeth> YEZ
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16:46 < RossC0> WOOT!
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16:55 < CIA-11> dominik * r2124 /branches/0.11/src/config/AgaviValidatorConfigHandler.class.php: 
16:55 < CIA-11> allow validators for different methods have the same name
16:55 < CIA-11> fixes #582
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17:22 < Wombert> hmmm
17:22 < Wombert> do we expect expandVariables() and expandDirectives to work recursively?
17:22 < Wombert> expandVariables... no
17:22 < Wombert> but expandDirectives?
17:24 < kaos|work_> until yet we did not
17:25 < Wombert> we do
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18:27 -!- Arme[N] changed the topic of #agavi to: Welcome to OSC :: latest: SVN :: http://opensourceclub.org :: http://osc-dev.opensourceclub.org/milestone/0.3 :: want SVN? https://osccms.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/osccms/trunk/ :: Welcome to OSC :: latest: SVN :: http://opensourceclub.org :: http://osc-dev.opensourceclub.org/milestone/0.3 :: want SVN? https://osccms.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/osccms/trunk/
18:27 -!- Arme[N] changed the topic of #agavi to:  welcome to #agavi :: latest: 0.11RC5 :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA!
18:28 < Arme[N]> sorry :)
18:30 < Arme[N]> clear
18:38 < _cheerios> advertisement!
18:39 < CIA-11> dominik * r2125 /branches/0.11/src/validator/AgaviValidator.class.php: 
18:39 < CIA-11> don't mark fields of validators with required=false as unprocessed
18:39 < CIA-11> fixes #578
18:39 < Arme[N]> _cheerios: :P
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18:55 < _cheerios> cool, can get 100Mbit/s for 42,90e/mo where I live. tempting, but can't afford it! :D
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18:56 < _cheerios> i currently pay 25e for 1Mbit/s, they do give 10Mbit/s for 32,90e/mo... hmm.
19:25 < _cheerios> seems only adsl on my street, no ethernet. no thanks. :|
19:30 < _cheerios> eclipse crashed on me while opening a dir with 44000 files. sigh!
19:31 < _cheerios> how am i supposed to dev on my MVC application when it can't even open half the files
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19:49 < Wombert> hai
19:49  * Wombert pokes jake 
19:49 < Wombert> you there?
19:49  * Wombert pokes impl 
19:49 < Wombert> and you?
19:49 < v-dogg> wombs ze poker
19:50 < Wombert> :>
19:50 < Wombert> RC6 time
19:50  * impl eats Wombert 
19:50 < Wombert> oh come on
19:50 < impl> RC6 humh
19:50 < Wombert> not again :<
19:50 < impl> I guess I better regurgitate you then
19:50 < Wombert> oi guys err
19:51 < Wombert> expandDirectives() used to work recursively
19:51 < Wombert> so a replacement directive could again contain directives
19:51 < v-dogg> http://www.veikko.fi/kuvat/kertaus2007/puolustusammunta1.jpg + 2.jpg + 3.jpg
19:51 < Wombert> for expandVariables, that obviously does not make any sense
19:51 < Wombert> but what about expandDirectives...
19:51  * Wombert ponders
19:52 < Wombert> two questions, v-dogg 
19:52 < Wombert> 1) what does "puolustusammunta"
19:52 < Wombert> 2) isn't posting photos of that into the tubes of the internets high treason or so
19:52 < v-dogg> heh, everytime someone "ponders" I can't help thinking about Pinky & Brain:)
19:52 < Wombert> very cool pics tho
19:53 < Wombert> 1) should have been "what does 'foobar' mean"
19:53 < _cheerios> that place looks familiar, but i guess all of them do.
19:54 < Wombert> I'll have a coffe real quick
19:54 < Wombert> bbiab
19:55 < v-dogg> Wombert: 1) "defence/defencive shooting" 2) no, there's nothing in that picture you are not allowed to show
19:56 < v-dogg> _cheerios: santahamina
19:56 < _cheerios> same place then
20:00 < v-dogg> a fellow-soldier filmed video thru night vision goggles. very cool :)
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20:01 < _cheerios> sounds like it
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20:35 < Wombert> v-dogg: :>>>
20:36 < Wombert> impl: so should we have recursive expandDirective lala?
20:36 < impl> I dunno, why?
20:36 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/changeset/2093
20:36 < impl> What is the advantage?
20:37 < impl> I think the possible use cases for it are pretty edge
20:38 < Wombert> it's not used anywhere except in the tests
20:39 < Wombert> example
20:39 < Wombert> 			AgaviConfig::set('core.cache_dir', AgaviConfig::get('core.app_dir') . '/cache', false, true);
20:39 < Wombert> could be
20:39 < Wombert> AgaviConfig::set('core.cache_dir', '%core.app_dir%/cache', false, true);
20:39 < Wombert> then %core.cache_dir% would resolve properly
20:39  * impl nods
20:40 < Wombert> the obvious advantage is that the latter is resolved JIT
20:40 < Wombert> which might be desirable under certain circumstances
20:41 < impl> I don't think it's worth the performance we get from not supporting it
20:41 < Wombert> wwwwhat?
20:41  * Wombert confused
20:42 < Wombert> so we add it back
20:42 < Wombert> right?
20:42 < impl> No
20:42 < Wombert> impl: btw... new severities... "Info" and "silent"
20:42 < Wombert> the old "none" is mapped to "silent"
20:42 < impl> h'okai
20:43 < Wombert> "info" preserves the incidents
20:43 < Wombert> so you can query them in code
20:43 < Wombert> e.g. you set up an imagevalidator with severity info
20:43 < Wombert> then you ask the vm for the result to know if your upload is an image or not
20:43  * impl nods
20:44 < Wombert> [22:41] impl: I don't think it's worth the performance we get from not supporting it
20:44 < Wombert> doesn't that mean the lack of functionality is not worth the little speedup?
20:44 < impl> It was supposed to mean the opposite
20:44 < Wombert> I see
20:44 < Wombert> let me quickly do a benchmark again
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20:54 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/585 sums it up, I hope
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21:03 < CIA-11> dominik * r2126 /branches/0.11/src/validator/ (AgaviValidationManager.class.php AgaviValidator.class.php): 
21:03 < CIA-11> add validation serverity info
21:03 < CIA-11> allow setting of the affected arguments in a validator
21:03 < CIA-11> fixes #568,#585
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21:30 < Wombert> hmm
21:30 < Wombert> impl: 
21:30 < Wombert> float(0.81886792182922)
21:30 < Wombert> float(1.1466088294983)
21:30 < Wombert> 10k calls
21:31 < impl> That's not a whole lot
21:31 < Wombert> one level vs recursive (but only one level with replacements)
21:31 < impl> I wonder what that overhead is due to then
21:31 < Wombert> of course, once we _do_ have directives inside directives, it's gonna be faster
21:31 < Wombert> well because it's called twice
21:31 < impl> I know, but it's looping
21:32 < impl> it has to perform the same stuff again, so it should be double
21:32 < impl> but it's not
21:32 < Wombert> no
21:32 < Wombert> http://pastie.caboo.se/106323
21:32 < impl> meaning there's overhead somewhere else
21:32 < Wombert> look
21:32 < Wombert> the second iteration, the preg_replace_callback does not have any matches
21:32 < Wombert> which means it bails out right away
21:32 < impl> ah
21:34 < Wombert> awww
21:34 < Wombert> that's not gonna work!
21:34 < Wombert> anyway
21:34 < Wombert> because
21:34 < Wombert> gnaaah
21:34 < Wombert> if it cannot find a directive...
21:34 < Wombert> infinite loop
21:35 < Wombert> so I need to do the old style again
21:35 < Wombert> if $value != $oldvalue
21:37 < Wombert> impl: there are charming aspects to it
21:37 < Wombert> this JIT expanding is pretty neat if you think about it
21:37 < Wombert> for instance, we could set directives with %core.app_dir% in them before that is defined
21:38  * Wombert nudges jake 
21:38 < Wombert> are you alive duuuude?
21:38 < Wombert> that patch of yours would come in handy right now :>
21:45 < Wombert> float(0.78873705863953)
21:45 < Wombert> float(1.8591799736023)
21:45 < Wombert> with another level
21:46 < Wombert> the first one does of course not resolve that level, though
21:48 < Wombert> good news is, it doesn't leak memory anymore :p
21:49  * Wombert ponders
21:49 < Wombert> ...
21:49 < Wombert> I'll put it back in
21:51 < CIA-11> david * r2127 /branches/0.11/src/util/AgaviToolkit.class.php: restored AgaviToolkit::expandDirectives() behavior where directives inside directives are supported. See [2092] and [2093]; the memory usage is still on the same new low level, though.
21:55 < CIA-11> david * r2128 /branches/0.11/tests2/ (config/DatabaseConfigHandlerTest.php routing/RoutingTest.php): Changed a method name in tests' SampleRouting (loadConfig exists now in AgaviRouting!) and changed DatabasesConfigHandlerTest to reflect changes made in [2085] for #574
21:57 < CIA-11> david * r2129 /branches/0.11/tests2/routing/cases/Apache22ModuleSubdir.case.php: Added note to apache 2.2 multi-slash test failure, see #502
21:58 < CIA-11> david * r2130 /branches/0.11/tests2/routing/cases/Apache22ModuleSubdir.case.php: s-s-s-ave before you commit...
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22:03 < Wombert> digitarald: http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/568
22:05 < digitarald> ok, checking
22:09 < digitarald> hey fellows ... I shout a beer for everybody ...
22:10 < Wombert> woot!
22:10 < Wombert> I just realized something
22:10 < Wombert> :>
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22:13 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/502 is fixed!
22:14 < CIA-11> david * r2131 /branches/0.11/src/routing/AgaviWebRouting.class.php: cleanup of debugging comments left behind in [1979]
22:15 < CIA-11> david * r2132 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: Another CHANGELOG update, now with a release date, which means we're getting there
22:15 < digitarald> ... restarting miranda, getting a new beer
22:16 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to:  welcome to #agavi :: latest: 0.11RC5 :: RC6 coming :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA!
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23:09 < CIA-11> david * r2133 /branches/0.11/src/ (3 files in 3 dirs): "agavi project" now looks into the default code templates dir, too, and also creates a ProjectBaseModel. Closes #583 and #586
23:22 < CIA-11> david * r2134 /branches/0.11/src/ (build.xml buildtools/code_templates/config/autoload.xml): Follow-up to [2133], fixing ProjectBaseModel for good, refs #586
23:23 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11
23:23 < Wombert> :)
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23:45  * Arme[N] hugs Wombert 
23:54 < Arme[N]> good work guys special you Wombert 
23:55 < Wombert> okay mh
23:55 < Wombert> RC6 has to wait until the morning
23:55 < Wombert> leaving now, for italy :)
23:55 < Arme[N]> nice
23:55 < Wombert> or hang on
23:55 < Arme[N]> heh :)
23:55 < Wombert> I can roll it now...
23:55 < Wombert> nah
23:55 < Arme[N]> but I can't .... I need my pillow :P
23:55 < Wombert> has to wait, no time
23:56 < Wombert> sorry :)
23:56 < Arme[N]> night
23:56 < Arme[N]> Wombert: ;)
23:56 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to:  welcome to #agavi :: latest: 0.11RC5 :: RC6 coming TODAY :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA!
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23:58 < CIA-11> david * r2135 /branches/0.11/ (etc/phing/AgaviPackageTask.php src/version.php): RC6 version info
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07:13 < _cheerios> huomeenta!
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07:17 < RossC0> Huomenta!
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08:06 < E_mE> huomenta!
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09:13 < E_mE> am i allowed to use require_once() in my own libraries if integrating it into agavi?
09:13 < E_mE> when requiring my own classes in the directory
09:24 < MikeSeth> You can, but there's the autoloading mechanism :)
09:28 < E_mE> long as i include my root class, will agavi autoload all the other required classes
09:29 < E_mE> i wish i had one of my books at work :(
09:32 < MikeSeth> Add to the autoloading stack if you have special loading procedures
09:32 < MikeSeth> otherwise you can just load all your classe
09:32 < MikeSeth> classes
09:32 < MikeSeth> or rather just list them in autoload.xml
09:34 < E_mE> okay :)
10:23 < _cheerios> <Bardosity> and you might get a job maintaining someone else's C++ code
10:23 < _cheerios> <Bardosity> then you will be single and lonely and drink yourself to death
10:23 < _cheerios> :p
10:29 < _cheerios> btw., in ze logs i have several agavi parse execptions thruout the day, where it chokes on compiled configs. Im not really sure what is the cause.
10:32 < RossC0> _cheerios: one for you: http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/eclifox
10:35 < _cheerios> Wombert/kaos, or anyone: http://p.caboo.se/private/3jvgv0dx92ny7qtmeyonkw
10:36 < _cheerios> there's the error codes and the code it chokes on
10:36 < _cheerios> happens about 10 times a day, and there's no apache restarts
10:38 < _cheerios> RossC0, they sure do interesting stuff at imb.
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10:50 < RossC0> _cheerios: isn't that just an FPF error?
10:50 < _cheerios> shouldn't it give more information on where it happened if that was the case? like module/action?
10:51 < _cheerios> havent tested FPF error msgs for a while, ill see how they normally look for actions
10:53 < _cheerios> ah, right, just FPF errors -- i'd always been in dev mode locally, so the errors looked different
10:53 < _cheerios> how to get action information for FPF chokes? now it's pretty useless when logged, atleast the logs i get
10:57 < RossC0> have you set up FPF logging?
10:58 < RossC0> also what version of Agavi?
10:58 < _cheerios> does your log contain the action?
10:58 < _cheerios> rev 2041
11:00 < RossC0> actually nope - but it does display what its outputting
11:01 < _cheerios> i dont have FPF logging then, as i don't get the ouput. checking.
11:12 < _cheerios> *shrug* i don't get why its not logging
11:13 < _cheerios> ah
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11:16 < _cheerios> latest svn is b0rked
11:16 < _cheerios> PHP Parse error:  syntax error, unexpected '}' in /code/fr/libs/agavi/validator/AgaviValidator.class.php on line 505
11:20 < _cheerios> v-dogg, can you fix the missing ; ?
11:22 < _cheerios> RossC0, ok, working logger now. I believe the module/action information would be handy there too.
11:43 < _cheerios> how do i get agavi to pickup extended exception classes? or what's the best place to add this information, so its available for the template?
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12:04 < _cheerios> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkTRV7vz06k (if you have sound)
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14:06 < E_mE> does anyone know if there is an eqivlant to call_user_func() but for variables in classes??
14:07 < RossC0> say what?
14:08 < RossC0> what crazy stuff you trying to do E_mE ?
14:08 < RossC0> :D
14:08 < E_mE> created a function which will automatically add a var to an array.. but i dont want to keep repeating the code
14:09 < E_mE> infact ill paste
14:09 < E_mE> function addByType($columnType, $columnName) {
14:10 < E_mE> $ct = str_replace("add", "", $columnType);
14:10 < E_mE> $columnKey = $this->findColumnKey($columnName);
14:10 < E_mE> array_push($this->$ct, $columnKey);
14:10 < E_mE> }
14:11 < E_mE> and i want $this->$ct  aka $this->sumColumn to be called
14:11 < E_mE> you understand my idea?
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14:12 < E_mE> then i called i with $this->addByType(__FUNCTION__,'Blah');
14:13 < E_mE> but i key error cannot access empty property in ...
14:13 < E_mE> get*
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14:16 < RossC0> $this->$$ct ?
14:17 < E_mE> well i was thinking at first that if $ct = "sumColumn"; then $this->$$ct; might result in $this->sumColumn;
14:17  * E_mE think that i may need to use a reflectionClass
14:21 < E_mE> RossC0: any idea?
14:21 < E_mE> or am i trying to be too clever for what i'm trying to do?
14:23 < RossC0> I'm not quite sure what you are doing :D
14:23 < E_mE> ill pastebin :)
14:25 < E_mE> http://www.pastebin.ca/734211
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14:31 < RossC0> E_mE: well I'd simplify it
14:31 < RossC0> ditch: $ct = str_replace("add", "", $columnType) . 's';
14:31 < RossC0> have $columnType as the column type..
14:33 < RossC0> so 26: would be: $this->addByType('SumColumns', $columnName);
14:33 < E_mE> yes okay
14:34 < E_mE> still doesn't let me allow array_push($this->$columnType, $columnKey);
14:35 < E_mE> oh ignore me
14:35 < E_mE> it works :D
14:35 < E_mE> wow!
14:35 < E_mE> thanks for the simplification RossC0....
14:36 < RossC0> no worries
14:36 < E_mE> /msg nickserv identify connecttabs
14:36 < E_mE> fuck
14:38 < ttj> :-)
14:38 < ttj> "Whoops."
14:39 < E_mE> how annoying!!!
14:39 < E_mE> thats the second time its happened to me
14:40 < ttj> http://bash.org/?814243
14:49 < RossC0> hehe - hope you changed your password or someone will steal your identity
14:51 < E_mE> done already :)
14:56 < RossC0> ha but is that really you E_mE?
14:57 < RossC0> hahah internal email:
14:57 < RossC0> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsNFxOOnjgw&eurl= 
14:57 < RossC0> It's quite simple, he's obviously eaten an entire band
15:00 < E_mE> haahah ive killed E_mE!! he is now bleeding behind your television screens >:)
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15:03 < E_mE> wow! thats pretty damn amazing
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15:11 < RossC0> the followup was: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=136cNGNd7Yg
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15:51 < E_mE> have good weekend.. bye bye
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16:20  * RossC0 wonders where Wombert is today
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17:03 < _cheerios> "For $100Bn, it would probably be cheaper to "bring democracy to" Antigua. They should be careful what they wish for, soon those foreign online gambling organizations will find themselves with links to Al Qaeda they never knew they had. I also hear they are seeking to build nuclear weapons."
17:03 < _cheerios> :p
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17:37 < _cheerios> quit!=part
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19:06 < impl> :O
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19:24 < CIA-11> david * r2136 /branches/0.11/etc/agavi-dist: Added @PEAR-DIR@ replacement target again that was overwritten in some earlier commit
19:34 < _cheerios> does the svn build now? there was a missing ; on AgaviValidator.class.php earlier
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19:51 < Wombert> uuuuugh
19:51 < Wombert> sllloooooooow
19:56 < CIA-11> david * r2137 /branches/0.11/src/validator/AgaviValidator.class.php: fixed missing semicolon
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20:00 < Wombert> gawd internets are appalingly slow today
20:01 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to:  welcome to #agavi :: latest: 0.11RC5 :: RC6 coming once the tubes are uncongested :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA!
20:07 < _cheerios> my internet connex has been less stable ever since finland move to digi-time
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20:23 < MrJeep> so rc6 is comming out
20:23 < MrJeep> great :D
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21:45 < CIA-11> david * r2138 /tags/0.11.0RC6/: tagging 0.11.0 RC6 for release
21:45 -!- Wombert_ changed the topic of #agavi to:  welcome to #agavi :: 0.11RC6 is out! :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA!
21:45 < Wombert_> ejoy
21:45 < Wombert_> err
21:45 < Wombert_> enjoy :p
21:45  * Wombert_ pokes impl 
21:46 < _cheerios> cheers!
21:46 -!- Wombert_ is now known as Wombert
21:46 < Wombert> pear, zip and tgz are out
21:46 < Wombert> release is tagged
21:47 < Wombert> mail has been sent to mailing lists with release announce and descriptions
21:47 < Wombert> enjoy
21:47 < Wombert> we'll sync the docs tomorrow I guess
21:48 < Wombert> g'night
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21:52 < _cheerios> wombert is getting sleep lately? how abnormal.
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22:00 < Arme[N]> heh :)
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22:13 < splatch`> hello
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01:17 < jake> is anyone using Agavi with Smarty?
01:17 < jake> er, Agavi 0.11RC6
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02:37 < jake> holy crap the views/layers/etc are complicated now. I need to write this up.
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08:01 < Wombert_> hai :>
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09:35 < _cheerios> woot!
09:36 < _cheerios> damn i slept, and slept
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11:45 < _cheerios> Mr. Brooks \o/
11:47 < _cheerios> i love a good movie
11:54 < _cheerios> heh @ "Jos teitä haluttaisi ryhtyä yksityisyrittämään, mille alalle ryhtyisitte? Näin unta että isä puhui kuinka eräällä tuttavalla on paljon työtä kun se ryhtyi. Se osti auton ja ajaa kuljetuspalveluita. Kuljettaa kaikenlaisia paketteja. Sitten näin seuraavaksi kun poliisit jahtasivat sitä sen vuoksi kun auton osamaksut olivat maksamatta. Se auto oli sellainen vanha musta Taunus." 
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13:22 < Wombert> y0 guys what's up
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14:37 < _cheerios> "My forecast is that around 2050, the state of Massachusetts will be the first jurisdiction to legalize marriages with robots" :p
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18:55 < Wombert> wuuuzah
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19:03 < jake> hey Wombert
19:03 < Wombert> hi jake
19:03 < jake> sorry I missed you yesterday
19:03 < Wombert> no problem
19:03 < Wombert> query if you can
19:03 < jake> I pulled down the 0.11RC6 release though and the issue was gone
19:04 < Wombert> glad to hear
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19:28 < _cheerios> Wombert, how would I go about adding the URL of the request that gave an FPF error to the exception output?
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20:28 < Wombert> _cheerios: I don't quite understand
20:28 < _cheerios> to have the URL recorded as part of output
20:28 < Wombert> ah
20:29 < _cheerios> the HTML output of FPF is nice, but it helps some to have the exact URL with params too
20:29 < Wombert> coudl you log it seperately for now? :p
20:29 < Wombert> isn't that enough
20:29 < Wombert> yeah
20:29 < Wombert> but can't oyu make an exception template that logs
20:29 < Wombert> and then look for the same timestamp in the fpf log maybe
20:29 < Wombert> I will refactor a lot of code
20:29 < Wombert> for 1.0
20:29 < _cheerios> i know how to get the URL, but i didn't know what's the proper way tot extend exception classes. is there a place for them in factories.xml?
20:29 < Wombert> e.g. FPF will see tons of stuff swapped out into dedicated methods
20:29 < Wombert> so you can overwrite them easily
20:30 < _cheerios> i dont want hacks like that! :D
20:30 < v-dogg> no need to override anything. just use a different template
20:30 < v-dogg> isn't that enough?
20:30 < _cheerios> the templates dont have context
20:30 < v-dogg> what do you mean?
20:30 < Wombert> they do
20:30 < Wombert> v-dogg: he means FPF's logging of the HTML
20:30 < v-dogg> you can configure them per context
20:31 < _cheerios> they do? it seemed like they were require()'d
20:31 < v-dogg> you can have a template per context and/or per environment
20:31 < Wombert> you always have $e for the exception
20:31 < _cheerios> (as the exception classes i saw them using were so careful in prefilling anything that required context, i somehow gathered that conslusion :)
20:31 < Wombert> you can have $context (use instsanceof)
20:31 < Wombert> and $container
20:32 < Wombert> but not always of course, e.g. when bootstrap() did the exception
20:32 < Wombert> or when the exception occured in the context initialize
20:32 < Wombert> but once the framework is "far enough", you have the context
20:32 < Wombert> and also the (global, I think) request container
20:35 < jake> Is anyone using prope 1.3.0-dev successfully? I've tried within agavi and standalone, the default bookstore example using sqlite and a custom one using mysql, and I always get errors related to not specifying a database name
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20:36 < v-dogg> I think everyone here using propel use 1.3
20:37 < jake> Can anyone send me a working build.properties, runtime-conf.xml and schema.xml?
20:38 < v-dogg> veikko.fi/temp/cms.zip
20:40 < jake> thanks v-dogg 
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20:57 < Wombert> does that work, jake 
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21:07 < jake> heh, sort of. My test.php works against v-doggs generated files but not mine
21:08 < Wombert> _cheerios: ping
21:08 < Wombert> I'm looking for a site
21:08 < Wombert> that guy stopped blogging now
21:08 < Wombert> he was from england, I think
21:08 < Wombert> his blog had a header with a view from his parent's house
21:08 < Wombert> illustration, not photo
21:09 < Wombert> it changed by time of day, and also showed stuff like rain and fog depending on weather data for that location
21:10 < _cheerios> what was he blogging about?
21:10 < Wombert> he also had a nice comment system that was completely flat, but still threaded - you could mark comments to reply to, and so a comment box would have two "a reply to:" notes, and say four "replied to by:" notes to link to the commenst that replied to that one
21:10 < Wombert> all inline, with anchors
21:10 < Wombert> it was about web dev I think
21:10 < Wombert> he stopped blogging... dunno, two years ago?
21:10 < Wombert> not sure if he took the site offline or not
21:12 < _cheerios> must've made an impact for you to remember all this.
21:14 < _cheerios> from your clues I match iGoogle, the YUI developer's blog. Sorry, can't remember what you'd be talking about.
21:40 < jake> is context available as a substitution in a config? Like %context% ?
21:40 < Wombert> which config
21:40 < jake> sorry, not context, environment
21:40 < Wombert> %core.environment%
21:40 < Wombert> should work
21:40 < jake> perfect, thanks. Need it for databases.xml
21:40 < Wombert> do you want to make sth specific to an env?
21:40 < Wombert> noooo!
21:41 < Wombert> <configuration environment="development.*">
21:41 < Wombert>   <databases...>
21:41 < Wombert> that way
21:41 < Wombert> .* is regex
21:41 < jake> ahh, great
21:41 < Wombert> :)
21:41 < Wombert> bootstrap development-david
21:41 < Wombert> development-jake
21:41 < Wombert> etc
21:41 < jake> excellent
21:41 < Wombert> <configuraiton environment=".*maintenance.*">
21:41 < Wombert>   <settings>
21:41 < Wombert>     <setting name="available">false
21:41 < Wombert> !
21:41 < Wombert> :>
21:43 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/tags/0.11.0RC6/samples/app/config/routing.xml
21:43 < Wombert> for instance
21:44 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/tags/0.11.0RC6/samples/app/config/factories.xml#L42
21:44 < Wombert> !
21:45 < Wombert> do you use propel, jake 
21:45 < Wombert> you don't need a runtime-conf.php for each dev!
21:46 < jake> I'm not doing that, I'm just configuring a few datasources (prod,test,dev) and selecting the datasource based on env
21:46 < jake> devs don't have their own db's
21:46 < Wombert> that's ugly, too; I used to have proj-conf.php-dist in config/ and then each dev copies it and edits their user info
21:46 < Wombert> but
21:46 < Wombert> if -dist changes, people forget to sync them
21:46 < Wombert> and
21:46 < Wombert> often they check in their copy
21:46 < Wombert> ...
21:46 < jake> yeah, I just svn ignore the config file dir and a few other key files
21:46 < Wombert> you can have dsn etc parameters in propel database
21:47 < jake> And a commit master handles those changes, since they often impact many people
21:47 < Wombert> it will load the runtime conf you specified (required!) and then overwrite with the settings yu gave
21:47 < Wombert> no need for that!
21:47 < Wombert> use the databases.xml
21:47 < Wombert> then you can forget about the ignore and set everything in one place
21:47 < jake> except I still have to worry about developers screwing up a commit yes?
21:47 < Wombert> no!
21:47 < Wombert> I'll show you
21:48 < jake> great
21:52 < Wombert> jake: http://pastie.caboo.se/private/ewotyi4xr0hso8u6psvxvg
21:53 < Wombert> note... databases.xml cannot be per-context (so context attributes in <configuration> not possible), but could be in theory
21:53 < Wombert> we do not make it possible since we believe they should be the same for all of them
21:53 < jake> heh, the docs do not make it obvious that you can override things :)
21:53 < Wombert> sorry
21:53 < Wombert> btw
21:53 < jake> I just looked at the top of the AgaviPropelDatabase file
21:53 < Wombert> right now, you have to overwrite all of <databases> I think
21:54 < Wombert> this will change for 1.0
21:54 < Wombert> we move to native XML config handlers
21:54 < jake> Yeah, I don't think there's inheritence
21:54 < Wombert> where we can control this better
21:54 < Wombert> there is!
21:54 < Wombert> but not everywhere and in every case
21:54 < jake> hehe, I know, it cracks me up because I always try it
21:54 < jake> and it only works sometimes :)
21:54 < Wombert> for instance, for databases.xml, we have schema validation that barks at you if the "default" attrib is missing
21:54 < Wombert> in <databases>
21:54 < Wombert> uncoolo
21:55 < Wombert> 1.0 will validate the "cleaned" document probably
21:55 < Wombert> see how I use regex there
21:55 < Wombert> for the envnames
21:55 < Wombert> then you bootstrap "production1", "production2" etc for each server
21:55 < Wombert> easy
21:55 < Wombert> or development.* has debug on
21:55 < Wombert> you bootstrap development-jake, tadaaaa
21:56 < Wombert> makes deployment a piece of cake, too
21:56 < Wombert> the agavi specific part of moving something to production is copying index.php-dist
21:56 < jake> I was also kind of wondering about routing. With old school routing when you created a new action, regardless of the module, you could access it as /module/Name/action/Name
21:56 < Wombert> and bootstrapping the correct env there
21:56 < jake> Is there an 'easy' way to enable that?
21:56 < Wombert> you could write a routing callback that handles that but...
21:56 < jake> yeah, that's what I thought
21:56 < Wombert> it's not really much work to create routes for everything
21:57 < jake> no, it's just nice for standardization 
21:57 < Wombert> did you look at ProjectBaseView ?
21:57 < jake> I actually don't like to give marketing people options on urls if I don't have to
21:57 < Wombert> or wait haha
21:57 < jake> You end up with like /EditYourSelf!
21:58 < Wombert> <route name="moduleandaction" pattern="^/(module:\w+)/(action:\w+)" module="${module" action="${action}"
21:58 < Wombert> but
21:58 < Wombert> you cannot do per-action child routes there
21:58 < Wombert> know what I mean?
21:58 < jake> sure
21:58 < Wombert> so that /17/gallery/page/1 only works for /Pictures/View
21:58 < Wombert> etc
21:58 < Wombert> k
21:58 < jake> yep
21:58 < Wombert> anyway
21:58 < Wombert> did you look at ProjectBaseView ?
21:58 < jake> of course
21:58 < Wombert> did you understand the exceptions it throws there, and why execute is final?
21:58 < jake> I think as of now I've at least looked at every file :)
21:59 < jake> Well, I assumed because views should be responsible for implemented type specific outputs
21:59 < Wombert> <route name="rss" pattern="/rss$" cut="true" stop="false" output_type="rss" />
21:59 < Wombert> before your other routes
21:59 < Wombert> => all URLS ending on /rss trigger RSS output type
21:59 < Wombert> the action that was called... doesn'thave a view with executeRss
21:59 < Wombert> so base view execute() is run
21:59 < Wombert> which shows an error page
21:59 < Wombert> got it? :>
22:00 < jake> yep, I figured
22:00 < Wombert> that's why there is setupHtml(), not executeHtml() that does the init stuff
22:00 < Wombert> otherwise, they all serve html
22:00 < Wombert> setupHtml() is a userland thing, not an agavi convention
22:00 < Wombert> okay now... mmmh..
22:01 < Wombert> <route name="rss" pattern="/rss$" cut="true" stop="false" output_type="rss" />
22:01 < Wombert> <route name="products" pattern="^/products" module="Products">
22:01 < Wombert>   <route name=".index" pattern="^$" action="Index" />
22:01 < Wombert>   <route name=".latest" pattern="^/latest$" action="Latest" />
22:01 < Wombert> okay so far?
22:01 < Wombert> two things
22:02 < Wombert> a) note how index pattern is empty. you could have the action in the products route, that would work, childs can override parent settings, but then, /productsZOMGLOLJAKE would also run the index action!
22:02 < Wombert> that's why there is the empty subpattern for index
22:02 < Wombert> b) still have the rss there, right?
22:02 < Wombert> now enjoy this
22:02 < Wombert> $ro->gen('products.latest+rss');
22:02 < Wombert> :>>>
22:02 < jake> hehe
22:02 < Wombert> gives /products/latest/rss
22:02 < Wombert> :>
22:02 < Wombert> and a tip here
22:02 < Wombert> don't use trailingslashes in URLs
22:03 < Wombert> difficult to solve ambiguities
22:03 < jake> yeah, I'm not
22:03 < Wombert> very good
22:03 < Wombert> that's the spirit
22:03 < jake> I feel good about what I've gotten done in essentially 8 hours
22:03 < Wombert> glad to hear that
22:04 < jake> But yeah, we should potentially rethink documentation :)
22:07 < Wombert> word
22:07 < splatch`> hello :)
22:07 < Wombert> 1.0 = 0.11 + internal cleanup + speedup + docs
22:07 < splatch`> Wombert: i saw RC6 notice
22:07 < Wombert> splatch`: can you ask darek to reply to my mail!
22:07 < splatch`> Wombert: yes, two times
22:07 < Wombert> splatch`: he sent me the sutff already
22:07 < splatch`> when you ask me, i asked him
22:08 < Wombert> splatch`: but I need his okay that we can use the logo and modify things if we need to
22:08 < Wombert> I mailed him about that
22:08 < Wombert> so he should know what I mean
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22:09 < splatch`> Wombert: currently he talking with girlfriend so he will available today but, after 11 am
22:11 < Wombert> kk
22:11 < Wombert> thanks
22:11 < Wombert> I already told him what I need so it's not much work for him
22:11 < Wombert> he really just needs to answer my mail and write a line or two
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22:58 < splatch`> Wombert: kazek will send mail to you today or tomorrow
22:58 < splatch`> bye!
22:59 < Wombert> splatch`: no rush
22:59 < Wombert> thanks
23:14 < Wombert> nn
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--- Day changed Sun Oct 14 2007
00:11 < jake> so, flamewar time. Why isn't validation in the model?
00:24 < jake> or rather, why isn't it more formally part of the model? I see validation as something needed by both actions and models
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00:53 < E_mE> jake, why would you need it in the model? models are called from actions/views?
00:57 < jake> That's right. But imagine a form where you are signing up for a new service (creating a new user), and that information spans two models, a user.create model and a contactInfo.create model
00:57 < jake> Or even more in a really complex case
00:58 < jake> the validation for things like string length, duplication, etc has to happen in both places. You could do it all in the model, but there is no mechanism for it
00:59 < jake> Now imagine a second form which just users one of the models (user.create)
00:59 < jake> Now that action has to duplicate logic, yes?
01:04 < jake> I think that validation is domain knowledge, not application knowledge, so it should be container in the model
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02:10 < impl> jake: the problem is that a lot of time people don't use the built-in model framework for their models (like with Propel)
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02:10 < impl> and I think that the best way to work around it is /probably/ the way we have it now, although suggestions for making it more modely would be cool (for 2.0, since we can't change much now)
02:14 < Fast2> hey guys, i think there was a change recently that causes: $this->requestData->setParameters(json_decode($this->requestData->getParameter('json'), true)); 		 
02:14 < Fast2> the following error:
02:14 < Fast2> PHP Notice:  Undefined property:  AgaviJsonRequest::$requestData in D:\httpdocs\ths3\branches\3.0\app\lib\request\AgaviJsonRequest.class.php on line 54
02:14 < Fast2> PHP Fatal error:  Call to a member function setParameters() on a non-object in D:\httpdocs\ths3\branches\3.0\app\lib\request\AgaviJsonRequest.class.php on line 54
02:16 < Fast2> that code is in the initialise function of a class that extends AgaviWebRequest 
02:19 < Fast2> ahh... i see r2117 prevents global request data from being accessible in a View::initialize()
02:26 < Fast2> actually... it's 2108 that broke my code...
02:37 < Fast2> not that it's any problem ;-) 
02:47 < Fast2> getRequestData() works a treat :-)
02:47 < Fast2> $this->getRequestData()->setParameters(json_decode($this->getRequestData()->getParameter('json'), true));
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08:00 < Whisller> morning :)
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08:43 < _cheerios> http://www.tiikasalo.fi/thumbnails.php?album=topn&cat=-60 (2007 X-treme Car Show pics)
08:43 < Whisller> http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=1uwOL4rB-go
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08:58 < _cheerios> lol
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11:21 < _cheerios> gah. was wondering why my php script choked. doctrine!
11:29 < MikeSeth> mmm?
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11:42 < _cheerios> was me after all. managed to create an infinite loop when a certain condition occured. been a while! :D
11:52 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, what ye working on?
12:04 < MikeSeth> writing a custom log analyzer in newlisp
12:05 < MikeSeth> (define (parse-entry-line line)	
12:05 < MikeSeth> 	(if 
12:05 < MikeSeth> 		(regex "^(\\d{2}:\\d{2}:\\d{2}\.\\d{3}) (.+)$" line) (list $1 $2)
12:05 < MikeSeth> 		(list nil line)))
12:05 < MikeSeth> :D
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12:22 < _cheerios> cool
12:23 < _cheerios> damn it's cold washing windows
12:23 < MikeSeth> cold washing windows?
12:24 < _cheerios> it's +5C, rainy and slightly windy outside
12:24 < MikeSeth> awww i wish
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12:26 < _cheerios> ? :)
12:28 < MikeSeth> I wish rain
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12:32 < Wombert> hai
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13:27 < _cheerios> windows 98...shame on you
13:27 < _cheerios> windows Me...shame on me
13:27 < _cheerios> windows vista...GTFO of our country 
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13:35 < MikeSeth> _cheerios:++
13:36 < _cheerios> from http://slashdot.org/articles/07/10/13/2121250.shtml "Bill Gates Denied Visa To Nigeria"
13:41 < MikeSeth> eh heh heh
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15:45 < _cheerios> (Doctrine) column defined as, id int(8), and updating table with values $id=1,$food='plz' results in a query UPDATE id='1',food='plz' WHERE id='1' ... but changing $id to $id='1' results in UPDATE food='plz' WHERE id='1' ... huh? :D
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15:47 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: it probably considers the value changed if the type changes
15:49 < _cheerios> then it should work backwards in that case? it doesn't consider it changed when i give it a string into an int column
15:52 < _cheerios> not to mention id is an auto_increment column. usually you don't want to tamper with those.
15:53 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: bizzare like fuck. 
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15:57 < _cheerios> doctrine is the only software that makes me afraid to update, as i won't know how many new bugs have crept in :)
15:58 < jake> are you using doctrine in production?
15:59 < MikeSeth> I am
15:59 < MikeSeth> I'm crazy ;)
16:00 < _cheerios> i am
16:01 < jake> what is 'production' for you? Tens of millions of hits a day?
16:02 < _cheerios> production is outside of my local box
16:02 < MikeSeth> jake: I do intranet stuff. It's about data integrity, not availability
16:03 < jake> doctrine just looks like a _lot_ of code and I wonder how well tested it is, I don't know of that many people using it. It looks sweet though.
16:04 < _cheerios> they change a lot of stuff daily, so writing against it is a pain
16:06 < _cheerios> eg, their import went from import to iprt to importSchema in a few week's time. stuff like that.
16:09 < _cheerios> but it's a nice ORM to have, and i'm sure they'll get over the current kinks
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16:11 < _cheerios> jake, you work on sites with 10s of millions of daily hits?
16:12 < jake> yes
16:13 < jake> a few, as a contractor
16:13 < jake> I work on scalability issues for rapid growth LAMP shops
16:14 < _cheerios> you rewrite their code in C?
16:14 < jake> haha, no
16:15 < jake> scalability has to be gauged both in how quickly and effectively people write code and how well the site performs under load
16:15 < jake> it's cheaper to add more servers (if you've written things right) then to move to C/C++, in general
16:16 < _cheerios> what are the basic things done wrong?
16:21 < jake> First, mixing business logic with app logic with presentation logic. That makes it difficult to grow your team. Second, never creating a data API for interacting with your db. Not doing this makes database changes costly. Not creating portable software. Not preparing your software to be able to utilize a CDN. Using PHP in templates for more than just assignment. Not using web services.
16:22 < jake> I mean, a lot of those are just kind of 'best practice' things, but no one does them at a startup, or they rarely do
16:22 < _cheerios> There's a lot to know
16:23 < jake> Then in terms of architecture, effective caching schemes are the most useful for helping scale a site in the short term
16:23 < jake> In the long term you have to actually break out application components into services and rewrite your presentation layer to utilize the service stack
16:23 < jake> Then you can grow services as you need to
16:24 < _cheerios> Lately I've wanted to go the amazon way. Make services out of everything, and interact via APIs.
16:24 < jake> I actually don't think that's the best way to build things
16:24 < jake> I think in the long run it can be, but for startups it's suicide
16:25 < _cheerios> How's that?
16:25 < jake> A multi-tiered system takes more resources in terms of equipment, people, and time
16:25 < _cheerios> You mean due cost of building the APIs?
16:25 < jake> It's also more difficult to debug
16:26 < jake> But, I love Agavi because I make extensive use of the models and use them everywhere. Actions/Views/Templates never interact with the data layer, they interact with the models
16:26 < jake> Then when I want to scale via a service, I can just swap out the old model code and maintain the API more or less
16:27 < jake> A lot of mistakes people make early on have to do with the data layer anyhow, and it becomes difficult to change later on
16:27 < jake> Like for instance, using stored procedures/triggers/etc is a bad thing in general, it decreases scalability
16:28 < jake> And you'll get people who just completely pimp their db using all possible features
16:28 < jake> Which is a killer when you need to either shard your data, move to a different db platform, or make changes to your business logic
16:30 < _cheerios> I'm looking forward to mysql 5.1's partitioning features, but the syntax seemed a bit lacking to my purposes (as it seemed I needed to manually tell mysql what to partition).
16:31 < _cheerios> I havent found real tools (software) to help with partitioning db data. Maybe there's all costly enteprise stuff still?
16:32 < jake> dunno, I've always done it by hand
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16:33 < _cheerios> Like in my current project I want to partition data by month, and have it happen automatically, without me having to specify the month's all the time.
16:33 < jake> is it like archive/log data?
16:33 < _cheerios> Mostly data that won't be accessed much, yes.
16:33 < _cheerios> But there needs to be access points to it.
16:33 < jake> For that you should just look into an ETL tool, there are a couple of good opensource tools
16:34 < jake> That way you can store things for OLTP but munge it for reporting in an OLAP db
16:35 < _cheerios> It's not log data however, it's application data, that's just "old".
16:35 < jake> sure, I think this is still a good approach, although I don't know enough about the data access patterns to say that for sure
16:36 < jake> I've done the same thing in the past with like a half TB of mysql data, it worked great
16:36 < _cheerios> Do these allow me to work/access with the data the same way in my code, even when stored?
16:37 < jake> well, are you modifying the data?
16:37 < _cheerios> nope
16:37 < jake> oh, then this is perfect. You would have to change your access patterns but the OLAP db is specifically for rapid access to report style data
16:38 < jake> Generally a dwh is like a 3-6 months project at a minimum, so that may be longer then what you're looking for :)
16:39 < jake> You could look at putting Pentaho on top of the data if you went that route, I really like pentaho for BI stuff
16:39 < _cheerios> I'd prefer 2 weeks.
16:40 < jake> heh, just split the data by hand and create a MERGE table
16:40 < _cheerios> If nothing else comes by, I'll write my own code to accomodate :)
16:40 < jake> then use the MERGE table for reporting
16:42 < _cheerios> hmm, that might actually work.
16:43 < _cheerios> except the hand part would be automatic, manual labor is too much :)
16:43 < jake> heh, of course
16:47 < splatch`> hello
16:52 < _cheerios> Pentaho seems interesting. What kind of problems does it solve for you?
17:03 < jake> well, once you've got all this data, allowing users to interact with it in a rich environment is expensive to develop
17:03 < jake> things like pivot tables, report generation, dashboards, etc
17:03 < jake> pentaho does all of that kind of stuf
17:04 < jake> plus authentication, reporting hierarchies, etc
17:04 < jake> And if you're writing reports by hand, in PHP, probably with jpgraph, you end up spending a lot of time writing/maintaining those reports
17:04 < jake> With pentaho you can let business users create and write their own reports
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19:06 < Wombert> dinner ->
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21:20 < _cheerios> so the weekend went :|
21:25 < ttj> Yeah. Spent it in drunkenland and the hangover hell.
21:25 < ttj> s/the/then/
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07:03 < v-dogg> huomenta
07:04 < Whisller> morning
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07:51 < RossC0> Huomenta!
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08:07 < _cheerios> huomenta!
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08:21 < Wombert> hello :>
08:21 < Wombert> RossC0: I'm in italy :> that's why I wasn't online friday
08:21 < Wombert> (photos @ teh blog)
08:23 < RossC0> cool
08:23 < RossC0> you went there to work?
08:28 < _cheerios> photos, where?
08:28 < RossC0> Hmm Wombert - so using VM for setting Errors is being depreciated?
08:31 < Wombert> RossC0: still there, yes, workshop week w/ a client
08:32 < Wombert> _cheerios: http://blog.bitxtender.com/ :>
08:32 < Wombert> RossC0: no, using setError()
08:32 < Wombert> it's just something we keep for convenience
08:34 < RossC0> ah cool - I disagree with this then: http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/587#comment:1
08:35 < _cheerios> comfy looking place you're at
08:36 < Wombert> _cheerios: very
08:36 < RossC0> seems odd not to have a convenience method for setting multi field errors - maybe not in setError - but makes sense to add some convenience for that case also
08:36 < RossC0> brb meeting
08:36 < Wombert> eww can't reach agavi.org :S
08:36 < Wombert> can anyone?
08:37 < v-dogg> no
08:37 < v-dogg> dns problems
08:38 < v-dogg> what's the ip?
08:43 < _cheerios> nope
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08:56 < RossC0> nope 
09:31 < Wombert> mh
09:31 < Wombert> I guess that will fix itself :p
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09:47 < Wombert> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florence ->
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10:07 < digitarald> mh, where is agavi.org?
10:11 < v-dogg> gone fishing
10:11 < v-dogg> leave a message after beep
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10:16 < digitarald> *waitingforthebeep*
10:17 < digitarald> any alternative svn? ;)
10:17 < E_mE> have you ever gone ice fishing?
10:17 < E_mE> with a bottle of vodka :D
10:22 < _cheerios> how does fishing work out with a bottle of vodka?
10:27 < digitarald> does drunken fishing look like drunken dodging?
10:30 < E_mE> _cheerios: get the fish drunk
10:30 < E_mE> ;)
10:30 < _cheerios> sounds like a waste of good alcohol
10:30 < E_mE> eat the fish and you get double drunk 
10:33 < E_mE> i would love to go ice fishing one day
10:33 < E_mE> with me consuming the vodka
10:33 < digitarald> the vodka is not for the fishs?
10:34 < E_mE> well, its your desire... vodka fish... or fish with vodka!
10:39 < E_mE> i hadd to reboot one of the servers here which had been running for 222 days
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11:03 < _cheerios> obligatory "that's nothing!" shout
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11:04 < MugeSo> hi
11:08 < MugeSo> Is the DNS server down now?
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11:10 < _cheerios> agavi.org beat Wombert to the pool at Florence
11:15 < MugeSo> :S
11:24 < MugeSo> it has come back! thx
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14:34 < MrJeep_> jeez, what the hell is wrong with opera
14:34 < MrJeep_> he seems worse than IE6
14:35 < MrJeep_> anyway
14:35 < MrJeep_> I've made some change in a website (the car of death project :)
14:35 < MrJeep_> original : http://www.alternativauto.ca/
14:35 < MrJeep_> new style : http://www.alternativauto.ca/beta
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15:28 < _cheerios> uh huh
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15:45 < RossC0> heh MrJeep_
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15:46 < RossC0> nice web2.0 stylez :D
15:47 < MrJeep> thanks :)
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17:31 < Whisller> has someone of you problem with focus() (JS) on safari? because elementId.focus() doesn't work hmm
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18:43 < _cheerios> According to court documents filed by ex-enabler Kevin Federline, Spears' average monthly income is $737,868 U.S
18:43 < _cheerios> not bad!
18:55 < _cheerios> ~922 days of consulting at $100/hour.
18:57 < marklar> bald & ugly > smart
19:11 < MikeSeth> zomg mark <3
19:11 < MikeSeth> marklar: plz CV => me@mikeseth.com
19:14 < marklar> ok
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19:17 < marklar> fuckin a
19:17 < marklar> where'd I put the pdf
19:18 < marklar> you want ascii/pdf/html?
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19:32 < marklar> MikeSeth: sent, pdf.
19:32 < MikeSeth> marklar: ack ack
19:32 < MikeSeth> hay wombie, kaos
19:32 < marklar> tell me if it's teh lamer
19:32 < kaos|work> hey
19:32 < marklar> haven't written one in years
19:32 < marklar> damn army.
19:33 < MikeSeth> marklar: tis informal, if there be a problem i'll let you knows
19:33 < marklar> <3 informal
19:33 < MikeSeth> do want
19:34 < marklar> do want?
19:37 < marklar> no gets u :(
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19:46 < MikeSeth> http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/05/do-want.jpg
19:50 < marklar> haha
19:50 < marklar> nice
20:02  * Wombert yawns
20:04 < _cheerios> HOWS THE POOL
20:04 < MikeSeth> the what?
20:11 < Wombert> _cheerios: unbearably cold
20:11 < Wombert> MikeSeth: http://blog.bitxtender.com/
20:11 < _cheerios> *g*
20:12 < marklar> :(
20:14 < marklar> vodkadrip++
20:15 < marklar> heh
20:15 < marklar> Dora the Explorer episode, 160 kB/s. a House episode, 20 kB/s.
20:15 < marklar> the internet is strange.
20:16  * Wombert scratches head
20:17 < Wombert> ooookaaaayyyy
20:17 < marklar> I have a kid sister, hence the Dora stuff.
20:20 < splatch`> hello
20:21 < splatch`> Wombert: do you got mail from darek?
20:24 < Wombert> splatch`: mmmh nope
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20:52 < splatch`> Wombert
20:53 < Wombert> yes, splatch`?
20:54 < splatch`> Wombert: can i kick darek? ;)
20:54 < Wombert> no
20:54 < Wombert> but you can ask him politely if he could please write a quick reply to my last mail
20:54 < Wombert> :)
20:55 < splatch`> Wombert: ok, i've interpersonal skills diploma ;)
20:56 < ttj> Yo, Wombie.
20:56 < splatch`> hello ttj 
20:56 < splatch`> Wombert: you have own company?
20:56 < ttj> Heya, splatch`.
20:56 < ttj> Yeah, and he'll soon have a TT. :P
20:57 < Wombert> ttj: no :p
20:57 < Wombert> splatch`: yup, why
20:57 < Wombert> ?
20:59 < splatch`> Wombert: ach, i just ask, maybe in next year i'll start own buisness :)
20:59 < Wombert> splatch`: :)
21:00 < splatch`> at wednesday i've meeting with man who want me as software consultant/developer
21:00 < ttj> Wombert: Can't send private messages on freenode. :D
21:01 < Wombert> ttj: you suck
21:01 < Wombert> do /msg NickServ HELP REGISTER
21:01 < ttj> Wombert: No, the guy who has registered my nick sucks.
21:01 < splatch`> Wombert: am i also suck? ;)
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21:01 < splatch`> hehe, i forgot my password :)
21:01 < Wombert> ttj: then maybe your nick sucks :p
21:02 < ttj> My ninck is absolutely cool.
21:02 < ttj> My nick too.
21:02 < splatch`> ttj: yes, for me it's sounds like mouse click :)
21:11 < Wombert> ttj: uh huh
21:14 < ttj> Wombert: Nope, haven't seen the new Top Gear yet. :-/
21:14 < Wombert> :S
21:14 < ttj> Been working on my thesis a bit again. \o/
21:14 < ttj> Tactical was strategic motivators in outsourcing. *grin*
21:14 < ttj> s/was/vs/
21:15 < _cheerios> outsourcing: used to get rid off all the people you don't like
21:15 < ttj> :-)
21:16 < _cheerios> that one's in the house ;)
21:17 < _cheerios>  /s/in/on ... still time for Dexter s0203
21:17 < ttj> Sorry, don't think I can quote that in my paper. :P
21:17  * _cheerios happy. wrote a 10k line application in 200.
21:17 < _cheerios> heh :)
21:19 < ttj> But offshoring might not succeed if you don't drink beer or vodka. :P
21:19 < ttj> That's what one paper said.
21:27 < splatch`> bye :)
21:58 < Wombert> nn
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00:37 < nfq> yo peeps..
00:38 < nfq> hey impl
00:49 < nfq> anyone got a moment?
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06:51 < v-dogg> huomenta
06:54 < trophaeum_> wtf does huomenta mean?
06:56 < v-dogg> morning in Finnish
06:59 < trophaeum_> ahhhhh, freaking international weirdos :P
07:12 < Whisller> morning
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07:22 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
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07:57 < _cheerios> huomenta!
08:00 < RossC0> Yo!
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08:30 < _cheerios> http://koutuk.blogspot.com/2007/10/when-life-becomes-good-for-programmer.html
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08:31 < Wombert> hai
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08:32 < Wombert> trophaeum: it's teh official greeting here
08:32 < Wombert> HUOMENTA :>
08:33 < v-dogg> I'm afraid Wombert is going to be very disappointed when he gets to meet me and my wife next month
08:33 < v-dogg> because we are not so weird as he thinks we are :)
08:33 < v-dogg> not even close, I'm afraid :)
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08:41 < Wombert> :<
08:41  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
08:41 < Wombert> that doesn't matter, my friend
08:42 < Wombert> I'm sure I'll still like you
08:42 < Wombert> and I'm sure your wife thinks you're weird :p
08:43 < v-dogg> haha
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08:56 < RossC0> v-dogg: don't worry I'm sure Wombert is more wierd than you think ! 
08:56  * RossC0 hugs Wombert
08:56 < RossC0> :D :p
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08:59 < RossC0> _cheerios: tumbled that! :D
08:59 < E_mA> huomenta!
09:02 < RossC0> Huomenta!
09:02 < E_mA> grr how can a server from one day to anther start to go potty
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10:09 < RossC0> Do I have to do something to allow my exception template have access to vars like : $ro, $us etc?
10:10 < CIA-11> david * r2139 /branches/0.11/ (11 files in 6 dirs): Code cleanup: no space character between ampersand and function name in method declarations
10:25 < Wombert> RossC0: if $context instanceof AgaviContect
10:25 < Wombert> then you can grab it from there
10:25 < Wombert> do the check tho
10:25 < Wombert> you have to
10:25 < Wombert> you might have exception with no context
10:28 < RossC0> ok cheers
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10:50 < RossC0> hmm: http://www.kryogenix.org/code/cruciforum/
11:07 < _cheerios> 2k lines is simple? :D
11:13 < _cheerios> nice touch with the ?replies=5 at the end of the thread urls
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11:25 < _cheerios> without the bundled textile and the templates it's ~400 lines, better
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11:33  * Wombert_ blinks
11:33 < Wombert_> 31 users!
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11:33 < Wombert> mkay, 25 :p
11:34 < _cheerios> A nice website + docs and it's double in no time!
11:37 < Wombert> you're volunteering, _cheerios?
11:38 < _cheerios> To what?
11:39 < Wombert> pff
11:46 < _cheerios> Is that system still under work where it's possible to contribute to docs (wiki-like), make comments to docs etc?
11:47 < ttj> Huh? Wombert is coming to Finland? :o
11:48 < Wombert> ttj: err?
11:48 < Wombert> ttj: no, why? :p
11:48 < ttj> 11:33 < v-dogg> I'm afraid Wombert is going to be very disappointed when he gets to meet me and my wife next month
11:48 < Wombert> ah
11:48 < Wombert> no, they're coming to Frankfurt, ttj 
11:48 < Wombert> http://phpconference.com/
11:48 < Wombert> :>
11:48 < ttj> Oh.
11:48 < ttj> Nerds. :-(
11:49 < Wombert> well I guess she's coming for shopping, not for the nerd stuff
11:49 < ttj> Come to Finland! See Santa Claus! And our telephone network!
11:49 < Wombert> haha
11:49 < Wombert> ttj: did you check the fares for Munich-Milan ?
11:49 < Wombert> if it's just as cheap, I'm in
11:50 < ttj> Sorry, didn't. Plus it turns out that I'm only in Milan for one evening and then I'm going to Forli to see a friend of mine.
11:53 < _cheerios> Internet dating, ttj?
11:53 < ttj> Hmm?
11:54 < ttj> Ah! You mean the entry in my blog?
11:56 < _cheerios> you have a blog too?
11:57 < ttj> Umm, yeah. Fourth reincarnation. This one's been up since summer '06.
11:59 < RossC0> we need a blog role on agavi.org!
12:00 < _cheerios> A group blog where anyone can post best practices / tips, agavi-related stuff would be good.
12:00 < ttj> Well, I don't blog that much about technology or anything interesting like that. :-/
12:01 < _cheerios> irc + blog + docs + "wiki" + wombert consulting hotline, and there should be an easier to find trace of things, maybe :)
12:02 < _cheerios> ttj, url?
12:02 < ttj> eternalcoffeebreak.blogspot.com
12:03 < ttj> But as said, it's boring -- no juicy stuff from work and no programming, etc. :-/
12:08 < _cheerios> nice looks! :D
12:11 < RossC0> Was it wise? Hell no. Was it required? Hell yes.
12:11 < RossC0> :D
12:12 < ttj> 'twas not a very good day.
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13:01 < E_mA> does agavi have XML functionality... to create XML lists?
13:01 < E_mA> or do i use PHP functions?
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13:02 < RossC0> E_mA: use PHP
13:02 < RossC0> its native
13:07 < E_mA> ive just been enlightened by the power of XML in Excel :D
13:07 < E_mA> screw my ideas of CSV files
13:07 < E_mA> XML aheaddddd......!
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13:27 < RossC0> E_mE: ??
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13:32 < E_mE> RossC0: well, i just saved a excel spreadsheet as XML and it saves all the data that is required to make it look the same in another version of Excel
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13:32 < E_mE> it will be perfect for dumping database data into a XML file which Excel can open up in the way i desire for it to look
13:33 < RossC0> hmm - cool
13:33 < RossC0> That work for old versions of Excel?
13:35 < E_mE> well im working on Offie XP
13:35 < E_mE> Office
13:35 < E_mE> which i believe is 2002
13:37 < E_mE> test it out by saving a Excel document as a XML file... then open it up...  i think i might even hold formulas
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13:38 < E_mE> it does indeed store formulas
13:40 < RossC0> ah cool
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14:04 < Wombert> when I click "pre-order now" at http://apple.com/macosx/ Safari crashes...
14:04 < Wombert> very ace
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15:59 < Whisller> I don't like safari :/
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16:23 < E_mE> byebye
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17:06 < Whisller> yawn
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17:45 < Whisller> night
17:49 < Wombert> http://phpframeworks.itsp.info/ oO
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19:00 < _cheerios> \o/ Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 67108864 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 35 bytes) in /libs/doctrine/Doctrine/Table.php on line 1157
19:01 < _cheerios> and it only took 2000 iterations :|
19:03 < lordHelmchen1977> hey! how do i populate an parameter holder into a form? $rq->setAttribute('populate', array('inputId'=>'The Value'), 'org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter'); in the view doesn't make it...
19:04  * _cheerios awaits for php 5.3
19:05 < _cheerios> by doing just that :) new AgaviParameterHolder(array())
19:08 < lordHelmchen1977> so this should work?
19:08 < lordHelmchen1977> $this->getContext()->getRequest()->setAttribute('populate', NEW AgaviParameterHolder($populate), 'org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter');
19:10 < lordHelmchen1977> hm... but it doesn't... do i have to define the form to populate into in any way?
19:17 < lordHelmchen1977> okay - i added an id to the form and called $this->getContext()->getRequest()->setAttribute('populate', array('EditForm'=>NEW AgaviParameterHolder($populate)), 'org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter');
19:17 < lordHelmchen1977> with
19:17 < lordHelmchen1977> <form action="<?php echo($template['url']); ?>" method="post" id="EditForm" enctype="multipart/form-data">
19:17 < lordHelmchen1977> that works fine.
19:17 < _cheerios> http://p.caboo.se/private/gbx7qusnm8g1nur1w9v2jw
19:18 < lordHelmchen1977> yeah - that's it.
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06:07 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:15 < RossC0> Huomenta!
07:27 < Whisller> morning
07:31 < Whisller> hmm
07:32 < Whisller> I want say you something, guys you are doing really good job with agavi :) And I just want to thank you!
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07:52 < Wombert> huomenta
07:53 < ttj> Yo.
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07:55 < _cheerios> huomenta
07:55 < _cheerios> http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2007/apr/25/starsgalaxiesandplanets.spaceexploration
07:57 < RossC0> ZOMG ALIENS!
07:59 < Wombert> WOOT
07:59 < Wombert> MAYBE THEY NEED A FRAMEWORK, TOO
08:00  * Wombert starts sending the agavi source out into space
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08:30 < Whisller> I must make second coffe.
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09:23 < E_mE> huomenta!
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10:44 < RossC0> If I use compile.xml - do I have to any mods to autoload.xml ?
10:44 < RossC0> how does it work?
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12:05 < E_mE> RossC0: does Doctrine only use PDO or can it use other libraries?
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12:25 < RossC0> E_mE: PDO
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13:17 < Wombert> RossC0: awesome quote!
13:19 < RossC0> :>
13:19 < RossC0> muhhahahahaha
13:20 < RossC0> its evil !
13:20 < v-dogg> woot! somemesomeme
13:20 < v-dogg> öalksdjö 32 asdö l#"¤
13:20 < v-dogg> show me
13:20 < RossC0> agileweb.org
13:20 < RossC0> There are two rules for success. . .
13:20 < RossC0>  1) Never tell everything you know.
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13:23  * v-dogg gets the joke - finally - and stops waiting for the second rule
13:24 < ttj> There's a nifty way to keep a moron in suspense...
13:25 < RossC0> lol
13:52 < MikeSeth> WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOO
13:52 < MikeSeth> http://politics.reddit.com/info/5ygug/comments/
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14:22 < _cheerios> how much ajax do you guys use with your agavi projects?
14:25 < MikeSeth> as little as ever necessary
14:37 < Arme[N]> RossC0: cool :D
14:39 < _cheerios> http://www.pronetadvertising.com/articles/images/ms_stumbleye.png
14:40 < RossC0> _cheerios quite a bit - its all in there unobtrusively
14:42 < _cheerios> i havent used much ajax in agavi before. how do you handle form submit errors (+ possible client-side fpf)?
14:44 < RossC0> well I put json in the headers and then can respond as appropriate
14:45 < RossC0> I have json codes i.e.  redirect, success, error etc.. all of which may have different behaviour
14:45 < _cheerios> how do you do that transparently ? or do you write custom executeJsons()s to duplicate some of the work done in executeHtml() ?
14:46 < RossC0> executeAjax and then set the headers and have the html template if needed for the response
14:46 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I have a base Ajax view that does that
14:46 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, paste?
14:47 < MikeSeth>         public function executeJson(AgaviRequestDataHolder $rd)
14:47 < MikeSeth>         {
14:47 < MikeSeth>                 $this->throwNoDefaultHandlerException();
14:47 < MikeSeth>         }
14:47 < MikeSeth>         public function setJsonError($http_code)
14:47 < MikeSeth>         {
14:47 < MikeSeth>                 return $this->getResponse()->setHttpStatusCode($http_code);
14:47 < MikeSeth>         }
14:47 < MikeSeth> basically that's it :)
14:50 < _cheerios> RossC0, hmmk. So if the ajax response gets a template (fpf run?), it will be displayed over the current page (you have some set div-id for this?). otherwise just print status/message?
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14:52 < _cheerios> throwNoDefaultHandlerException?
14:58 < _cheerios> i remember kaos was asking for documentation ideas, http://trac.agavi.org/wiki/Documentation/NeedsDocumentation. I think this should be a good one, how to tie in Ajax with Agavi... painlessly.
15:00 < RossC0> _cheerios: Ajax is just a http request
15:01 < RossC0> so use your output types ftw!
15:02 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: its a custom thing. Generally you dont need anything special because your view's executeJson() can just return json_encode($output)
15:05 < _cheerios> RossC0, ..., do you specify the template to be returned manually in each executeAjax, or how is that done in Agavi?
15:05 < RossC0> _cheerios: I can clear layers if I'm not returning a template
15:05 < RossC0> else I return the normal html
15:05 < RossC0> I do set JSON in the headers
15:09 < _cheerios> Do you have any code duplication between executeHtml+Ajax for the same action?
15:10 < RossC0> Sometimes because they do different things
15:10 < RossC0> but I can have an executeCommon() method to DRY it ip
15:10 < RossC0> *up
15:12 < _cheerios> That's what it seems to boil down to
15:12 < _cheerios> Even for a simple redirect http://p.caboo.se/private/1ee7akqtmiiatmzrxjbuw
15:13 < RossC0> I would let js handle the redirect
15:14 < _cheerios> After you've setup that same code in executeJson to fill the values for the response?
15:14 < _cheerios> (im a bit lost on how to dry up things)
15:14 < _cheerios> (without creating a mess)
15:15 < RossC0> _cheerios put your common code into a method that can be shared by any views that need it
15:16 < RossC0> Nothing says you have to put all your logic in the executeHtml method
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15:18 < _cheerios> Sure, the thought of having an added $this->setupCommon() after the $this->setupHtmlJson just irks me some
15:20 < RossC0> no
15:20 < RossC0> only when needed
15:20 < RossC0> ie.
15:20 < RossC0> executeAjax() { $this->executeCommon(); // blah blah do something Ajaxy}
15:21 < RossC0> I also have executeJson -  but that soley delivers JSON as text
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15:27 < MikeSeth> RossC0: I was pondering to write a filter to autoconvert container attributes to a json response, but David talked me out of it
15:28 < RossC0> good
15:28 < RossC0> :D
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15:28 < RossC0> seems simpler without
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18:23 < Whisller> hmm
18:33 < splatch`> oi! :D
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01:18 < Wombert> hai
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02:58 < shoan> anybody has any experience with spl iterators?
03:01 < Wombert> shoan: errr... more precisely?
03:01  * impl blinks at Wombert's sleep patterns
03:01 < Wombert> well
03:01 < Wombert> I slept a little in the bus from italy
03:01 < shoan> i am wondering how to go about designing them. Do you start with outermost iterator or the inner most. In my case...
03:02 < shoan> I need to iterate over a directory, looking for particular files, in each file match a regex pattern
03:02 < shoan> so I think thats 3 iterators
03:02 < shoan> so do I start with working on the directory or the regex?
03:04 < Wombert> you need to iterate over the directory first but...
03:04 < Wombert> errr
03:04 < Wombert> do you need an iterator for the regular expression?
03:05 < shoan> hmm.... actually not
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06:09 < Arme[N]> Humenta!
06:09 < Arme[N]> +o
06:36 < v-dogg> huomenta
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06:53 < Whisller> morning
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07:18 < RossC0> Huomenta!
07:42 < RossC0> Wombert: yt?
07:42 < RossC0> I have caching questions!
07:42 < RossC0> :D
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08:11 < E_mE> huomenta!
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08:43  * E_mE is install the lastest version of Kubuntu :D
08:49 < epaulin> E_mE: cool, how was it?
08:49 < epaulin> did you try KDE4.0 beta3?
08:49 < v-dogg> does it have AERO? :p
08:53 < MikeSeth> screw kde
08:53 < MikeSeth> try emacs 22 ;)
08:54 < epaulin> v-dogg: take a look at Compiz Fusion, but last time I tried, looks it still in the bleeding edge.
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08:57 < _cheerios> huomenta
09:25 < E_mE> epaulin: im just trying to get my monitors to work.. 2 monitors and KDE dont mix :/
09:27 < epaulin> cool
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09:29 < RossC0> E_mE: thats not right
09:29 < RossC0> they do mix :D
09:29 < RossC0> but config of xorg.conf can be a hassle
09:31 < RossC0> E_mE: what distro you using?
09:31 < E_mE> kubuntu
09:32 < RossC0> what gfx card?
09:32 < E_mE> its screwed my monitor settings up
09:32 < E_mE> ati card
09:32 < E_mE> it won;t display anything on the monitors... its resoultion is fubar
09:33  * E_mE back into safemode
09:33 < RossC0> ah ok
09:33 < RossC0> you run aticonfig?
09:34 < E_mE> RossC0: you use linux?
09:34 < RossC0> and did you backup your xorg.conf
09:34 < E_mE> no... i set it up via kde
09:34 < E_mE> but kde can be a right shit at times
09:34 < RossC0> E_mE: on the server at the mo - I have a windows desktop at my current work and a mac at home
09:35 < RossC0> used to have kubuntu on my laptop and dual monitor that
09:35 < RossC0> but when I left my job I had to give the laptop back :-/
09:35 < E_mE> shame... im putting kubuntu on my desktop here at work
09:37 < E_mE> kubnutu automatically backs up xorg... how kind
09:37 < RossC0> Gutsy?
09:37 < E_mE> 7.10 RC
09:37 < Wombert> shakes head
09:37 < Wombert> http://tinyurl.com/pkefc
09:38 < RossC0> Huomenta Wombert
09:38 < Wombert> HAI DUUUDE
09:38 < Wombert> :>
09:39 < RossC0> O HAI
09:39 < Wombert> O RLY?
09:39 < Wombert> <3
09:40 < RossC0> ZOMG Triangle Nads?
09:40 < RossC0> Pre ordered ze Leopard! :D
09:41 < ttj> Ooh... Results for 3Q2007 are out in ~19 minutes. :o
09:41 < RossC0> what results?
09:42  * E_mE slaps monitors!!! grrr
09:42 < RossC0> where? How? who?
09:42 < ttj> RossC0: Nokia's.
09:42 < RossC0> E_mE: eek: http://ubuntu-utah.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=3542151
09:42 < RossC0> Wombert: you see: http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/588
09:42 < E_mE> thanx ross ill check it out
09:42 < RossC0> :D
09:44 < Wombert> RossC0: thanks... will look into that
09:44 < Wombert> I remember an issue with what you did tho
09:45 < RossC0> hmm ok
09:45 < RossC0> I just want to have a single action that outputs multiple output types and can be cached or not cached as needed.
09:46 < RossC0> Iz HAS A DR34M
09:56  * _cheerios checks if its friday
10:08 < ttj> Wow, a rather decent result.
10:08 < ttj> HEX jumped up over 200 points within a few minutes.
10:25 < E_mE> damn kubuntu aint going to console after boot :/
10:28 < _cheerios> this is wierd? i have a search form with <input name="form[hello]"/>, and if i call the url for that page with ?form=doesnotexist I get a hundred PHP Warning:  array_key_exists() [<a href='function.array-key-exists'>function.array-key-exists</a>]: The second argument should be either an array or an object in /agavi/util/AgaviArrayPathDefinition.class.php on line 106 errors?
10:31 < _cheerios> seems to be FPF related. doesn't happen with FPF off.
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10:36 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: FPF requires that the request URL stays identical
10:36 < MikeSeth> if I understand the problem correctly
10:36 < _cheerios> i call the url with wrong parameters
10:37 < _cheerios>  /search?form=thisValueDoesNotExist
10:37 < _cheerios> instead of /search?form[hello]=world
10:37 < _cheerios> in executeRead I have FPF repopulate via $this->getContext()->getRequest()->setAttribute('populate',array('search_form'=>$rd),'org.agavi.filter.FormPopulationFilter');
10:51 < Wombert> _cheerios: form[hello] is an array
10:51 < Wombert> and ?form=lala isn't
10:51 < Wombert> but yes, there should be a check for that
10:51 < Wombert> thanks for spotting this
10:51 < _cheerios> indeed, and this came up when i change a public form
10:51 < _cheerios> i had 900 requests with old variables last night = 900 agavi exceptions :D
10:52 < _cheerios> probably some search engines / bots with old data.
10:53 < _cheerios> this only gives warnings, the exceptions were due not hardening the form enough. fixed that too :)
10:56 < _cheerios> btw. Wombert, FPF keeps track of all the input/select/textareas params for the form, right?
10:57 < Wombert> yes
10:57 < _cheerios> i just wrote the xpath for doing the same, to have an array of the valid values for a form
10:57 < _cheerios> does FPF have a method for getting the same so I can throw my code away?
11:01 < Wombert> eeeeh?
11:06 < _cheerios> i take that as no :)
11:06 < Wombert> explain this again
11:07 < _cheerios> to filter $rd->getParameter('form') to only have params that actually are in the form.
11:19 < Wombert> uuuh?
11:20 < Wombert> _cheerios: that is called _validation_
11:20 < Wombert> and FPF runs long, long after your last action has run, not before
11:20 < Wombert> how can it know which variables are in the form if the action didn't even run yet...
11:22 < _cheerios> which validator only lets thru a given set of form inputs?
11:27 < _cheerios> seems like a custom informvalidator required to populate the arguments
12:01 < Wombert> ????????
12:01 < Wombert> wtf?
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12:03 < Wombert> _cheerios: I don't get what the hell you are doing
12:03 < Wombert> of course, only validated arguments are in $rd
12:03 < Wombert> !?!??!?
12:07 < v-dogg> (given that you use strict or whatever the name is nowadays :)
12:20 < _cheerios> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGCJ46vyR9o "A Vision of Students Today"
12:28 < Wombert> seriously, _cheerios... I don't get it
12:37 < Wombert> v-dogg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmOFGc7Os10
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13:21 < MikeSeth> great
13:21 < MikeSeth> http://kohanaphp.com/
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13:21 < MikeSeth> another fail.
13:22 < MikeSeth> http://kohanaphp.com/trac/browser/trunk/system/libraries/Controller.php
13:22 < MikeSeth> whats wrong with this picture
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13:26 < MikeSeth> ahahahahahahahahah ahahahahah
13:26 < MikeSeth> http://kohanaphp.com/trac/browser/trunk/system/libraries/Pagination.php
13:26 < MikeSeth> ahahahahahahahaha bahahahahaha
13:27 < RossC0> MikeSeth: tusk
13:27 < RossC0> I hope you're not being nasty to "The swift, small, and secure PHP5 framework"
13:28 < MikeSeth> how can I be nasty to such a cute thing that has a piece of SQL stuck in its helper class
13:28 < RossC0> E_mE: how you getting on?
13:28 < MikeSeth> bahahahaha
13:28 < RossC0> :D
13:29 < RossC0> Mike are you stroking a white cat whilst laughing?
13:29 < MikeSeth> no, I'm pro-tacgnol
13:32 < MikeSeth> http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/images/0/07/Tacgnolc.jpg
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13:35 < v-dogg> Pagination! We want that!
13:36 < MikeSeth> totally
13:36 < MikeSeth> ke ke keke keke
13:38 < RossC0> hmm: Based on CodeIgniter
13:38 < MikeSeth> did you know that RoR is japanese transliteration of "lol"? :)
13:43 < ttj> Nope, didn't know that.
13:45 -!- epaulin [n=epaulin@61.144.111.8] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
13:46 < Wombert_> LOLZ AZ PAGINATION
13:46 < Wombert_> WUAHHAHA
13:46 -!- Wombert_ is now known as Wombert
13:47 < MikeSeth> Wombert: but it's fast, small and secure!!
13:47 < MikeSeth> bahahahah
13:47  * Wombert falls over
13:47 < Wombert> the best thing is
13:47 < MikeSeth> in /b/.. we call these people newfags
13:47 < Wombert> it's 2007
13:48 < Wombert> they just started it
13:48 < Wombert> they didn't bother to think first
13:48 < Wombert> and they have written something that is absolutely miserable AND very 2003 at the same time
13:48 < Wombert> aaah well
13:48 < Wombert> it's good to know who's ace and who isn't, right, MikeSeth 
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132057 <MikeSeth> fio_: a data object/business object, but most often just a row record
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132100 --- robos [n=robos@74.92.120.13] has joined ##php
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132102 <MikeSeth> http://kohanaphp.com/trac/browser/trunk/system/libraries/Controller.php <= LOL
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132123 <fio_> MikeSeth: what you LOLing at ?
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132136 <MikeSeth> fio_: compare: http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/controller/AgaviController.class.php
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132156 <fio_> so, simple isn't always bad
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132218 <MikeSeth> *shrug*
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132249 <fio_> MikeSeth: thanks for your input
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132313 <MikeSeth> fio_: there are too many frameworks
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132409 <fio_> MikeSeth: there aren't enough good ones
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132427 <MikeSeth> fio_: mine is enough, and I didn't even write it.
13:49 < MikeSeth> 132430 <praveenkc> Can any one help me submit data to mlslistings.com and i have paste
13:49 < MikeSeth> :D
13:49 < Wombert> lolz
13:50 < MikeSeth> i didnt want to diss
13:50 < MikeSeth> really
13:50 < MikeSeth> but then I saw 'pagination.php'
13:52 < Wombert> yah :p
13:52 < Wombert> just make sure that those people die without a clue, MikeSeth 
13:52 < Wombert> :>
13:52 < MikeSeth> no, no, no
13:52 < Wombert> yes
13:52 < MikeSeth> I see it as a market opportunity
13:52 < Wombert> users, okay
13:53 < Wombert> other framework morons, forget them
13:53 < MikeSeth> where do you fish for desperate developers?
13:53 < Wombert> all they're gonna do, at best, is copy our code :p
13:53 < MikeSeth> in the frameworks that have pagination in their core ;)
13:57 < MrJeep_> kinda thin for a controller
13:59 < MikeSeth> well
13:59 < Wombert> their controller is not gonna rescue them anyway
13:59 < Wombert> their Pagination class has sql inside
13:59 < MikeSeth> they also think that MVC model means "static AR class"
13:59 < Wombert> I mean... come on
13:59  * Wombert chuckles
14:02 < MrJeep_> where can I see this pagination code ?
14:02 < v-dogg> up there ^
14:04 < MrJeep_> oh right, pagination.php
14:07 < MrJeep_> well, I've got a small contract, adding some feature to an existing moodle application
14:08 < MrJeep_> and I can say their object oriented stuff is wrose that this framework
14:09 < MrJeep_> an auth class with the basic auth method (like logind) and method to display config form, validate values and so on
14:09 < MrJeep_> _that's_ object oriented programming
14:09 < MikeSeth> because it has a single object? ;)
14:10 < MrJeep_> yeah, just a single object for authentication (which contains the administrative and configuration methods too)
14:10 < MikeSeth> well
14:10 < MrJeep_> anyway, I'm paid to edit it not to recreate it
14:10 < MikeSeth> the application code is orienting the object
14:10 < MikeSeth> this, OOP
14:10 < MikeSeth> ;)
14:11 < MrJeep_> hehehe
14:17 < marklar> hai
14:24  * marklar admires Trac
14:25 < MikeSeth> oh hi i fixd ur rootkit
14:25 < marklar> zomgs
14:27 < MikeSeth> for those of you who dont know, marklar is an old friend.. an early adopter of mvc
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14:31 < marklar> heh yea
14:31 < marklar> back when mojavi had a red website
14:32 < v-dogg> you mean this: http://mojavi.org/ ;)
14:33 < marklar> yeah, but without all the snazzy gfx
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14:43 < Wombert_> ->
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14:59 < E_mE> RossC0: well, ive got it display on both monitors... but the mouse is fooked up on the second monitor.. also install VMWare to have windows on it too :)
15:02 < MrJeep_> mojavi's getting back to life ?
15:04 < MikeSeth> lol no
15:18 < MrJeep_> oh by the way
15:18 < MrJeep_> I've got a new job
15:19 < MrJeep_> My first one was not exacly... paying me enough
15:19 < MrJeep_> and now I have to write my resignation
15:20 < MikeSeth> kudos
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15:27 < marklar> <3 maddox
15:36 < MikeSeth> <3
15:37 < marklar> now I want a new Nokia
15:37 < marklar> :(
15:37 < RossC0> url?
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15:41 < marklar> ugh nokia.com
15:41 < marklar> death2flash
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15:52 < marklar> anyway, n95
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17:28 < marklar> mike
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18:22 < splatch`> hello :|
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19:33 < Wombert> hai
19:33 < Wombert> :>
19:39 < splatch`> hello
19:39 < splatch`> Wombert: do you got darek's mail?
19:39 < Wombert> nope :)
19:40 < splatch`> arrrgh
19:40  * splatch` looking for knife ;)
19:40 < Wombert> splatch`: maybe tell him that it's not a problem, I'm not annoyed, he doesn't need to apologize, and I understand that he's busy
19:41 < splatch`> Wombert: today he forgot about mail, tomorrow he wi'll forgot about own head ;)
19:42 < splatch`> ehh... i've job offer
19:43 < splatch`> in france ;)
19:43 < Wombert> oO
19:43 < Wombert> do you speak french?
19:43 < splatch`> no
19:43 < Wombert> well that's a problem then
19:43 < splatch`> yes, my english too
19:43 < Wombert> haha
19:43 < Wombert> dude
19:43 < splatch`> but, i've some time for learn
19:44 < Wombert> don't worry about YOUR english
19:44 < Wombert> I'm more concerned about THEM
19:46 < splatch`> that will be work in bank
19:46 < splatch`> in Paris
19:46 < MikeSeth> splatch`: wow, that's an adventure
19:48 < Wombert> adventure, yes
19:48  * Wombert slaps MikeSeth 
19:48 < Wombert> QUERRRRY!
19:55 < splatch`> Wombert: i don't know is it adventure, propably i'll stay in Poland
20:01 < Wombert> MikeSeth: http://www.dzone.com/links/10_reasons_to_choose_cakephp_as_framework.html
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20:10 < MrJeep> I have a weird problem with an old php4 project
20:11 < MrJeep> it seems that, when you override a method, if the method gets called by a method in the old method, the old method is called
20:11 < MrJeep> like
20:11 < MrJeep> class BaseClass function print($s) { echo $s
20:11 < MrJeep> function callprint() { $this->print('...') ...
20:12 < MrJeep> class ExtendedClass extends BaseClass
20:12 < MrJeep> wrong example
20:13 < MrJeep> anyway I think I have a major problem right here
20:13 < MrJeep> I have a ldap_auth class
20:13 < MrJeep> and the user_login method call ldap_connect method
20:13 < MrJeep> I've extended the ldap_auth class and I've overriden user_login method (which call the parent user_login)
20:14 < MrJeep> the problem is the old ldap_connect is called, instead of my overridden ldap_connect method
20:15 < Wombert> and parent user_login does $this->ldap_connect() ?
20:16 < MrJeep> yeah
20:17 < MrJeep> hum, I just made a test and it seems to be ok
20:17 < Wombert> typo in a method name?
20:17 < Wombert> invisible characters? :p
20:17 < MrJeep> I guess I'll have to look at this closer :P
20:19 < MrJeep> sounds like a human mistake :)
20:20 < MrJeep> by the way wombert
20:20 < MrJeep> I have a new job
20:20 < Wombert> again?
20:20 < MrJeep> company called Revolution Linux
20:20 < MrJeep> yeah
20:20 < Wombert> why
20:20 < MrJeep> I've hit the jackpot with my last job... financials problems and I haven't been paid yet
20:20 < MrJeep> it's been 2 moth
20:20 < Wombert> ewww
20:20 < Wombert> sorry to hear that
20:21 < MrJeep> yeah, it sux
20:22 < MrJeep> I had a lot of hope in this first job
20:22 < MrJeep> conditions were excellent
20:22 < MrJeep> the people were great
20:23 < MrJeep> I somehow feel bad about leaving, but well, I need something a lot more stable
20:24 < Wombert> did they have financial trouble you mean?
20:24 < Wombert> how can the conditions be excellent then :p
20:29 < MrJeep> what was "promised" was excellent
20:29 < MrJeep> except they did not have any money to back it
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20:52 < E_mE> huomenta... 
20:52 < E_mE> Wombert: whats that news comedy you like?
20:52 < Wombert> The Daily Show with Jon Stewart
20:52 < Wombert> or
20:52 < Wombert> The Colbert Report
20:52 < Wombert> both, actually
20:53 < E_mE> ah thank you :
20:53 < Wombert> even though I didn't have time to watch either recently
20:53 < E_mE> :D 
20:53 < E_mE> is there any on youtube?
20:53 < Wombert> no
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21:19 < CIA-11> david * r2140 /branches/0.11/src/util/AgaviArrayPathDefinition.class.php: Properly fixes #535
21:37 < Wombert> right-o
21:37 < Wombert> marked the two new 0.11 tickets wontfix
21:37 < Wombert> successful day then
21:37 < Wombert> time to leave ze office!
22:01 < Wombert> http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/300.html
22:01 < Wombert> some nice stuff there
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06:47 < v-dogg> huomenta
06:55 < Whisller> hi
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06:58 < _cheerios> huomenta
06:59 < ttj> Yo.
07:03 < E_mE> huomenta!!
07:04  * E_mE is off to work!
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07:28 < Whisller> today weather is great, rain rain and rain ;)
07:29 < _cheerios> half-cloudy, no rain
07:35 < _cheerios> for MikeSeth: http://valleywag.com/photogallery/redditpartyoctober2007/2863664
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08:11 < E_mE> huomenta!
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09:56 < _cheerios> chuckle @ http://distilled.wordpress.com/2006/02/23/ycombinator/
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10:22  * E_mE is now running Kubuntu 7.10 gutsy :)
10:22  * E_mE is going to install KDE 4 in the minute
10:24  * E_mE falls out of his seat! a PHP Programmer job is open in FALMOUTH!! town right next to me!!
10:25 < v-dogg> believe me, they code php3
10:26 < E_mE> no PHP 4-5 
10:26 < E_mE> woo hooo! 
10:28 < v-dogg> they use code igniter and mysql_* functions
10:29 < v-dogg> just take my word for it, it's too good to be true. there's something wrong with them :)
10:29 < E_mE> hehehe 
10:30 < E_mE> but if i can show them agavi ;)
10:30 < E_mE> they will fill there pants
10:30 < E_mE> hehe
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11:20 < _cheerios> how to make an action post only, so when the same action is called via GET it'd send the call to 404 or something?
11:21 < craazy> hi, ive got a problem with the installing over pear
11:21 < craazy> it says:
11:21 < craazy> invalid package name/package file "agavi/agavi-0.11.0"
11:21 < craazy> Cannot initialize 'agavi/agavi-0.11.0', invalid or missing package file
11:21 < craazy> Package "agavi/agavi-0.11.0" is not valid
11:21 < craazy> install failed
11:21 < craazy> did someone know the error?
11:25 < v-dogg> hmm... 0.11.0? I don't think there is such a package
11:26 < RossC0> _cheerios: validateRead ?
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11:27 < v-dogg> _cheerios: or a routing callback (if you really want 404)
11:27 < v-dogg> a bit hackish perhaps
11:27 < _cheerios> currently i get an exception if calling the same uri the "wrong" way
11:28 < _cheerios> RossC0, a validator that disallows reads?
11:28 < v-dogg> validateRead and ReadErrorView might be a good idea
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11:28 < v-dogg> no need for a validator, just return false from validateRead()
11:29 < v-dogg> and use handleReadError() to select ReadErrorView or whatevet
11:29 < v-dogg> *ever
11:29 < _cheerios> hmmk, tried a source search for those methods but found nothing
11:30 < v-dogg> they are just Read specific validate() and handleError() (standard Action methods)
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11:32 < craazy> hmm i got it ;)
11:32 < _cheerios> how do they work? sorry, a bit confused about magic methods that arent in source nor cant find in docs
11:33 < v-dogg> _cheerios: you know validate() and handleError() in Action?
11:34 < _cheerios> not validate, but handleError, yes.
11:35 < v-dogg> validate is just a method for manual validation. it's run after validators
11:35 < v-dogg> it returns true or false
11:36 < v-dogg> and for both of these two methods there are "read" and "write" specific siblings 
11:36 < v-dogg> validateRead, validateWrite, handleReadError, and so on
11:37 < v-dogg> executed only for "read" or "write"
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11:39 < _cheerios> for validateRead() to be run, i have to have xml for the validation setup?
11:40 < v-dogg> no
11:40 < _cheerios> i just tried it and it doesnt run on an action that only has executeWrite()? am i doing something wrong?
11:41 < v-dogg> ah, true
11:41 < v-dogg> validation is not run if the action doesn't serve for the method
11:41 < v-dogg> so you might as well just use executionRead(...) { return 'Error'; }
11:43 < _cheerios> yea, that's what i had in desperation resorted to :|
11:43 < v-dogg> well, there is still the routing cb option
11:44 < _cheerios> would a default in the baseaction for executeRead() be fubard?
11:46 < v-dogg> it would mean that getDefaultViewName would stop working and validation would always be executed 
11:46 < _cheerios> i have my action template set with an executeRead() instead f getDefaultViewname(). not sure if that's a bad/works practice.
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11:50 < v-dogg> I don't think it has any other downsides other than the fact that validation is always run
11:50 < v-dogg> don't know how much overhead that brings
11:51 < _cheerios> shouldnt be much if no validation .xml file exists :hopes:
12:31 < MikeSeth> I see.. a business opportunity
12:31 < MikeSeth> I've just taken a closer look at oscommerce and ZenCart
12:32 < MikeSeth> both suck so tremendously that I wonder if anything can be done about it
12:45 < v-dogg> this is something I've sometimes wanted to do
12:47 < MikeSeth> there's money in this even if you go completely open
12:47 < MikeSeth> seriously people who write these things are retarded
12:47 < MikeSeth> they have no technological perspective whatsoever
12:47 < MikeSeth> complete fail
12:57 < _cheerios> sounds boring
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13:07 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: sounds MONEY
13:10 < MikeSeth> why does this look vaguely familiar: http://svn.magentocommerce.com/source/branches/beta-0.6/app/code/core/Mage/Payment/Model/Checkmo.php
13:15 < _cheerios> "But in secular parts of the world, such as Scandinavia, people don't seem to have a problem with evolution."
13:15 < _cheerios> hahah
13:16 < MikeSeth> woa
13:16 -!- shoan_ [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
13:16 < MikeSeth> these people tried to implement Agavi without Agavi
13:16 < MikeSeth> http://svn.magentocommerce.com/source/branches/beta-0.6/
13:18 < MikeSeth> I wonder
13:18 < MikeSeth> is there an architectural benefit to the Registry pattern?
13:18 < _cheerios> and i was going crazy with deep agavi paths: http://svn.magentocommerce.com/source/branches/beta-0.6/app/design/frontend/default/default/template/checkout/multishipping/addresses.phtml
13:18 < MikeSeth> heh
13:20 < _cheerios> "In addition, Scandinavia has a healthy population of LaVeyan Satanists."
13:21 < MikeSeth> ahhahaahahhaha
13:21 < MikeSeth>     public static function getBaseUrl($params=array())
13:21 < MikeSeth>     {
13:21 < MikeSeth>         return Mage::getSingleton('core/store')->getUrl($params);
13:21 < MikeSeth>     }
13:22 < _cheerios> whatever works!
13:22 < _cheerios> :D
13:22 < MikeSeth>  public static function init($etcDir=null)
13:22 < MikeSeth>     {
13:22 < MikeSeth>         set_error_handler('my_error_handler');
13:22 < MikeSeth>         date_default_timezone_set('America/Los_Angeles');
13:22 < MikeSeth> ...
13:22 < MikeSeth> this is official
13:22 < MikeSeth> ZFW coders are crazy
13:22 < MikeSeth> cuz this has the reek of zfw
13:23 < _cheerios> ~ we ain't doin' it fo ze code, we doin' it fo da money ~
13:23 < MikeSeth> they have observable events and an event dispatcher
13:24 < MikeSeth> http://svn.magentocommerce.com/source/branches/beta-0.6/app/code/core/Mage/Customer/messages.txt
13:24 < MikeSeth> YOU THINK?!
13:25 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has joined #agavi
13:25 < MikeSeth> this is too crazy :/
13:26 -!- epaulin_ [n=epaulin@219.136.127.139] has joined #agavi
13:26 < MikeSeth> class Mage_Customer_Model_Customer extends Varien_Object implements Mage_Core_Model_Shared_Interface
13:27 < MikeSeth> wow no shit
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13:27  * v-dogg fires up Delphi
13:29  * v-dogg is going to spend a rejoiceful weekend coding a legacy project update
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13:33 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dslb-084-056-026-141.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
13:42 < MikeSeth> Wombert: http://svn.magentocommerce.com/source/branches/beta-0.6/
13:42 < Wombert> MikeSeth: what's dat
13:43 < MikeSeth> a cart application trying to b eagavi and failing
13:46 < RossC0> hows it trying to be Agavi?
13:47 < MikeSeth> RossC0: well it's trying to be conservative and enlightened about code and architecture, but there's a sense of hype associated with web2.0 that has influenced the code
13:47 < MikeSeth> RossC0: some places in the code are painfully reminiscent of agavi, getLayout() calls etc, but it goes one step further and uses overhyped patterns where absolutely unnecessary
13:49 < RossC0> hmm - to be devils advocate: does it work? does it look good?  will it manage selling my products?
13:49 < MikeSeth> it's somewhere in between beta 1 and 2 with some production features apparently missing
13:50 < MikeSeth> it's not bad or anything, just that it looks like it's a complete waste of time reinventing Agavi for a single project which is essentially what they did minus the cool features
13:50 < RossC0> ah but did the know about Agavi?
13:50 < MikeSeth> I dont know
13:51 < RossC0> that would be interesting to find out
13:51 < MikeSeth> but it's as if they struggled desperately to invent it
13:51 < RossC0> lol - well I see they use the zend framework
13:52 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/588
13:52 < Wombert> look at that MikeSeth and RossC0 
13:52 < Wombert> plz
13:52 < Wombert> :>
13:53 < Wombert> I was briefly thinking about writing the action cache later when the output type is known, but that doesn't help either!
13:53 < MikeSeth> RossC0: overuse
13:53 < Wombert> the problem is on the next read, I might have an output type "rss", but maybe I _do_ need to run the action to...
13:53 < Wombert> hang on
13:53  * Wombert ponders
13:54 < _cheerios> php framework benchmarks, check page 24; http://www.scribd.com/doc/406917/benchmarking2007
13:54 < Wombert> RossC0: could I run the view that I cached, check if it changed the OT, and if yes, run everything again?
13:55 < RossC0> Wombert: yes I suppose - how costly is that?
13:55 < Wombert> _cheerios: not a fair shootout if you ask me because zend does not have an out of the box structure to run an app
13:56 < Wombert> _cheerios: I also fixed your array notice thing in the FPF, can you verify please
13:56 < _cheerios> what is fair? the guy has tried to make it quite neutral
13:56 < Wombert> RossC0: I need to check 
13:56 < Wombert> RossC0: the problem is how to configure that
13:56 < Wombert> _cheerios: what is his benchmark? a "hello world"?
13:57 < _cheerios> something like that, which only touches the frameworks performance per action
13:57 < RossC0> Wombert: would it be easier to have a config that forces the action to run ? OR cache the action per the output_type on first instance 
13:58 < Wombert> RossC0: caching per OT does not help really
13:58 < RossC0> hmm the second one wont work
13:58 < Wombert> yes
13:58 < Wombert> I need to initialize() the view to know the OT
13:58 < RossC0> so yes will need to run the action to cache per output_type
13:58 < Wombert> _cheerios: but that is no fair comparison then
13:58 < _cheerios> Wombert, code is at http://code.google.com/p/web-framework-benchmarks/ if i understood correctly
13:58 < Wombert> simply because your average request spends most of the time in _your_ code
13:58 < RossC0> echo 'hello worlf'; 
13:59 < RossC0> my framework wins :D
13:59 < Wombert> for example, on a typical agavi request, you get 25% overhead from bootstrap() and context initialization
13:59 < _cheerios> Wombert, huh? Atleast in my agavi apps most of the time is taken by Agavi, the framework?
13:59 < Wombert> I consider that to be the _real_ overhead
13:59 < Wombert> without counting dispatch() and all that happens in there
13:59 < Wombert> (filter chains, action, view init, validation etc etc etc)
14:00 < Wombert> since your "own" framework needs to do such stuff as well
14:00 < Wombert> I mean, if you were not using, say, Agavi, you'd still need to write a bit of structure to have your app manageable
14:00 < _cheerios> without defending benchmarks/the guy, that's all noted in the pdf. it's a performance benchmark on action, not about any added value features and their timesavings etc.
14:01 < Wombert> RossC0: I need to pour a glass of wine, sit back in the armchair I don't have and ponder this for a bit
14:01 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I dont see anything wrong with it on surface
14:01 < _cheerios> Wombert, thanks for the fix. I'll check it later. Friday :D
14:01 < Wombert> _cheerios: if it's just a "hello world" app, then a framework causes 99% overhead
14:01 < RossC0> Wombert: cool - I've extended my AgaviFilter and added
14:02 < RossC0> as we go live on Monday : oO
14:02 < _cheerios> Wombert, exactly what it is testing :)
14:02 < Wombert> _cheerios: but _any_ framework is gonna cause this much!
14:02 < RossC0> _cheerios: computers dont care how you package and write your code.  Doesn't mean you shouldn't
14:03 < _cheerios> RossC0, cool, waiting for monday celebrations then
14:03 < _cheerios> Wombert, beyond the point.
14:03 < Wombert> what I'm saying is that you cannot reliably measure the overhead caused until your app code does a reasonable amount of computing
14:03 < _cheerios> RossC0, true, nobody said different.
14:03 < RossC0> _cheerios: they why obsess?
14:06 < _cheerios> Wombert, it's not perfect. It doesn't need to be. It's an indicator of performance. If that's what people use, that's how Agavi will be measured too, charted on such an x,y plot. I'm not saying it's good/bad. Heck, I'm not saying anything, just showing some benchmarks. :)
14:08 < Wombert> _cheerios: can I do a checkout on that and just run a script that runs the tests and does a report?
14:08  * Wombert nudges RossC0 
14:08 < Wombert> query!
14:09 < _cheerios> *shrug* I was looking at the pretty graphs, not ugly code. :)
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14:09 < MrJeep> hey wombert, do you plan to install leopard when he gets out ?
14:09 < Wombert> MrJeep: I won't buy it right away i think
14:10 < Wombert> never good to jump the new OS ship right after it leaves port
14:10 < Wombert> but I want to migrate very soon, yes
14:10 < MrJeep> your laptop won't have problem running it ?
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14:11 < Wombert> MrJeep: nah, don't think so
14:11 < Wombert> MrJeep: also, I want the new features!
14:12 < MikeSeth> Wombert: if I want a mac lappy for development, what should I go with?
14:12 < Wombert> btw, http://www.propelfitnesswater.com/ so ace :) wanted to buy some bottles for hans, saw them in italy, but didn't get any on the way home :(
14:12 < Wombert> MikeSeth: budget? :p
14:12 < Wombert> MikeSeth: how tall are you
14:13 < MikeSeth> Wombert: 1.71 or so
14:13 < Wombert> MikeSeth: okay you're safe then
14:13 < MikeSeth> Wombert: doesnt matter, general curiousity
14:13 < MikeSeth> why/
14:13 < Wombert> well
14:13 < MikeSeth> macs dont work with midgets?
14:13 < Wombert> I have a last generation PowerBook G4
14:13 < Wombert> you know the display hinge design on apple laptops?
14:13 < MikeSeth> no, I've barely even seen one
14:13 < Wombert> they're pretty ace, looks fantastic and is so indestructible
14:14 < Wombert> okay, sec
14:14 < Wombert> MikeSeth: http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/gallery/
14:14 < Wombert> see how it works?
14:14 < MikeSeth> niiice
14:15 < Wombert> now, my PowerBook's display tilts back to around 135 degrees
14:15 < Wombert> I'm 1.93 (6'3" that is I think)
14:15 < Wombert> if the computer is on my laps, that's exactly enough so I have a straight 90 degree viewing angle on the screen
14:16 < Wombert> the intel MacBook pros (same case basically) however opened only to around 120 degrees
14:16 < Wombert> and the new LED backlit ones open around 110 degrees!
14:16 < Wombert> can you imagine that
14:16 < Wombert> I couldn't use it on mylaps
14:16 < Wombert> so appaling
14:16 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["bbl"]
14:16 < Wombert> I wonder what the fucking assholes (sorry) were thinking when they did that
14:16 < Wombert> this is lazy engineering, really
14:16 < RossC0> Wombert: shoot
14:17 < Wombert> is there just dwarfs working at apple or what
14:17 < Wombert> that said, I really need a new laptop :( but I'll buy one next year when new ones are out
14:17 < Wombert> RossC0: query!
14:18 < Wombert> :>
14:18 < RossC0> ?
14:18 < RossC0> :D
14:18 < Wombert> I wrote you :(
14:18 < Wombert> privmsg
14:18 < Wombert> noob!
14:18 < Wombert> zomg :>
14:18 < RossC0> hmm no msg
14:18 < Wombert> MikeSeth: in any case... MBPs have higher res displays, firewire 800, dedicated graphics and some other niceties
14:19 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
14:19 < RossC0> brb Gaim is foobarred
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14:20 < Wombert> still not getting anything, RossC0 ?
14:20 < RossC0> nope
14:20 < Wombert> WTF
14:20 < Wombert> I'm unauthed
14:21 -!- Wombert is now known as WombertZOMG
14:21 -!- WombertZOMG is now known as Wombert
14:21 < RossC0> lol
14:21 < Wombert> WHAT THE HELL
14:21 < Wombert> ZOMG
14:21 < RossC0> n00b
14:21 < RossC0> :d
14:21 < Wombert> did you get any of what I wrote? :p
14:21 < Wombert> like "re"
14:21 < Wombert> "well"
14:21 < RossC0> nope
14:21 < Wombert> "*hugs RossC0"
14:21 < Wombert> booh
14:21 < Wombert> okay
14:21 < Wombert> 2 tics
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14:22 < Wombert> my goodness
14:23  * Wombert kicks Colloquy
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14:24 < Wombert> fucking hell I've been querying MikeSeth for DAYS and not got a reply haha
14:24 < Wombert> damn
14:24 < RossC0> http://www.apple.com/getamac/works.html
14:24  * RossC0 titters
14:26 < Wombert> YOU SAID TITS
14:26 < Wombert> HAHA
14:27 < Wombert> anyways, it was colloquy :p
14:27 < Wombert> not telling me the password was wrong
14:27 < Wombert> stupid
14:27 < RossC0> ;)
14:29 < RossC0> http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&as_qdr=all&q=getamac+site%3Aagavi.org&btnG=Search&meta=
14:29  * RossC0 titters even more!
14:30 < RossC0> got ya back!
14:30 < RossC0> right thats 5-1
14:30 < RossC0> :D
14:32  * craazy ist jetzt AWAY [grund: auto-AWAY nach 180 min idle-zeit]
14:32 -!- craazy is now known as craazy|wech
14:34 < Wombert> craazy|wech: can you switch that off please
14:34 < Wombert> thank you
14:35  * craazy|wech ist AWAY [grund: auto-away nach 180 min idle-zeit] [dauer: 2mins 1sec]
14:35 < craazy|wech> iam sorry
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14:35 < Wombert> RossC0: http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&as_qdr=all&q=pkefc+site%3Aagavi.org&btnG=Search&meta=
14:36 < RossC0> ZOMG stealth links as well
14:36 < RossC0> 13-1
14:36 < RossC0> :D
14:36 < RossC0> 12-1
14:36 < RossC0> eek
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15:44 < E_mE> wwwwwooo weekend :D
15:44 < E_mE> bye bye 
15:44 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
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16:07 < Xylakant> hi all
16:08 < Xylakant> anyone here with some time and intimate knowledge about the validation system?
16:09 < Whisller> weekend for who ;p
16:10 < RossC0> Xylakant: how intimate do you need?
16:10 < Xylakant> hmm. more intimate than me ;)
16:11 < Xylakant> i have this problem: i have one parameter that I know to be an int-indexed array of strings
16:11 < Xylakant> there seems to be no validator for that
16:12 < RossC0> Xylakant: either custom validator Or validate()
16:12 < Xylakant> so I wrote one, which is pretty simple in itself. however, even when the parameter has been validated, the array entries get removed
16:14 < RossC0> waa?
16:15 < Xylakant> yes, the problem is that the validator manager removes any parameter it thinks not to be validated. and it flattens the array to arrayparam[0], arrayparam[1] etc
16:16 < Xylakant> while the validator is registered on the parametername of 'arrayparam'
16:16 < Xylakant> so the param itself gets passed on as validated, but not it'
16:16 < Xylakant> it's entries
16:16 < Xylakant> and here, I'm lost
16:17 < Xylakant> how do I trick the validatormanager into accepting that each one of the entries was validated and should be passed on?
16:17 -!- nfq [n=nfq@84-73-209-218.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #agavi
16:18 < nfq> hey Wombert, let me know when you are around!
16:18 < nfq> please!
16:28 < Xylakant> hmm. no answers. seems I have to get more intimate with the validation system :P
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16:44 < Xylakant> kk: just for the record: the validator needs to set its 'affectedArguments' property to a list of keys it did validate
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17:15 < MrJeep> Wombert : did you know about this : http://scplugin.tigris.org/screenshots.html ?
17:16 < Wombert> yes
17:17 < MrJeep> is it good ?
17:18 < Wombert> it used to be bloody useless
17:18 < Wombert> but it seems that it now has a dev team again
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20:30 < _cheerios> Wombert, problem: http://p.caboo.se/private/nodepogdcu6hrph4ficfg. Any ideas why this happens?
20:30 < Wombert> _cheerios: show your layout conf please
20:32 < _cheerios> sec, loading project into eclipse. could take... a while.
20:36 < _cheerios> Wombert, http://p.caboo.se/private/rgxu2masspoz8n1y2in5dq
20:37 < Wombert> is that json?
20:38 < _cheerios> its on a log that was emailed to me. logs dont tell me that information :)
20:38 < Wombert> then look at the lines in the views...
20:39 < _cheerios> ah, indeed, it tries to use json. No idea why.
20:40 < Wombert> to me it looks like you're calling setupHtml() or loadLayout() in your json stuff...
20:40 < Wombert> can you show me the three lines?
20:40 < Wombert> it's calling something in your custombaseview first...
20:41 < _cheerios> it is indeed. i was testing json earlier. what should be in a default executeJson?
20:41 < Wombert> that probably means you've made the huuuuuge mistake to have an execute* method in your base view that actually does something
20:41  * Wombert slaps _cheerios 
20:41 < Wombert> waaaaaah
20:41 < Wombert> _cheerios: NOTHING!"
20:41 < Wombert> that's the point of it!
20:41 < Wombert> if there is no executeJson in your view, then that means the action cannot "do" json
20:42 < Wombert> maybe put an executeJson in your base view that returns a 500
20:42 < _cheerios> ah yeah, instead of running it to execute()
20:43 < Wombert> do you have an execute() ?
20:43 < Wombert> it will pick execute() ultimately if it cannot find a concrete method
20:44 < Wombert> or, well, what does your execute() in the base view do
20:44 < _cheerios> no, i dont have executes
20:44 < _cheerios> when i made that part, i just mimiced how the executeHtml() etc were laid out
20:44 < _cheerios> beyond the basic execute() throw error
20:44 < Wombert> good
20:45 < Wombert> awwww man we need better build scripts for agavi
20:45 < Wombert> tweaking a project until it fits your taste takes sooo long
20:45 -!- JanK_ [n=JanK_@muedsl-82-207-240-120.citykom.de] has joined #agavi
20:45 < MrJeep> it's possible to define slots in xml config file right ?
20:45 < _cheerios> thanks for the help, sorted now. i was so sleepy they day i was trying out that json stuff
20:46 < Wombert> sure, MrJeep 
20:46 < Wombert> _cheerios: yah. if you're not sleepy now, maybe care to explain that FPF thing again?
20:46 < MrJeep> there is some doc on how to proceed online ?
20:46 < _cheerios> i need more drinks to get back to that topic :)
20:47 < Wombert> MrJeep: <slot name="foo" module="Bar" action="Baz" />
20:47 < Wombert> :)
20:47 < MrJeep> under <layout ?
20:47 < Wombert> no, in a layer
20:47 < Wombert> you've never used slots? oO
20:48 < MrJeep> of course I've used slot, but I've never defined one in output_type.xml
20:48 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["night folks"]
20:48 < MrJeep> <layer name="decorator">...<slot name..> 
20:48 < MrJeep> this is what I'm wondering
20:49 < Wombert> yes
20:49 < Wombert> that's how it works
20:50 < MrJeep> yeehaa
21:01 < _cheerios> uh fucks sake
21:06 < _cheerios> found out the cause of the problem. 3rd party lib i use seems to use requests that use json/ajax headers, foobars things up nicely.
21:28 < _cheerios> wow, Naruto Shippuuden 031 was awesome *cries*
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22:02 < Wombert> woot woot
22:02 < Wombert> my couchdb wiki works :>
22:02 < Wombert> aah this is ace
22:02 < Wombert> .
22:03 < ttj> What's that?
22:04 < Wombert> http://couchdb.org/
22:10 < Wombert> ahahah :>
22:10 < Wombert> this is fun!
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22:26 < _cheerios> :)
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--- Day changed Sat Oct 20 2007
00:11 < Wombert> http://www.dzone.com/links/object_oriented_programming_isnt_easy.html haha
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01:49  * Wombert pokes impl 
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02:42 < blackthorne> hi
02:42 < blackthorne> is there any screencast on agavi?
02:47 < Wombert> blackthorne: nope
02:49 < Wombert> but plenty of friendly people around here to help, mailing lists, docs, the sample app etc
02:49 < Wombert> :)
02:49 < Wombert> I'll be happy to show you around a bit tomorrow, but I really need to head to bed now
02:49 < blackthorne> ok... :)
02:49 < Wombert> make yourself home in the meantime, there's beer in the fridge
02:49 < Wombert> ;)
02:49 < Wombert> cool
02:49 < blackthorne> i will be here
02:49 < Wombert> I'll see you tomorrow then, right?
02:49 < blackthorne> tomorrow 
02:49 < Wombert> are you canadian?
02:50 < blackthorne> no...
02:50 < Wombert> french, and still up
02:50 < Wombert> tsss
02:50 < blackthorne> not french
02:50 < Wombert> oh
02:50 < Wombert> :>
02:50 < blackthorne> why should be some of those two?
02:50 < Wombert> ah
02:50 < Wombert> well I didn't read your name properly
02:50 < Wombert> where are you from then
02:50 < blackthorne> Portugal, u?
02:51 < Wombert> Germany
02:51 < Wombert> first snow here
02:51 < Wombert> I imagine it's much better at your place
02:51 < blackthorne> too hot
02:51 < blackthorne> now it's ok... 19º
02:51 < Wombert> haha
02:51 < Wombert> everyone's complaining no matter what, eh
02:51 < Wombert> ;)
02:51 < blackthorne> lol
02:51 < Wombert> okay but... really gotta run now
02:51 < blackthorne> good n8
02:52 < Wombert> come here tomorrow, I'll give you an introduction
02:52 < blackthorne> c u tomorrow, thanks in advance
02:52 < Wombert> you won't regret it; the others here can confirm that agavi is a much better choice than cake, code igniter, symfony etc
02:52 < Wombert> so stay tuned
02:52 < Wombert> see you then
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09:53 < Whisller> hi
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10:26 < v-dogg> huomenta
10:53 < E_mE> huomenta!
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11:58 < MikeSeth> where's Wombert
11:58 < MikeSeth> give him to me now
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12:23 < Whisller> hmm
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14:44 < E_mE> wooo Kubuntu 7.10 looks different :) 
14:57 < v-dogg> how so?
15:01 < Wombert> different, but still ugly
15:01 < Wombert> I'm now genuinely excited about leopard I must say
15:13 < CIA-11> david * r2141 /branches/0.11/src/config/AgaviBaseConfigHandler.class.php: use gmdate() again in config handlers to prevent timezone warnings for the five billion users that don't understand them...
15:25 < CIA-11> david * r2142 /branches/0.11/src/view/AgaviView.class.php: Pass on "is_slot" flag in View::createForwardContainer(), closes #591
15:26 < CIA-11> david * r2143 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: changelog ftw
15:29 < CIA-11> david * r2144 /trunk/ (114 files in 37 dirs): merging in changes from branches/0.11
15:48 < Whisller> I'm waiting for leopard. In my company they want buy it.
15:58 < MrJeep> Wombert : mee too, I'd really like to buy a mac 
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16:13 < E_mE> Wombert: you have crushed me! ;)
16:13 < E_mE> v-dogg: it looks different.. fonts have changed
16:13 < E_mE> applications look different
16:14 < E_mE> Wombert: KDE is free though =P
16:16 < E_mE> Wombert is it the perantal control that excites you in new OS X ?? ;)
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16:41 < MrJeep> this parental control is nice
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16:41 < MrJeep> If I would have osx, I would make sure I never ever go to porn site
16:41 < MrJeep> or play violent game
16:41 < MrJeep> if there is violent game on mac...
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17:49 < Wombert> haha
17:49 < Wombert> splatch`: http://youtube.com/watch?v=a56Se27v0aE
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18:35 < CIA-11> david * r2145 /branches/0.11/src/config/AgaviXmlConfigParser.class.php: Fixed inverted "core.skip_config_validation" logic, so config validation is now performed again :p Sorry. Refs #552 and closes #592
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19:39 < Wombert> welcome back, blackthorne 
19:39 < blackthorne> hi
19:39 < blackthorne> Just came from the beach
19:39 < blackthorne> over 27º
19:39 < blackthorne> water temperature 22º
19:40 < blackthorne> beach was a little full of british and germans
19:43 < blackthorne> anyway, how was your day?
19:43 < blackthorne> Wombert: 
19:44 < Wombert> that sounds nice
19:44 < Wombert> 3° here :<
19:46 < blackthorne> that's why you have so good cars
19:47 < blackthorne> if you had this sun you wouldn't spend your days working to make such good products
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20:00 < Wombert> blackthorne: ahhah :>
20:01 < Wombert> good point
20:01 < Wombert> maybe that's true heh
20:03 < blackthorne> don't have a dough about it. Our economy is not weaker than northern countries like Sweden, Finland, Germany just because we have green in your flag
20:06 < blackthorne> btw
20:06 < blackthorne> i installed agavi
20:07 < Wombert> cool
20:15 < Wombert> documentation is really sparse right now
20:15 < Wombert> I'm working on two proper sample applications at the moment that will be bundled with 1.0
20:15 < Wombert> for 0.11... well you have to rely on the docs that are there currently, and the sample app, and this channel ;)
20:16 < Wombert> did you read the intro in the manual?
20:16 < blackthorne> not completely
20:16 < Wombert> http://www.agavi.org/docs/latest/manuals/manual/ch01.html
20:20 < blackthorne> this is what i'm trying to do
20:20 < blackthorne> http://blackthorne.planetaclix.pt
20:20 < blackthorne> most info there comes in the FAQ
20:22 < blackthorne> since i don't like to reinvent the wheel
20:23 < blackthorne> i'm looking for a good framework that may give a good support on what i intend to do
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20:29 < blackthorne> i have to update that
20:30 < blackthorne> done, you can look know :P
20:33 < Wombert> agavi abstracts things pretty well
20:33 < Wombert> that means you write your code once, and if you then need rss output for some stuff, you can simply drop it in
20:33 < Wombert> or ajax
20:33 < Wombert> or... if you need a soap interface to your web app
20:33 < Wombert> stuff like that
20:33 < Wombert> other frameworks have nonsense such as ajax controllers or whatever, which is totally wrong
20:34 < Wombert> that does not mean however that agavi makes things more difficult
20:34 < Wombert> granted, we don't have helpers to output image tags... or "plugins" for... mootools
20:34 < Wombert> but you don't need that
20:34 < Wombert> or actually, you don't want that:p
20:35 < Wombert> other frameworks dictate which database ORM to use, or which template engine
20:35 < Wombert> not us. it's up to you, and we make no assumptions about what you use
20:35 < Wombert> and solve things different
20:35 < Wombert> for instance, building a form in agavi is a matter of
20:35 < Wombert> <form action="..." method="post">
20:35 < Wombert>   <input type="text" name="foo" />
20:36 < Wombert> if you want to show that form again, with the value the user entered, and the field should be red, and the error message should be next to the element
20:36 < Wombert> then agavi does that for you
20:36 < Wombert> automatically
20:36 < Wombert> much better than <?php echo form_helper_input('text', 'foo'); ?>
20:36 < Wombert> like other frameworks do it
20:37 < Wombert> our routing is also way more advanced than others you might have seen... in many frameworks, something like /products/:id is as flexible as it ever gets
20:38 < Wombert> and no, we do not use yaml because it sucks big time... you cannot validate it, it is not a defined standard, it cannot easily be machine processed, there is no xsl for it, there is no such thing as xincludes or xpath, it doesn't have namespaces, it hurts the eyes, kills kitten, and if you forget just one space character, it's all blown to smithereens and the computer cannot tell you why
20:38 < blackthorne> i follow you. I agree with that. Btw, there is a framework that gives you a good flexibility for different resources which is Turbogears
20:38 < Wombert> I must admit I never looked at it thoroughly
20:39 < Wombert> but I imagine there is a reason why you don't want to use it
20:39 < Wombert> oh. it's python
20:39 < Wombert> xD
20:39 < Wombert> that's why, probably ;)
20:39 < blackthorne> Python is my language number 1
20:40 < Wombert> I have no language number 1, but python is pretty close
20:40 < Wombert> I just wish it had proper OO
20:40 < blackthorne> it's mostly the way the project is being lead
20:40 < Wombert> python, or turbogears?
20:40 < blackthorne> and its (not) community
20:40 < blackthorne> TG
20:40 < Wombert> hmh
20:40 < blackthorne> i like OO in Python
20:41 < Wombert> in all honesty man, do you really want to go fromPython to PHP?
20:41 < Wombert> you're gonna burn in hell
20:41 < Wombert> :)
20:41 < blackthorne> in the past i did my framework in PHP
20:41 < blackthorne> not MVC
20:41 < Wombert> did you look at Django?
20:41 < blackthorne> didn't like it that much
20:41 < Wombert> they have a great community, great marketing, some good ideas
20:42 < blackthorne> precisely because of what you said about Agavi
20:42 < Wombert> from a technical standpoint, I find too many uncool things about it, but nontheless, it's a very cool project
20:42 < blackthorne> Django is not so flexible
20:42 < Wombert> yes, django is not like that
20:45 < blackthorne> i just have an hard time with the communities of the projects
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20:46 < blackthorne> these non commercial projects
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20:46 < blackthorne> sometimes their community is nothing but a ghost town. IRC channels are like parking stations for cars
20:46 < Wombert> heh
20:46 < Wombert> well at this time and in the weekend our channel is not tooooo active either
20:47 < Wombert> most activity is during the week at european business hours
20:47 < Wombert> and yes, there's a company behind agavi with a strong interest in excellence, growth, continuous development
20:48 < blackthorne> and when they are more active they are very often filled with a geek community. Guys that care a lot about bits and cpu cycles but not the user
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20:51 < blackthorne> at this stage, with the huge power provided by the web, with all the advantages on portability, collaborative work, ...
20:52 < blackthorne> you know web 2.0/3.0..., the fact you don't need to install anything to have a good interface that allows you to make things like
20:53 < blackthorne> Office tasks (google docs), mail client (webmail), ...
20:53 < blackthorne> developers keep on developing this great things for other people and forget about their selves 
20:58 < blackthorne> (please read at least the "Why?" in the FAQ of http://blackthorne.planetaclix.pt )
21:03 < Wombert> I did!
21:04 < blackthorne> :)
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21:26 < blackthorne> so
21:27 < blackthorne> do you find any interest in my project?
21:39 < blackthorne> Wombert
21:49 < Wombert> re
21:49 < Wombert> sorr
21:49 < Wombert> y
21:49 < Wombert> well what you're describing is essentially a browser-based IDE, right?
21:50 < Wombert> but tied to the language and framework you pick
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22:01 < blackthorne> yes 
22:02 < blackthorne> more than that
22:02 < blackthorne> and not an exclusive IDE
22:03 < blackthorne> it also comes with features for management and control
22:04 < blackthorne> i also plan on work on integrating the web framework with any other IDE like Eclipse, Emacs, ...
22:27 < Wombert> :)
22:27 < Wombert> lets talk more tomorrow
22:27 < Wombert> I'm out for some drinks
22:27 < Wombert> =>
22:27 < blackthorne> ok
22:27 < blackthorne> c u
22:35 < blackthorne> i'm looking forward
22:35 < blackthorne> to see agavi in action, some simple code examples
23:29  * impl grins
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--- Day changed Sun Oct 21 2007
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00:31 < blackthorne> re
02:33 < Wombert> re
02:33  * Wombert nudges impl 
02:33 < Wombert> YOU ALIVE DUUUDE?
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07:12 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:47 < Whisller> hi
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08:43 < splatch`> hello
08:43 < splatch`> :)
08:45 < splatch`> Wombert: that was race in Poland? :D
09:01  * MikeSeth pets Wombert 
09:11 < MikeSeth> huomentaaaaaa 
09:12 < splatch`> hello
09:13 < Whisller> hmm
09:13 < Whisller> hi splatch` :)
09:18 < MikeSeth> splatch`, Whisller: you guys ever tried zencart?
09:18 < Whisller> hmm no
09:18 < MikeSeth> oscommerce?
09:18 < Whisller> no
09:18 < splatch`> MikeSeth: oscommerce, yes
09:18 < splatch`> zencart - to
09:18 < MikeSeth> splatch`: did it suck?
09:18 < splatch`> *no
09:19 < splatch`> oscommerce suck like good whore
09:19 < MikeSeth> i am right ain't I
09:19 < Whisller> so is good :D
09:20 < MikeSeth> in short, both are crap
09:20 < MikeSeth> I'm gonna make $$$ :D
09:21 < Whisller> splatch` yesterday I read book from you. Some good practices I must take to php
09:21 < Whisller> MikeSeth you want make shop? ;p
09:21 < MikeSeth> yeap
09:21 < Whisller> *Open
09:21 < splatch`> Whisller: from Java?
09:21 < Whisller> si
09:21 < MikeSeth> Whisller: all shop software existing now SUCKS
09:21 < shoan> amen
09:22 < Whisller> MikeSeth one of my friends has good shop, it is commerce but is good
09:22 < splatch`> ament brother!
09:22 < MikeSeth> Whisller: show me
09:22 < MikeSeth> shoan: you think ZC/OSC sux too?
09:22 < Whisller> http://www.i-sklep.pl/
09:22 < shoan> yep
09:22 < Whisller> I don't remember url to demo, hmm I don't know maybe on page you will find it
09:22 < MikeSeth> Whisller: 1 zl = $ ?
09:22 < splatch`> MikeSeth: 1$ = 3,6 zl
09:23 < splatch`> or
09:23 < splatch`> 1$ = 2,6 zl
09:23 < Whisller> And here it is http://www.i-sklep.pl/info/zamow_demo.html
09:23 < splatch`> i don't remember
09:23 < Whisller> MikeSeth wait
09:23 < MikeSeth> $50/license? ha
09:23 < Whisller> MikeSeth http://www.netsprint.pl/serwis/search?q=1+dolar
09:24 < Whisller> MikeSeth I don't know what licence do he have now. But shop is good :P
09:25 < splatch`> bla bla bla ;)
09:25 < splatch`> Whisller: youre jaco seller? ;)
09:25 < Whisller> http://www.i-sklep.pl/info/cennik_zakup.html here is when you want to buy application
09:25 < splatch`> MikeSeth: i've some shop
09:25 < splatch`> i can give you sources
09:26 < splatch`> shop is based on Agavi
09:26 < Whisller> splatch` no, But I saw it in action so i can tell is good :P
09:26 < splatch`> Whisller: yeah, just like JPortal
09:26 < Whisller> heh but I told you something about jPortal. It was his first application :P
09:27 < Whisller> So what you expect.
09:27 < Whisller> splatch` we drink today?
09:27 < Whisller> *we'll
09:28 < splatch`> Whisller: why not :)
09:28 < splatch`> we will drink when Kaczynski win
09:28 < Whisller> ohhh no
09:28 < Whisller> When he will win I gonna dring whole month ;)
09:28 < splatch`> yeah, after this i gonna to fly from this country
09:28 < splatch`> ;)
09:29 < MikeSeth> splatch`: show me! Is it Doctrine-based?
09:29 < MikeSeth> you know a shop application is a MAJOR player on the market
09:29 < splatch`> MikeSeth: no, i am using propel
09:29 < Whisller> splatch` chicken :P 
09:29 < MikeSeth> a good app = $$$ for everyone here
09:29 < MikeSeth> :D
09:30 < splatch`> MikeSeth: http://sheep.dywicki.pl/ - it's not finished
09:30 < splatch`> without i18n and l10n
09:30 < Whisller> dzidzio ;)
09:32 < MikeSeth> splatch`: is it your source? do you own it?
09:33 < splatch`> MikeSeth: yes, i am author
09:34 < Whisller> kitchen
09:35 < splatch`> MikeSeth: i do zip and give you link
09:40 < Whisller> hmm
09:40 < MikeSeth> splatch`: gpl?
09:40 < splatch`> MikeSeth: no license :)
09:40 < MikeSeth> splatch`: public domain?
09:40 < splatch`> MikeSeth: you're Agavi user, for you this code is free 
09:42 < MikeSeth> splatch`: thanks. I will look at the source carefully, but I doubt I will use it as a base for what I'll be doing
09:42 < MikeSeth> splatch`: I need a pure [L]GPL license, otherwise it can't work in the business model I am looking forward to
09:42 < MikeSeth> splatch`: Agavi has the same problem btw, there's confusion about licenses on some contributions
09:43 < Whisller> yesterday with splatch` we was talking about agavi.org. It nide new design :/ documentation, and so on :/ Tell what I little agavi's user can help.
09:43 < splatch`> MikeSeth: ok, code will be free
09:43 < MikeSeth> Whisller: the site is in works
09:43 < MikeSeth> splatch`: I still can't take it because I don't like Propel. Doctrine <3 :)
09:44 < MikeSeth> Whisller: write tutorials, test cases, extensions
09:44 < splatch`> MikeSeth: you can replace Propel
09:44 < Whisller> MikeSeth hmm
09:44 < splatch`> and use Doctrine
09:44 < MikeSeth> splatch`: yeah, but I will be using Doctrine templates, I don't know if it makes sense
09:47 < MikeSeth> fucking crap, 8sec ping to server 
09:48 < Whisller> Where in mac I can set programm which will be executed when I open file with extends exp: "odt"?
09:54 < Whisller> ok ;)
09:55 < splatch`> nobody like mac :D
09:56 < Whisller> :P
09:58 < Whisller> mac isn't that bad 
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11:06 < Wombert> splatch`: you mean http://youtube.com/watch?v=a56Se27v0aE ? yeah :) watch that, too, Whisller 
11:07 < Wombert> "Co to kurwa jest" means "wtfis that", right?
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11:28 < Whisller> hmm
11:28 < Whisller> I must check it :>
11:28 < Whisller> hehehe
11:29 < Whisller> Wombert yes it is hmm similat to wtfis that
11:33 < Whisller> Wombert do you have mac?
11:37 < Whisller> btw if you want here some dirty polish words check it http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=P2y98-fIKqA  huh
11:37 < Whisller> Really dirty O.o
12:09 < Wombert> very interesting...
12:09 < Wombert> seems nobody ever injected a layer relative to existing ones in their views
12:09 < Wombert> because appendLayer() and prependLayer() are broken
12:09 < Wombert> :p
12:09 < Wombert> and nobody noticed
12:09 < Wombert> :p
12:27 < Wombert> argh
12:27 < Wombert> that is soooo broken :p
12:32 < MikeSeth> Wombert: dang, I was looking over that code just yesterday
12:32 < Wombert> it's fixed now :p
12:41 < CIA-11> david * r2146 /branches/0.11/src/view/AgaviView.class.php: Fixed several bugs in AgaviView::(append|prepend)Layer() that occured when another layer was given as the reference point of operation. Closes #593
12:41 < Wombert> I thiknk we need an RC7 :p
12:55 < CIA-11> david * r2147 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: synced changelog
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12:58 < Wombert> wtf
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13:03 < E_mE> Wombert: why a RC7?
13:03 < Wombert> two bugfixes already :p
13:03 < E_mE> how bug fixes did rc6 have?
13:04 < Wombert> 18
13:04 < E_mE> ohhhh this sounds terrible =P
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13:25 < blackthorne> hi
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13:49 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: hello
13:50 < blackthorne> hail
13:50 < blackthorne> what's up?
13:50 < Wombert> aaah excellent
13:50 < Wombert> MikeSeth: blackthorne needs some more Agavi convincing
13:50 < MikeSeth> convincing?
13:50 < blackthorne> lol
13:51 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: I am the Chief Propaganda Officer for the Agavi project. How can we subvert you today?
13:51 < MikeSeth> eh heh heh
13:51 < Wombert> (he is, no kidding)
13:51 < Wombert> ZOMG PHP
13:51 < Wombert> Warning: fopen(http://localhost:8888/agwiki1/Page:Starte) [function.fopen]: failed to open stream: HTTP request failed! HTTP/1.0 201 Created
13:51 < Wombert> WHY DO YOU SUCK SO HARD
13:51 < MikeSeth> awwwwwwwww
13:51 < MikeSeth> it thinks 201 is a fail code
13:51 < Wombert> yes
13:51 < MikeSeth> how lame
13:51 < Wombert> file_get_contents is what I had first
13:51 < Wombert> no avail
13:51 < MikeSeth> file a bug at b.p.n?
13:51 < Wombert> well
13:52 < Wombert> I want a context option that prevents this SHIT altogether
13:52 < MikeSeth> Wombert: @
13:52 < MikeSeth> heh
13:52 < Wombert> it sends a 404? fine. BUT CAN I PLEAASE STILL HAVE THE BLOODY RESPONSE BODY
13:52 < Wombert> MikeSeth: doesn't solve it. it returns false, not a file pointer
13:52 < MikeSeth> Wombert: well it's certainly a b.p.h matter then
13:52 < MikeSeth> god zend people are sloppy sometimes
13:54 < MikeSeth> Wombert: maybe context manipulation can help?
13:54 < MikeSeth> http://il.php.net/manual/en/ref.stream.php
13:54 < Wombert> nope
13:54 < MikeSeth> file it then :(
13:54 < Wombert> hey
13:54 < Wombert> STREAM_REPORT_ERRORS	
13:54 < Wombert> cool
13:55 < MikeSeth> Wombert: fopen has its last parameter as stream ctx specifier
13:55 < Wombert> MikeSeth: I have that
13:55 < MikeSeth> god, PHP resembles lisp more and more
13:55 < Wombert> 		$c = stream_context_create(array(
13:55 < Wombert> 			$this->getParameter('protocol', 'http') => array(
13:55 < Wombert> 				'method' => 'PUT',
13:55 < Wombert> 				'header' => 'Content-Type: application/json',
13:55 < Wombert> 				'content' => json_encode($obj),
13:55 < Wombert> 			)
13:55 < Wombert> 		));
13:55 < Wombert> 		
13:55 < Wombert> 		$f = fopen($this->baseHref . $obj->_id, 'r', false, $c);
13:55 < Wombert> 		
13:55 < Wombert> 		$r = stream_get_contents($f);
13:55 < blackthorne> i'm just trying to understand Agavi usage and capabilities more in depth
13:56 < Wombert> MikeSeth: but I think STREAM_REPORT_ERRORS is for your own userland wrapper
13:56 < Wombert> gotta check
13:56 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: Agavi is a modular framework with XML glue connecting it, resulting in a very high end set of features that doesn't exist in other frameworks
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13:56 < MikeSeth> Wombert: donno if that'd help you override the false result
13:57 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: basically, it allows you to compartmentalize your code in a fashion that it becomes highly reusable
13:57 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: it is not a solely web framework, but a general PHP application framework
13:58 < MikeSeth> cake and symfony are more like cube toys for 3 year olds, and Agavi is lego for grownups ;)
13:58 < Wombert> hahaha
13:58 < Wombert> :>
13:58 < Wombert> lego technic please!
13:58 < MikeSeth> Wombert: you think it's funny? Imagine a baker drooling over his Z-O-M-G cubicles
13:59 < MikeSeth> "You can't use Doctrine with <this framework>"
13:59 < MikeSeth> "BUT MOOOOOOOOOOM?:
13:59 < MikeSeth> etc.
13:59 < Wombert> ahahhaha
13:59 < Wombert> :>
13:59 < blackthorne> as far as i read, agavi includes propel by default right?
13:59 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: no
14:00 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: Agavi has adapters for some database libraries, and provides very high level management for database connections and models - in the true MVC sense of domain logic models, not in the imaginary way Rails' models are models
14:00 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: it does not however ship with any particular database library and doesn't give preference to a particular one
14:01 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: you can hook up anything transparently, and then just edit your model code if you want to change the underlying library
14:01 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: same for templating engines, e-mail composition etc
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14:15 < _cheerios> legos? aha-ahaa... aha-ahaa...
14:16 < Wombert> 629         if (!reqok || location[0] != '\0') {
14:16 < Wombert> 630                 if (options & STREAM_ONLY_GET_HEADERS && redirect_max <= 1) {
14:16 < Wombert> 631                         goto out;
14:17 < Wombert> 632                 }
14:17 < Wombert> 633 
14:17 < Wombert> 634                 if (location[0] != '\0')
14:17 < Wombert> 635                         php_stream_notify_info(context, PHP_STREAM_NOTIFY_REDIRECTED, location, 0);
14:17 < Wombert> 636 
14:17 < Wombert> 637                 php_stream_close(stream);
14:17 < Wombert> 638                 stream = NULL;
14:17 < Wombert> ZOMG php...
14:17 < Wombert> there is _no_ way to do this
14:17 < Wombert> except fsockopen
14:17 < Wombert> dear god
14:17 < Wombert> MikeSeth: wanna see the http response code handling?
14:17 < Wombert> 550                         switch(response_code) {
14:17 < Wombert> 551                                 case 200:
14:17 < Wombert> 552                                 case 206: /* partial content */
14:17 < Wombert> 553                                 case 302:
14:17 < Wombert> 554                                 case 303:
14:17 < Wombert> 555                                 case 301:
14:17 < Wombert> 556                                         reqok = 1;
14:17 < Wombert> 557                                         break;
14:17 < Wombert> 558                                 case 403:
14:17 < Wombert> 559                                         php_stream_notify_error(context, PHP_STREAM_NOTIFY_AUTH_RESULT,
14:17 < Wombert> 560                                                         tmp_line, response_code);
14:17 < Wombert> 561                                         break;
14:17 < Wombert> 562                                 default:
14:18 < Wombert> 563                                         /* safety net in the event tmp_line == NULL */
14:18 < Wombert> 564                                         if (!tmp_line_len) {
14:18 < Wombert> 565                                                 tmp_line[0] = '\0';
14:18 < Wombert> 566                                         }
14:18 < Wombert> 567                                         php_stream_notify_error(context, PHP_STREAM_NOTIFY_FAILURE,
14:18 < Wombert> 568                                                         tmp_line, response_code);
14:18 < Wombert> 569                         }
14:18 < MikeSeth> idiots
14:18 < blackthorne> i like that and i've noticed that on other frameworks like Django that does reinvent the wheel you have a cloudy set of mixed features
14:18 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: most of projects that call themselves frameworks are kits or libraries, not frameworks
14:19 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: ZFW, for example, is a library, and Symfony is a kit
14:20 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: Agavi gives you the bare necessary minimum of tools to write consistent web application code and not an inch above that
14:20 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: in this sense, Agavi has *foundations*, not *features*
14:21 < MikeSeth> its components are designed to be swapped out or extended in case of necessity; the final classes you use derived from the base classes are there for your convenience, they are an extension of Agavi as a framework concept
14:22 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: for instance, when I needed to add graphs to my media buying software, I wrapped the graphing logic as an Agavi model, and wrote some actions to work on that model - 100% retention of consistency across code
14:22 < MikeSeth> *that* is proper mvc
14:22 < MikeSeth> hooking stuff up via "helpers", "plugins" and "engines" is not proper MVC
14:25 < blackthorne> that's ok, but where can i find simple code examples, intro (action) tutorials, well structured user guide with practical info, screencasts,...
14:25 < blackthorne> let's say... Code Igniter is very based on helpers and i agree with what u've just said
14:25 < blackthorne> however they're user guide is really atractive
14:26 < Wombert> that's true
14:27 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: there's a sample app in the source tree
14:27 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: there's a half-finished manual available, as well
14:27 < Wombert> I wouldn't say bare minimum btw... the form handling is a good example
14:27 < Wombert> blackthorne: one of the upsides is that you don't need to learn a template language, or a database interface, or how to send email
14:27 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: however for an Agavite, familiarity with sources is a better guide than manuals
14:27 < Wombert> because that's up to you
14:28 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, untill you stumble on magic methods :D
14:28 < Wombert> once you understand the basics of how things work together, you're almost there
14:28 < Wombert> but you are right, documentation is a problem right now
14:28 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: there isn't a whole lot of magic in Agavi, except perhaps in routing and translation manager
14:29 < _cheerios> dunno about the amount, but there is undocumented __call()'s.
14:31 < _cheerios> is this unlucky or what? "hospitalized after being hit by a car while taking out the garbage"
14:31 < _cheerios> made me smile, probably not the correct reaction.
14:31 < _cheerios> <offtopic, carry on>
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14:36  * MikeSeth stretches
14:37 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I think the crucial basics are configuration and how it turns to attributes; how classes are autoloaded and how factories are mapped; and high level understanding of what an Agavi application does, e.g. how requests are turned into responses
14:37 < MikeSeth> everything else is technical stuff
14:37 < Wombert> yeah
14:39 < MikeSeth> maybe we should make pretty pictorz
14:39 < MikeSeth> 4chan is still down :(
14:39 < MikeSeth> i need my fix :(
14:45 < Wombert> F1!
14:46 < MikeSeth> ~
14:46 < MikeSeth> ~
14:46 < MikeSeth> ~
14:47 < MikeSeth> doesnt work :(
14:47 < _cheerios> race is in 4hrs or so?
14:56 < Wombert> 1hr
14:56 < _cheerios> hmmk, i'll tune into bbc site at that time then to "watch" the race :D
15:03 < MikeSeth> http://lolnin.com/ ahahaha
15:08  * MikeSeth pokes Wombert 
15:08 < MikeSeth> ahahahaha check this shit out
15:08 < MikeSeth> http://lolcode.com/contributions/omg
15:08 < Wombert> ace
15:09 < MikeSeth> Wombert: some guy I know just returned from a con
15:09 < Wombert> -ference?
15:09 < MikeSeth> someone demonstrated a PostgreSQL loadable language in lolcode
15:09 < Wombert> haha
15:09 < MikeSeth> 143956 <Ka-bar> ICANHASCURSOR!
15:09 < MikeSeth> 144004 <Jostein> I think these things are called "proof of concept" and are to be left as such
15:09 < MikeSeth> 144053 <Ka-bar> The frightening thing is that some nutter actually went to the trouble to implement it.  An obviously
15:10 < MikeSeth>                 bright person with waaaaaaay too much free time on his/her hands.
15:10 < MikeSeth> ahahaha lolcode has all the memes for syntax constructs
15:10 < MikeSeth> harblz, brb, zomg, candlejack, cockmongle, asl, allur, etc
15:10 < _cheerios> :)
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15:17 < MikeSeth> oookay
15:17 < MikeSeth> now before we get too carried away
15:17 < MikeSeth> http://www.tetraboy.com/lolcode/index.lols
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15:17 < Whisller> Cya
15:18 < MikeSeth> marklar: http://www.tetraboy.com/lolcode/index.lols
15:19 < marklar> 29 more days
15:19 < marklar> !!!!!
15:19 < marklar> heh
15:19 < marklar> is lolcode turing complete
15:21 < marklar> mike
15:21 < marklar> I need to talkz to yes
15:37 < blackthorne> marklar: ask them for introduction, and join the team
15:40 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: them, who? he's my would be flatmate ;)
15:40 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: and btw feel free to ask further re: Agavi supremacy
15:41 < blackthorne> lol
15:41 < blackthorne> genuine supremacy about something should not be asked
15:41 < blackthorne> ;)
15:42 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: you can experience it if you read the source code for routing, caching and execution containers
15:44 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
15:45 < MikeSeth> ...gay people sending me gifts at facebook
15:46 < blackthorne> i just hope that's not temporary. I've followed agavi at far away from some time now
15:46 < blackthorne> and I see a big flaw on documentation
15:46 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: no one really needs it, everyone reads source code ;)
15:47 < blackthorne> honestly, source code doesn't attract me very much as user guide resource
15:47 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: I wrote a chapter or so and gonna write more
15:48 < blackthorne> i did some very impressive things in two days of usage of Code Igniter while i was paying attention to some conferences about OSS
15:48 < blackthorne> I could do it just because of their good documentation.
15:52 < blackthorne> maybe it's not so appropriate to bring CI to this channel. I'm just trying to show the importance of a good (real) documentation
15:53 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: we are completely aware of it, but this is in part because of lack of necessity and in part because of a policy
15:53 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
15:53 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: until 1.0, we keep very low profile
15:54 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: this is because basically, we do not want a ton of users dragging the framework into this or that direction before it's finalized
15:54 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: we have just enough to filter out bugs and make common sense decisions
15:55 -!- _trophaeum [i=sireoyin@ppp59-167-111-103.lns3.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #agavi
15:55 < MikeSeth> i fish out potential subjects on ##php sometimes, but it's really seldom because most people there are retards and can't appreciate what's being done here
15:56 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: I assure you though, the documentation will be brought up in order before 1.0
15:56 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: we have, well, vested financial interest ;)
15:57 < MikeSeth> blackthorne: and don't hesitate to bring up other projects. We spend most of the time here laughing at them. You can, too ;)
16:04 < Wombert> HAHA HAMILTON YOU RETARD
16:05 < blackthorne> he lost?
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16:13 < Wombert> hamiltons car is out! defect!
16:13 < Wombert> zomg!
16:13 < Wombert> and now he's going again
16:14 < Wombert> woot
16:14 < MikeSeth> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
16:14 < MikeSeth> http://missoulian.com/articles/2007/10/20/news/local/news02.txt <================
16:16 < _cheerios> damn, nice f1 start
16:16 < _cheerios> he just run wide on the corner, aight?
16:17 < _cheerios> im only at lap6 @ bbc ;)
16:18 < _cheerios> so kimi still has chances? wow :D
16:19 < Wombert> he ran wide yes
16:19 < _cheerios> car imbalance being what it is, a mclaren catches up a lost 40 seconds in 2 laps
16:19 < Wombert> but now he had a hydraulics failure and stopped
16:19 < Wombert> but then he got going again
16:19 < Wombert> P18 or so right now
16:20 < _cheerios> damn, quite a thriller
16:20 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
16:20 < Wombert> yeah
16:21 < Wombert> I hope kimi wins
16:21 < Wombert> teh championship, I mean
16:21 < _cheerios> if hamiltons car breaks down it's going to a fight till the end, for sure
16:21 < Wombert> well seems he was able to reset the electronics and now all is back to normal
16:21 < Wombert> but he has to wade through traffic
16:22 < _cheerios> but that's all probably scripted f1 entertainment, aite! :D
16:22 < _cheerios> = won't take that long to be 5th or so
16:23 < Wombert> awww webber is out :<
16:24 < _cheerios> was he watching the male drivers too much like Vettel?
16:24 < Wombert> haha
16:25 < Wombert> no, car broke down
16:25 < Wombert> too bad :(
16:25 < Wombert> he's had bad luck ever since
16:25 < Wombert> and sorry for red bull :/
16:25 < Wombert> they need to score 5pts and williams nil to overtake them in the championship
16:25  * Wombert <3 red bull
16:26 < Wombert> if only vettel hadn't crashed into him in japan... bah
16:27 < _cheerios> bah. and everyone has to make room for hamilton to get to 6th to claim champiosnship... well, it seems he lost it already. Alonso seems like the one with best chances to win.
16:28 < _cheerios> end: kimi,massa,alonso,hamilton
16:29 < _cheerios> nm, alonso had to be 1st. that probably wont happen either :)
16:29 < _cheerios> hamilton has so much room for mistakes.
16:30 < Wombert> nah
16:30 < Wombert> kimi, alonso means alonso wins
16:31 < Wombert> kimi, massa, alonso means kimi wins, unless hamilton is 5th or better
16:31 < _cheerios> which hamilton will claim easily
16:32 < Wombert> not so sure
16:32 < _cheerios> i dont have the times on how those other lesser teams are going, they got speed?
16:35 < Wombert> the mclaren is not very gentle on the tyres
16:36 < Wombert> which means once the graining begins, it gets difficult to overtake at least the BMWs
16:36 < Wombert> given how heidfeld is 4th and kubica is 5th...
16:36 < _cheerios> what happened to Kovalainen?
16:36 < _cheerios> as long as they make it to the end, yeah, could be
16:37 < Wombert> he had some sort of accident
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16:40 < blackthorne> damn... i just can't make a choice from the available tools for web development
16:50 < Wombert> kovalainen crashed
16:51 < _cheerios> sucky end of season for him
16:51 < Wombert> his crash damaged the tyre wall ribbon
16:51 < Wombert> this might mean safety car
16:51 < Wombert> which would be good for hamilton
16:52 < _cheerios> only if FIA wants to ruin a good suspenseful race
16:55 < _cheerios> im reading that Alonso ain't doing too good either now?
17:00 < Wombert> true
17:07 < Wombert> massa in pits
17:07 < Wombert> raikkonen another second quicker
17:07 < Wombert> !
17:07 < Wombert> and the ferrari are a second faster than the mclaren already
17:08 < Wombert> alonso is uuuber slow
17:08 < Wombert> hamilton is 8th
17:10 < Wombert> go kimi go
17:12 < _cheerios> it's all upto to the other drivers to not fck up now
17:16 < E_mE> im watching F1 on tv.. i hope kimi gets it... not fond of mr alonso
17:18 < Wombert> word
17:18 < _cheerios> local bbs is having problems due about one page of comments coming in all the time ("Server Error in '/' Application.)
17:19 < _cheerios> so close, yet so far!!! ARRR!!! :D
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17:22 < _cheerios> 10 laps...
17:24 < E_mE> _cheerios: you going to celebrate down the pub ;)
17:25 < _cheerios> it's sunday, 8:30pm, uh huh. and it's cold outside! :D
17:27 < _cheerios> hamilton won't win, but can kimi edge it? alonso could luck out still.
17:31 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to: Welcome to #agavi :: 0.11RC6 is out! :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: KUDOS, KIMI, GO FINLAND!
17:32 < _cheerios> woot! :shock:
17:32 < Wombert> awesome
17:32 < E_mE> yay!!
17:32  * Wombert hugs _cheerios 
17:32  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
17:32  * Wombert hugs ttj 
17:33 < E_mE> the presenter keeps saying the tiny country of finland... but from what i can see it aint that tiny :/
17:33 < _cheerios> UNBELIEVABLE
17:34 < E_mE> pretty damn wicked i say... glad he won over alonso!
17:34 < E_mE> its not been a good weekend for the england... Lost hte rugby world cup yesterday, lost 2-1 to russia in the football last week and now hasn't won the world champonship in F1
17:35 < _cheerios> it was the same for finland in some sports last winter, with us being close to winning ice hockey and something else. didn't endup winning either :)
17:35 < Wombert> well you won the eurovision thing... :p
17:36 < _cheerios> HARD ROCK HALLELUJAH!
17:36 < _cheerios> "The whole Ferrari team are out of the pits. Amazing scenes. Raikkonen is going to be mobbed after he finishes his lap of honour." :D
17:40 < Wombert> ladies and gentlemen, please be upstanding for the finnish national anthem
17:41 < Wombert> can you sing it for us, _cheerios :)
17:41 < _cheerios> lol
17:41 < Wombert> ;)
17:42 < _cheerios> im glad for kimi. seemed he ran out of luck with the mc->ferrari switch due the unfortunate wind tunnel glitch ferrari had start of season, but... it's the end result that counts! wow!
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17:42 < marklar> hi.
17:43 < E_mE> Hard rock hallelujah as GREAT!! loved it!
17:44 < E_mE> was*
17:46 < _cheerios> kimi 110, hamilton 109, alonso 109... now that's CLOSE.
17:46 < _cheerios> red bull flopped on their overtake-williams plans :)
17:48 < _cheerios> http://kuvat.iltalehti.fi/etusivuextra/kansikimitekiSL_410_ee.gif
17:48 < E_mE> cya later... well done finland :)
17:48 < E_mE> congrats _cheerios :)
17:48 < Wombert> yeah too bad for red bull
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17:49 < _cheerios> heh @ "hamilton is a sand expert"
17:49 < _cheerios> a slight quip at him running wide two races in a row? :)
17:49 < Wombert> cool
17:49 < Wombert> _cheerios: http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/16528480
17:49 < Wombert> :>
17:50 < _cheerios> :)
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17:51 < Wombert> I'm feeling sorry for Massa
17:51 < Wombert> he's such a nice guy
17:51 < Wombert> would have been nice if had been able to win w/o killing Kimis chances
17:53 < _cheerios> im reading Kimi is being quite cool about just winning the WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP :)
17:53 < Wombert> yeah
17:53 < Wombert> as usual :p
17:53 < Wombert> hakkinen was the same
17:53 < Wombert> weird finns :>
17:53 < Wombert> DO YOU EVER SMILE?
17:54 < _cheerios> i smile too much :)
17:58 < Wombert> mmmh really sucks for red bull
17:58 < Wombert> constructors championship is important because the results determine on how the money is split
17:59 < Wombert> given their performance lately, a bit more money could easily make the difference for next year
17:59 < Wombert> they're definitely the top contenders for the #1 non-factory team
17:59 < Wombert> not to mention that they and williams easily beat renault, toyota and honda
18:00 < _cheerios> they all run last season ferrari tech, or ?
18:00 -!- JanK__ is now known as JanK_
18:00 < Wombert> no, that's not allowed yet
18:00 < Wombert> just engines
18:00 < Wombert> williams = toyota, red bull = renault, toro rosso and spyker = ferrari
18:02 < _cheerios> hehe... makes toyota/reunault look bad, idd
18:02 < Wombert> next year's regulations might allow teams to purchase the chassis and other parts (rest of powertrain etc) in addition to the engine
18:04 < Wombert> prodrive (now aston martin owners) wanted to buy a mclaren customer car but the deal has been cancelled apparently as the regulations are not yet final
18:06 < _cheerios> do you think Alonso will be at mclaren next season?
18:11 < _cheerios> well, that was an intense 2 hours :D
18:12 < impl> Are you guys talking about F1 *again*?
18:12 < impl> omghh
18:12  * _cheerios slaps impl 
18:13 < v-dogg> oh you americans wouldn't know good motor sports even if it hit you in the face :)
18:14 < v-dogg> all you do is race on an oval track. how boring is that 
18:14 < impl> v-dogg: Unfortunately, I live to the right of the track
18:14 < _cheerios> hello vdogg :D
18:14 < impl> :D
18:14 < impl> And we do have F1
18:14 < impl> Just nobody cares about it
18:14 < impl> I mean, nobody cares about NASCAR either
18:17 < _cheerios> it was the only thing on in my neighbour in the states :D
18:18 < _cheerios> nascar + budweiser!
18:19 < impl> Budweiser is disgusting :(
19:06 < Wombert> impl: seven billion stupid rednecks do
19:06 < Wombert> :>
19:27 < blackthorne> back
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21:16 < marklar> heh
21:17 < marklar> 9.8 @ hotornot
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21:17 < Wombert> you?
21:18 < marklar> yeah
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21:25 < marklar> vote count is like 40 though
21:27 < Wombert> are you, er, a girl?
21:27 < marklar> nope
21:27 < marklar> that's the strange part.
21:27 < _cheerios> will we all fall in love with you now
21:27 < marklar> hope not, unless you pay my bills 
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23:03 < Wombert> ZOMG!!!!!!
23:03 < Wombert> v-dogg: http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/10/7023.html
23:03 < Wombert> woot!
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23:08 < JamieWolf> man this sucks... Lewis did a bad job, so what?
23:10 < Wombert> zomg
23:10 < Wombert> The statement said Heidfeld's fuel was 13C lower than ambient at his first stop and 12C lower at his second.
23:10 < Wombert> Kubica's varied by 14C, 13C and 13C at his three stops, while Rosberg's was 13C and 12C out at his two stops.
23:10 < Wombert> zomg zomg!
23:11 < Wombert> In 1995, the Benetton-Renault of Michael Schumacher and the Williams-Renault of David Coulthard were initially disqualified from first and second places in the Brazilian Grand Prix because their fuel did not conform to samples approved by the FIA.
23:11 < Wombert> But a week later the FIA reinstated the drivers' points but docked the teams their constructors' points.
23:12 < Wombert> oooh man this is just too much
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23:42 < Wombert> http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/7343/liquidnitrogen1wm7.jpg
--- Day changed Mon Oct 22 2007
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04:10 < shoan> huomenta
04:19 < blackthorne_> bye
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06:28 < Whisller> hi
06:31 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:08 < _cheerios> huomenta
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07:31 < _cheerios> btw., php_uname() in the plaintext.php exception template always prints out the same time of day
07:32 < _cheerios> my exceptions always occur @ Fri Jun 1 15:01:20 BST 2007 i686
07:34 < RossC0> Ticket?
07:34 < _cheerios> could be a php thing too, that server is a xen virtual.
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09:14 < _cheerios> to have development/production specific settings, was the way to have them setup be in different contexts in settings.xml? Is there a way to not have core. prefix on custom values?
09:22 < E_mE> _cheerios: you heard that maybe kimi might loose his first place 
09:23 < _cheerios> i read about the bmw-williams fuel temperature irregularities, ye
09:24 < _cheerios> would be shit if they do anything to the current result
09:24 < E_mE> yah, would seem abit bitter really... kimi being all happy and then he loses it because of a post race event
09:25 < _cheerios> well, that, moreover a great race is watered down by technicalities
09:26 < _cheerios> even if they won a second or two by for some reason having the wrong temperature in the fuel, it wouldn't have changed a thing in the standings
09:26 < _cheerios> (it would've been different if one of them was ahead of Alonso)
09:27 < E_mE> but if both of them are disqualified or so, then hamilton would become 5th, meaning he wins championship?
09:27 < _cheerios> sure, but that's a bit extreme.
09:28 < E_mE> hopefully it all remains the same :) im happy that kimi won... he deserves it after all his work over the years
10:10 < Whisller> hmm I have some problems with sessions :/ Still add somethimes empty record to database, and then I must delete cookie to login into page
10:11 < Whisller> agavipdo
10:11 < Whisller> id field for session has bigint type
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10:33 < MikeSeth_> _cheerios: environments. Not contexts.
10:33 < MikeSeth_> _cheerios: you of course can load filters and classes conditionally depending on the environment
10:33 < MikeSeth_> huomenta!
10:36 < _cheerios> got an example on that?
10:36 < _cheerios> or do you mean in a "you can, if you code it" kind of way
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10:43 < MikeSeth_> _cheerios: there's an example in the sample app and the default distro has a development envo set up with execution time filter etc
10:46 < v-dogg> wait wait wait, what are you doing?
10:47 < v-dogg> (or trying to do)
10:47 < v-dogg> just custom settings per context/env?
10:47 < _cheerios> yeppes
10:48 < _cheerios> (per environment)
10:49 < v-dogg> <configuration environment="myenv"> <settings prefix="com.myapp."> <setting name="oof">rab</setting>
10:49 < v-dogg> AgaviConfig::get('com.myapp.oof');
10:50 < v-dogg> stuff it into settings.xml and xinclude it
10:50 < v-dogg> err.
10:50 < v-dogg> s/and/or/
10:51 < _cheerios> cool, prefix="" thing is handy
10:53 < _cheerios> hmm... this seems like a bug.
10:54 < _cheerios> i load in <configuration>, then <configuration environment="production">, then <configuration environment="development">. Each setup the same variable.
10:54 < _cheerios> but in "development" environemt, it uses "production" value, if not found there, instead of the default-environment one.
10:55 < _cheerios> oops, nope, had mistyped environment :D
11:04 < MikeSeth_> :D
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11:58 < Wombert> _cheerios: the date/time in your uname is the build date of the os...
11:58 < Wombert> _cheerios: no, settings.xml is per environment only
11:59 < Wombert> <settings prefix="com.myapp.foo."> ftw though
12:00 < _cheerios> hmmk, ok, so those exception templates need more love again to log the time the exception took place.
12:00 < Wombert> yeah _cheerios update agavi
12:00 < Wombert> config validation was disabled hehe stupid bug xD
12:01 < _cheerios> ah, was wondering, usually agavi was quite strict about xml config errors
12:02 < Wombert> yeah... remember when we discussed if it should be core.skip_config_validation or core.config_validation (positive or negative)
12:02 < Wombert> well seemed I forgot to change the expression accordingly xD
12:04 < CIA-11> david * r2148 /branches/0.11/src/exception/templates/ (plaintext.php shiny.php): Output current date and time in exception templates
12:05 < _cheerios> we need a !test command in here with "BDD TDD Agile XP Ninja Programming Voodoo And That Would Have NEVER Happened!" :p
12:07 < MikeSeth> yay @ bullshit driven development
12:07 < _cheerios> Wombert, I didnt use context in the end, but an added Stack Trace (URL: <?php echo $_SERVER['SERVER_NAME'].$_SERVER['REQUEST_URI']; ?>) is very handy in ze logs.
12:21 < _cheerios> Quick test to make sure dev&prod settings are in sync: http://p.caboo.se/private/tdnguwy0wbxufhoibrq0ja
12:40 < Wombert> _cheerios: you could also swap out those to a separate file
12:40 < Wombert> then write an xsd for it
12:40 < Wombert> and embed the xsd declaration in that external file
12:40 < Wombert> even though I'm not 100% sure if agavi does resolve those...
12:40 < Wombert> err no it can't
12:40 < Wombert> sorry
12:40 < _cheerios> the xsd would have done what?
12:41 < _cheerios> ah. XML Schema Definition (XSD). well, just needed something basic to give the obvious errata away.
12:45 < _cheerios> the xiincluding does look tempting, tho
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13:02 < CIA-11> david * r2149 /branches/0.11/src/renderer/AgaviRenderer.class.php: Refactored renderer parameter initialization a little and added ability to configure the default template extension via parameter "default_extension", closes #594
13:09 < Wombert> woot
13:09 < Wombert> http://info.break.com/static/live/v1/pages/brain/brain.html
13:09 < Wombert> check that out
13:09 < Wombert> oO
13:13  * Wombert slaps RossC0 
13:13  * Wombert slaps _cheerios 
13:13 < Wombert> CLICK TEH LINK!
13:14 < RossC0> thats rubbish
13:14 < RossC0> she spins both ways
13:15 < Wombert> oO then your brain hemispheres are in conflict! zomg!
13:15 < RossC0> zomg I have two brains!
13:16 < Wombert> she spins clockwise all the time now here
13:16 < Wombert> even when I work on code
13:16 < Wombert> which is, er, odd
13:16 < RossC0> wierd I read the text and she spins the other way!
13:16 < _cheerios> the question should be more prominent there
13:16 < Wombert> yes RossC0 that happened to me too, first
13:16 < _cheerios> im not sure if it now influenced my conclusion
13:17 < _cheerios> as i looked at her, read text, and was "yeah"... but then looked and was "umm, no".
13:18 < RossC0> hehehee if I look out of the corner of my eye she changes dir
13:19 < _cheerios> and probably the darkness fades away too.. ;)
13:19 < Wombert> hum
13:19 < Wombert> RossC0: that's because you focus on something else
13:19 < Wombert> but it doesn't work for me anymore
13:20 < Wombert> just played a game of sukoku, still clockwise
13:20 < RossC0> lol
13:20 < RossC0> ha well
13:20 < Wombert> aaaah!
13:20 < RossC0> back to work!!
13:20 < Wombert> she has to be in the middle of the screen
13:21 < RossC0> I feel dizzy
13:21 < _cheerios> it's an insanity test. there's only one correct answer!
13:21 < RossC0> Oww Wombert
13:21 < RossC0> Compile.xml - hows that work?
13:21 < RossC0> I currently have all my files listed in autoload.xml
13:22 < Wombert> are you using apc?
13:22 < Wombert> then it prolly don't matter
13:22 < RossC0> ah ok
13:22 < RossC0> sweet
13:22 < Wombert> but add your files there
13:22 < Wombert> and they are loaded in bootstrap()
13:22 < Wombert> so do that only with those you always need
13:22 < Wombert> e.g. base action and view
13:22 < Wombert> or so
13:22 < RossC0> ah ok - so I don' t have to ammend the autoload.xml?
13:22 < RossC0> or I should remove them from there.
13:23 < RossC0> ?
13:23 < RossC0> :D
13:23 < Wombert> if it's in compile.xml then you don't need them in autoload
13:23 < RossC0> rgr
13:23 < RossC0> cool tar
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13:36 < v-dogg> #¤%&!"#
13:36 < v-dogg> I fucking hate Delphi's "with" syntax
13:37 < v-dogg> it makes the code unreadable
13:39  * _cheerios remembers someone asking that to be added to PHP on devlist a few days back
13:40 < _cheerios> (it was turned down)
13:42 < MikeSeth> stupid pascal legacy
13:45 -!- epaulin [n=epaulin@61.144.108.109] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
13:48 < E_mE> don't think the with was a pascal feature, think it was a delphi thing...
13:48 < E_mE> well i never used it in Pascal
13:48 < Wombert> it was in pascal
13:49 < E_mE> in the Pascal's OOP features?
13:52 < MikeSeth> actually, it was before OOP, for struct access
13:52 < MikeSeth> just a primitive xlat pointer trick
13:53 < MikeSeth> a pre-compiler optimization
13:58 -!- jake [n=jake@cpe-66-61-166-240.indy.res.rr.com] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
13:59 -!- jake [n=jake@adsl-68-78-5-163.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has joined #agavi
13:59 < jake> Anyone know how up to date the pear channel is for agavi?
14:00 < jake> looks like RC6
14:07 < MikeSeth> RC6 is the latest stable
14:22 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has quit []
14:38 -!- blackthorne_ [n=blacktho@unaffiliated/blackthorne] has quit []
14:42 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
15:00 < Wombert> rc6 is there, yes
15:00 < Wombert> I think I'll roll rc7 in a bit
15:01 < jake> what's it going to include?
15:01 < jake> And how long is 'a bit' :)
15:02 < CIA-11> david * r2150 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: PUNATRYBT
15:02 < Wombert> jake: http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/CHANGELOG?rev=2150
15:03 < RossC0> Wombert: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_FU95wo5lo
15:05 < CIA-11> david * r2151 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: PUNATRYBT ntnva
15:05 < Wombert> RossC0: yup :>
15:07 -!- marklar [i=mark@unaffiliated/marklar] has quit [Connection timed out]
15:12 < Whisller> hmm
15:32 -!- marklar [i=mark@84.94.94.99] has joined #agavi
15:40 -!- marklar` [i=mark@84.94.94.99] has joined #agavi
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15:58 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["Leaving"]
16:04 -!- shoan [n=shoan@59.96.192.222] has joined #agavi
16:22 < jake> anyone using agavi behind a lighttpd reverse proxy?
16:24 -!- _cheerios [n=jacklo@cs181068034.pp.htv.fi] has joined #agavi
16:27 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
16:30 < Wombert> jake: more specifically?
16:30 < Wombert> any issues?
16:30 < Wombert> like server port being incorrect or so?
16:31 < Wombert> jake: there's always a way :) e.g.:
16:31 < Wombert> 	<configuration environment="production.*">
16:31 < Wombert> 		<request class="AgaviWebRequest">
16:31 < Wombert> 			<parameter name="sources">
16:31 < Wombert> 				<parameter name="SERVER_PORT">HTTP_X_FORWARDED_PORT</parameter>
16:31 < Wombert> 			</parameter>
16:31 < Wombert> 		</request>
16:31 < jake> well, I'm just wondering if I need to do anything, based on what I was reading in the cookbook
16:32 < jake> I think I actually misconfigure our web servers behind the proxy so that SERVER_NAME, etc is correct
16:32 < jake> heh
16:32 < jake> but that's pre-agavi. I should just configure it correctly
16:33 < jake> back in a bit. heading home to work from a coffee shop
16:33 -!- jake [n=jake@adsl-68-78-5-163.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
16:34 -!- jake [n=jake@cpe-66-61-166-240.indy.res.rr.com] has joined #agavi
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16:40 -!- RossC0 [n=lawleyr@80.4.120.163] has left #agavi []
16:44 < _cheerios> http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/6336/wc2007tr1.jpg
16:59 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
17:03 < _cheerios> Timbaland <3<3
17:15 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
17:17 -!- marklar` is now known as marklar
17:19 < marklar> mike: hai2u
17:21 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
17:21 < MikeSeth> OH HI I C WHAT U DID
17:21 < marklar> orly?
17:21 < MikeSeth> yarly
17:21 < marklar> nowai
17:21 < MikeSeth> wai
17:21 < marklar> noes
17:21 < MikeSeth> zomg
17:21 < MikeSeth> <3 4chan 
17:22 < marklar> hehe
17:22 < marklar> sup?
17:22 < MikeSeth> it's down atm though.. lulz.net assholes ddosed it
17:22 < MikeSeth> well um
17:22 < MikeSeth> sitting around, writing me codez
17:22 < marklar> you watch House at all?
17:22 < MikeSeth> I've seen that one ep where he trips on LSD while solving some little girl virus mystery
17:23 < marklar> hehe
17:23 < marklar> <3 house
17:24 < MikeSeth> <3 ncis
17:24 < MikeSeth> Wombert: RIGHT?
17:24 < marklar> csi:ny ftw
17:24 < MikeSeth> nooooo, csi = formula series
17:24 < MikeSeth> </3 
17:25 < marklar> meh
17:25 -!- sean` [n=Sean@ip503c224d.speed.planet.nl] has joined #agavi
17:25 < marklar> JAG~
17:25 < MikeSeth> JAG 100%
17:25 < marklar> I bought my mom a Sandisk Sansa e260
17:25 < marklar> nice little player
17:25 < MikeSeth> NOOOOOOOOOOO
17:25 < MikeSeth> you shouldnt have
17:25 < marklar> grandparents paid for it
17:25 < MikeSeth> i bought one for joe for his bd
17:26 < MikeSeth> it died in less than 2 weeks
17:26 < marklar> is it tehsuk?
17:26 < marklar> heh
17:26 < MikeSeth> filesystem went tits up
17:26  * marklar looks at the warranty slip
17:26 < marklar> :\
17:26 < marklar> I wanted a MuVo
17:26 < MikeSeth> the very first chinese 1gb mp3 was the best shit evor
17:26 < marklar> but nobody had one in stock
17:26 < marklar> man, my ipod ruled
17:26 < marklar> till I sold it 
17:26 < marklar> heh
17:26 < marklar> remember when I first got it?
17:27 < marklar> I was like, "wow, itunes"
17:27 < Wombert> ncis is pretty cool yes
17:27 < MikeSeth> Wombert: bionic woman?
17:27 < Wombert> you guys sitting in the same apartment and chatting in this channel in zomg language?
17:27 < Wombert> dear goodness
17:27 < Wombert> MikeSeth: never seen dat
17:28 < marklar> Wombert: not yet, I'm about 180km away
17:28 < marklar> we'll be doing that in December
17:28 < MikeSeth> Wombert: nigga's moving in with me
17:28 < marklar> ftw
17:29 < marklar> I think my p2p apps are baffled
17:29 < marklar> from death metal to alla pugacheva
17:29 < marklar> :\
17:29 < MikeSeth> marklar: since bezeqint bought actcom, my dsl line went gradually fubar
17:29 < MikeSeth> everything fails
17:29 < marklar> residential inet in .il sucks 
17:29  * MikeSeth kicks last.fm, wtf yeah yeah yeahs
17:29 < marklar> lawlz
17:30 < marklar> what's our compatibility on last.fm, btw
17:30 < MikeSeth> dont know, dont remember the f'ng password
17:30 < MikeSeth> lol
17:30 < MikeSeth> found old code
17:30 < MikeSeth>         function __construct($auth_admin, $auth_http)
17:30 < MikeSeth>         {
17:30 < MikeSeth>                 $this->cookieJar = '/tmp/kukiz';
17:31 < marklar> nais
17:31 < Wombert> hah
17:31 < marklar> some of my c# code has comments like
17:31 < marklar> "wtf msft die"
17:31 < MikeSeth> hmmm
17:32 < MikeSeth> grep -i '(piss|shit|fuck|crap|omg|stfu)' ~/dev
17:32 < MikeSeth> let's see what comes out
17:32 < MikeSeth> er, fail, that's rgrep
17:33 -!- sean` [n=Sean@ip503c224d.speed.planet.nl] has quit ["Ik ga weg"]
17:33 < marklar> np: pain of salvation - second love
17:34 -!- JanK__ [n=JanK_@muedsl-82-207-209-051.citykom.de] has joined #agavi
17:34 < MikeSeth> umm
17:34 < MikeSeth> lemme see
17:35  * Wombert smacks MikeSeth and marklar 
17:35 < Wombert> you guys scare people
17:35 < Wombert> at least you scare me
17:35 < marklar> kek
17:35 < Wombert> you wacky weirdos
17:35 < marklar> but I'm not scary
17:35 < marklar> hotornot says so :(
17:35  * marklar queues up some more Russian pop
17:36 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I'm getting a t-shirt that says "did it for teh lulz"
17:36 < MikeSeth> marklar: I
17:36 < MikeSeth> 'm looking for a remix of Lamia - Dark Angel
17:36 < MikeSeth> can't locate it
17:37 < Wombert> don't you have icq or something? :p
17:37 < MikeSeth> fuck no
17:37 < MikeSeth> i mean
17:37 < MikeSeth> i do
17:37 < MikeSeth> but i have 3 people on it
17:37 < Wombert> get privmsg :p
17:37 < MikeSeth> 2 vendors and one woman I worship
17:39 < marklar> heh
17:39 < marklar> mike
17:39 < marklar> I sent out some guy from army to recon my planned route to ks
17:39 < marklar> he just passed wingate
17:40 < marklar> alien produkt remix?
17:40 < Wombert> wtf?
17:40 < MikeSeth> marklar: no, I have that
17:40 < Wombert> wtf is ks
17:40 < Wombert> wtf is wingate
17:40 < MikeSeth> Wombert: KS is Kfar Saba, my town
17:40 < Wombert> YOU GUYS CREEP ME OUT
17:41 < MikeSeth> Wombert: and the Wingtate University 
17:41 < marklar> LOOK AT YOUR WINDOW
17:41 < MikeSeth> the lamest university ever
17:41 -!- Chonsu [n=martin@87.79.35.58] has left #agavi []
17:41 < MikeSeth> cuz the only thing it teaches is sports
17:41 < Wombert> wingtit
17:41  * Wombert chuckles
17:41 < Wombert> =>
17:41 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dslb-084-056-046-032.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit []
17:41 < marklar> hehe
17:41 < MikeSeth> oh my god
17:41 < MikeSeth> they killer wombert
17:41 < marklar> yea
17:41 < MikeSeth> btw
17:41 < marklar> I warned him 
17:41 < MikeSeth> Madonna - American Life
17:41 < marklar> he just had to look at the window
17:42 < MikeSeth> oakenfold remix
17:42 < MikeSeth> <33
17:42 < marklar> yea? k, emule
17:42 < marklar> heh
17:43 < marklar> everytime I listen to Koxbox I'm like, "eh, bad mental image"
17:43 < _cheerios> is there a way to define a setting (in settings.xml) as boolean?
17:43 < MikeSeth> that mix = super dance
17:43 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: so that it gets imported into the namespace as boolean?
17:44 < _cheerios> yeah, i had a true/false setting before
17:44 < MikeSeth> ah uhm
17:44 < _cheerios> but moving it to settings.xml it's a string and won't work
17:44 < MikeSeth> i dont know
17:44 < MikeSeth> you can look in config source
17:45 < _cheerios> #¤%!
17:45 < MikeSeth> you could coerce it explicitly
17:45 < MikeSeth> $foo = (bool) AgaviConfig::get(...)
17:46 < _cheerios> wrong end to fix the problem, imo
17:46 < MikeSeth> marklar: www.tormentedradio.com
17:46 < _cheerios> but could act as a temporary band-aid, yes
17:46 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I really dont know :(
17:49 < marklar> bsplayer mustdie
17:50 < MikeSeth> its non-free now
17:50 < marklar> havent noticed
17:50 < MikeSeth> stupid closed source racists
17:50 -!- JanK_ [n=JanK_@muedsl-82-207-220-245.citykom.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
17:50 < _cheerios> vlc did not kill bsplayer ?
17:51 < MikeSeth> vlc isn't a whole lot to be proud about either
17:51 < marklar> heh
17:51 < marklar> mike, do you remember/know marc?
17:51 < marklar> one with the bmw
17:52 < MikeSeth> no
17:52 < marklar> hmpf
17:52 < MikeSeth> unless it's the scsi cable guy from netvision
17:53 < marklar> nah
17:53 < marklar> lunix kernel guy
17:53 < MikeSeth> nope
17:53 < marklar> okthx
17:53 < MikeSeth> stopped doing kernell stuff years ago
17:53 < marklar> coffee <3
17:53 < MikeSeth> marklar: btw, download some Kosheen
17:53 < marklar> ma ze, ze?
17:54 < marklar> hm
17:54 < MikeSeth> it pwns
17:54 < marklar> The sounds of "Damage" synthesise elements of dark electro / synthpop/ downtempo /vocal/ electronica 
17:54 < marklar> sounds good
17:54 < MikeSeth> it's really really unique
17:55 < MikeSeth> unique as in trent reznor, not as in christina aguilera
17:55 < marklar> it'd be funny if they were called Kosheem
17:57 < marklar> mike, http://www.terrorism-info.org.il/malam_multimedia/Hebrew/press/ar_press_181007.pdf
17:57 < marklar> condi caricature
17:57 < marklar> lawlz
17:58 < MikeSeth> ahahahah
18:08 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["bbl"]
18:21 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dialbs-213-023-052-058.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
18:21  * MikeSeth pets Wombert 
18:21 < Wombert> hawi
18:21 < Wombert> *hai
18:22 < marklar> ragh
18:22 < marklar> mike, the guy got lost
18:22 < marklar> ended up in herzlia cbs
18:22 < marklar> took 029 from there
18:22 < marklar> heh
18:23 < MikeSeth> marklar: what a noob
18:23 < MikeSeth> tell him to gtfo and try again
18:23 < MikeSeth> it's a straight friggen road
18:23 < marklar> haha
18:24  * MikeSeth makes some commits
18:24 < MikeSeth> its almost nine in the evening, and im still writing the frigging code ffs
18:24 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has joined #agavi
18:25 < marklar> so stopz
18:25 < MikeSeth> owwww
18:25  * MikeSeth has a brilliant idea
18:25 < marklar> wow .il domains got cheap
18:25 < MikeSeth> Agavi validators to the rescue
18:25 < MikeSeth> marklar: really?
18:25 < marklar> $18
18:26 < MikeSeth> it was $60/2yr
18:26 < MikeSeth> GTFO!!
18:26 < marklar> no shit
18:26 < marklar> can you lend me $20?
18:26 < marklar> :\
18:26 < marklar> I need to get mark.org.il back
18:26 < MikeSeth> domain:       rape.co.il
18:26 < MikeSeth> descr:        Mrs Jello LLC
18:26 < MikeSeth> descr:        PO BOX 120
18:26 < MikeSeth> descr:        Livingston NJ
18:26 < MikeSeth> :(
18:26 < marklar> meh
18:27 < MikeSeth> domain:       jewtube.co.il
18:27 < MikeSeth> descr:        Mentser Israel
18:27 < MikeSeth> descr:        Kaanmann  111
18:27 < MikeSeth> COME ON
18:27 < marklar> hahaha
18:27 < marklar> judenet.co.il?
18:27 -!- sean` [n=Sean@213-84-124-85.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #agavi
18:27 < MikeSeth> i still have emails at jointnet.co.il
18:28 < MikeSeth> marklar: http://reddit.com/info/5yrig/comments/c02adqw
18:29 < marklar> haha
18:29 < Wombert> re.co.il?
18:29 < Wombert> :p
18:29 < Wombert> that would be a nice name for a digg like site
18:29 < MikeSeth> Wombert: i dont think you can get two letter ones
18:29 < Wombert> beh
18:30 < Wombert> GOD YOU JEWS ARE SO GREEDY
18:30 < Wombert> xD
18:30  * marklar stabs d.co.il
18:30 < MikeSeth> marklar: HA
18:30 < MikeSeth> bb
18:30 < marklar> give me $20
18:30 < MikeSeth> registrar
18:30 < marklar> :(
18:30 < MikeSeth> how do you want me to do that
18:30 < Wombert> 20 bux is pretty cheap
18:30 < marklar> MikeSeth: fax
18:30 < MikeSeth> i has no fax
18:30 < Wombert> FAX IS SO 1993
18:30 < marklar> no, srsly, I need to get my old domain back
18:31  * marklar contemplates plan
18:31 < MikeSeth> marklar: ask ariq, he has ass wide discounts
18:31 < MikeSeth> (i never paid for metamagi.org :D)
18:31  * Wombert does not want to imagine that
18:31 < marklar> kek
18:31 < marklar> I remember him getting $4 domains
18:31 < MikeSeth> yeah, reseller asshole
18:31 < MikeSeth> he deserves to be married :D
18:32 < marklar> lawlz
18:34 -!- sean`` [n=Sean@213-84-124-85.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #agavi
18:36 < marklar> mike
18:36 < marklar> http://www.tapuz.co.il/tapuzforum/main/Viewmsg.asp?forum=394&msgid=107428708
18:37 -!- sean``` [n=Sean@213-84-124-85.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #agavi
18:40 < MikeSeth> marklar: correct
18:40 < marklar> now to figure out how to get off at the right stop
18:41 < MikeSeth> marklar: you get off at the raanana junction
18:41 -!- sean``` [n=Sean@213-84-124-85.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Client Quit]
18:41 < MikeSeth> right after the open university
18:42 < marklar> say I'm not taking 841
18:42 < marklar> because the schedule sucks
18:42 < MikeSeth> 921/830?
18:42 < marklar> no 921, 830/835
18:42 < MikeSeth> marklar: so raanana jct or nof yam? cuz i have no idea wtf is nof yam
18:43 < marklar> me neither
18:43 < MikeSeth> raanana jct = exit bus, walk towards big sign that says "kfar saba"
18:43 < Wombert> don't you have bloody satnavs?
18:43 < MikeSeth> Wombert: we're poor. I don't have a car. He's still in the army
18:43 < MikeSeth> well, s/poor/lazy/
18:43 < marklar> yea
18:43 < marklar> both atm
18:44 < Wombert> well
18:44  * marklar stabs the army
18:44  * MikeSeth pets the army lovingly
18:44 < Wombert> borrow a HMMV, a gps, and drive in the right direction
18:44 < Wombert> through the desert-or-whatever
18:44 < Wombert> who needs roads!
18:44 < marklar> have you ever driven a hmmv?
18:44 < marklar> heh
18:44 < MikeSeth> Wombert: well its not that complicated, considering that you have to ride a bus in straigh 100km line and then get off
18:44 < marklar> not a pleasant experience
18:44 -!- JamieWolf [i=JamieWol@x482.vpn.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de] has joined #agavi
18:44 < Wombert> he's coming by bus?
18:44 < marklar> at least not the armored ones
18:44 < marklar> yeah
18:44 < MikeSeth> Wombert: he lives up north
18:45 < MikeSeth> waaaay up north
18:45 < Wombert> and how are you gonna bring your things
18:45 < MikeSeth> he's gonna check out the place first
18:45 < MikeSeth> things later kthx
18:45 < marklar> I don't have things
18:45 < marklar> I have, like, a computer and some clothes
18:45 < marklar> what else does a guy need
18:46 < MikeSeth> pron
18:46 < MikeSeth> 4chan is still down :(
18:48 < marklar> peh
18:50 < MikeSeth> marklar: http://encyclopediadramatica.com/The_Caturday_Nap
18:51 < marklar> mike
18:51 < marklar> otobusim says "nof yam -- gesher"
18:51 -!- sean` [n=Sean@213-84-124-85.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Connection timed out]
18:52 < MikeSeth> NFI
18:54 < marklar> ok
18:54 < marklar> it's the one right after wingate
18:54 < MikeSeth> isnt that like super far
18:55 < marklar> around ~30min according to teh internets
18:55 < marklar> so 3hrs total
18:55 < _cheerios> heh heh, you guys
18:56 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: in Israel, 30 min drive IS "super far"
18:57 < marklar> I actually walked twice that for a beret
18:57 < marklar> heh :\
18:58 -!- sean`` [n=Sean@213-84-124-85.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Connection timed out]
18:59 < MikeSeth> i did a 10 km run, nothing special :(
18:59 < marklar> hehe
19:00 < marklar> I think that was the closest I ever came to dying of exertion
19:17 < _cheerios> 10km! CRAZY!
19:18 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: with a 25kg radio transceiver and another 10kg of equipment on my back
19:18 < marklar> of course, "kezev 6"
19:18 < marklar> damn, I hated those words
19:19 < MikeSeth> marklar: we had a completely mad russian guy for CO
19:19 < MikeSeth> marklar: he was from Nahal
19:19 < marklar> was he 4x4 + shaved head + lifted cars for fun?
19:19 < marklar> hehe
19:19 < _cheerios> sounds like the usual
19:20 < _cheerios> + some tattoos + signs of torture
19:20 < marklar> kek
19:20 < marklar> my co was a short, buff guy, but I think he was made of titanium or something
19:20 < marklar> he only broke a sweat after like 40 km
19:22 < MikeSeth> fucker taught us fire field tactics though
19:22 < MikeSeth> i loved the army
19:22 < MikeSeth> ..as much as it is possible to love the army without sounding like a degenerate
19:22 < marklar> +1 
19:23 < _cheerios> you just burnt a doze of karma there
19:23 < marklar> I truly enjoyed blowing shit up in bootcamp
19:23 < marklar> gotta love the eng. corps
19:24 < marklar> 14 weeks, 5 of them dedicated to demolitions
19:25 < marklar> k, night
19:25 < marklar> mike, I'll ring you tomorrow if I'm coming on wednesday
19:26  * marklar &
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20:50 < blackthorne> OMG
20:50 < blackthorne> On TV, in a contest comes the question: "Dividing a number by 10 is the same of multiplying it by...?"
20:51 < blackthorne> she answers: "100"
21:10 -!- blackthorne_ [n=blacktho@unaffiliated/blackthorne] has joined #agavi
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21:34 -!- _cheerios [n=jacklo@cs181068034.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["sleeping with ze bugs()"]
21:43 < Wombert> home =>
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21:52 < splatch`> sleep();
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--- Day changed Tue Oct 23 2007
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00:09 < Wombert> KANT SLEEP
00:09  * Wombert slaps MikeSeth 
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05:37 < v-dogg> huomenta
06:16 < Whisller> hi
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07:17 < Wombert> huomenta
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07:30 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
07:34 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #agavi
07:35 < _cheerios> huomenta!
07:36 < RossC0> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw
07:36 < RossC0> :D
07:41 < Wombert> office =>
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07:58 < _cheerios>  <3 lego videos
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08:28 < Wombert> :>
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09:09 < MikeSeth> why you slap me
09:17 < MikeSeth> huomenta
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09:51 < CIA-29> david * r2152 /branches/0.11/ (CHANGELOG etc/phing/AgaviPackageTask.php src/version.php): RC7 version info
09:52 < MikeSeth> oh boy
09:52 < MikeSeth> it's comiiiiing ;)
09:57 < _cheerios> closing in on a cool RC10 !
10:05 < _cheerios> heh @ google has no tact, http://www.google.com/trends/hottrends?q=stevenson+ranch&date=2007-10-22&sa=X (via reddit)
10:06 < MikeSeth> ahaha
10:13 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to: Welcome to #agavi :: 0.11RC7 is out! :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: KUDOS, KIMI, GO FINLAND!
10:13 < Wombert> enjoy
10:16 < _cheerios> "If no show stoppers appear over the next days, we'll roll 0.11 shortly." a long time coming!
10:18 < Wombert> lunch =>
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10:38 < E_mE> huomenta!
10:39 < MikeSeth> haiii
10:39 < MikeSeth> man, tormentedradio.com pwns :D
10:45 < MikeSeth> Wombert: www.instrictconfidence.com
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11:06 -!- raidman is now known as Arme[N]
11:24 < shoan> just took a sneak peak at the new del.icio.us
11:24 < shoan> I like the old one better :)
11:26 < MikeSeth> yeah it looks like butt now
11:26 < _cheerios> where where?
11:26 < shoan> the bloglines beta is so much nicer
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11:27 < shoan> the new delicious has lost my subscriptions and network
11:27 < shoan> sucks
11:28 < MikeSeth> donno, all these web2.0 things look like a complete fail to me
11:29 < shoan> I agree with you except for bloglines
11:31 < _cheerios> i need to learn that infinite-scoller technique in use by dzone/google reader et all., anyone here done that?
11:37 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: it was just on reddit
11:38 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: http://unspace.ca/discover/pageless/
11:38 < MikeSeth> http://programming.reddit.com/info/5ytn5/comments/
11:40 < _cheerios> i think i was on that blogpage before yawning how someoen could write so long-windedly
11:41 < MikeSeth> ahaahah
11:42 < Wombert> no surprise
11:42 < Wombert> new delicious is built on symfony
11:42 < Wombert> and yahoo had to hack it big time :D
11:46 < MikeSeth> HEH
11:47 < Wombert> this scrolling thing...
11:47 < Wombert> well
11:47 < Wombert> :p
11:47 < Wombert> when the scroll offset is large enough, load the next bunch of entries
11:47 < Wombert> simple? :p
12:01 < shoan> it even looks really ugly
12:01 < Wombert> eww they made the switch?
12:01 < Wombert> ewww
12:02 < Wombert> but shoan sent me a link!
12:02 < Wombert> :>
12:02 < shoan> no
12:02 < shoan> i got access to the closed beta
12:05 < Wombert> the front page looks different already
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12:07 < RossC0> _cheerios: openRico had an infinate scroll stylie
12:07 < RossC0> well it was pagination
12:07 < RossC0> really
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12:07 < _cheerios> the livegrid thing?
12:07 < RossC0> also digitarald had done something simpler
12:07 < RossC0> yup
12:08 < RossC0> http://digitarald.de/playground/grid.html
12:08 < _cheerios> nice
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12:31 < CIA-29> david * r2153 /branches/0.11/src/validator/AgaviDateTimeValidator.class.php: Allow simpler format definitions in DateTime validator, closes #596
12:33 < CIA-29> david * r2154 /branches/0.11/ (CHANGELOG etc/phing/AgaviPackageTask.php src/version.php): changelog and version info
12:34 < Wombert> oops
12:34 < Wombert> forgot to tag rc7 xD
12:36 < CIA-29> david * r2155 /tags/0.11.0RC7/: tagging 0.11.0 RC7 for release
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12:45 < shoan> Wombert: http://shoan.net/tmp/delicious.png
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13:11 < Wombert> eww
13:11 < Wombert> weird
13:11 < Wombert> but I wouldn't call it ugly
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13:53 < _cheerios> nice flash navi https://www.widsets.com/map.html
13:58 < MikeSeth> <fulketerraun> anyone have php script(or whatever) that can tell how many external links i have on certain url
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14:36 < _cheerios> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/tees/7057812.stm << whom knew these oink guys? I remember getting an invitation to their site sometime back from a m8, but never bothered.
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14:46 < _cheerios> ah, found the email; "reply-all, title: anyone i know on this piccy (bbc article)" :)
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14:53 < MikeSeth> excuse me WHAT THE FUCK
14:53 < MikeSeth> http://press.ffii.org/Press_releases/EU_tells_open_source_to_start_paying_MS_patent_tax
14:55 < Wombert> oh fuck the EU
14:55 < Wombert> I'm outta here
14:55 < Wombert> which reminds me, I need to apply for a passport before they introduce fingerprint copies
14:57 < MikeSeth> where'd ya go?
14:58 < Wombert> hmm not sure
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14:58 < Wombert> I'm still eligible for an australian citizenship
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14:59 < _cheerios> australia would be too laid-back for you
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15:03 < MikeSeth> Wombert: you dont want to live in a country where the government deems it fit to pass laws prohibiting internet porn
15:04 < MikeSeth> Wombert: just google for "alston efa"
15:05 < Wombert> _cheerios: would it?
15:05  * Wombert chuckles
15:05 < Wombert> why do you think I don't like things going the laid-back way
15:06 < Wombert> New, proposed amendments to the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act would extend the Government's current powers to censor documents containing information about the activities of the Australian Broadcasting Authority (ABA) and the Office of Film and Literature Classification (OFLC).
15:06 < Wombert> According to the EFA, blocking entire documents will prevent anyone from verifying the accuracy of Government statistics on the censorship regime.
15:06 < Wombert> dude
15:06 < nagaozen> Hi
15:06 < Wombert> hi nagaozen 
15:06 < nagaozen> what linux server you ppl suggest for working with agavi?
15:06 < nagaozen> ubuntu?
15:06 < nagaozen> gentoo?
15:06 < Wombert> uuuh... doesn't really matter ;)
15:07 < Wombert> we run debian, but it's a matter of taste... agavi does not have any requirements in that regard
15:07 < Wombert> maybe the others can help you with that question
15:07 < Wombert> looks at _cheerios, MikeSeth, RossC0, v-dogg
15:07 < nagaozen> debian?
15:07 < nagaozen> its good to run the same as yours cause i can always ask things for you XD
15:07 < nagaozen> ha ha ha
15:08 < nagaozen> thats the reason i'm asking
15:08 < RossC0> nagaozen: run on ubuntu and redhat
15:08 < RossC0> no worries :D
15:08 < nagaozen> ubuntu LTS or the recent 7.10 ?
15:08 < v-dogg> we use debian
15:08 < RossC0> LTS but doesn't overly matter
15:09 < RossC0> I think a new LTS is out soon
15:09 < v-dogg> but just because that's the only distro I know even a little :)
15:09 < nagaozen> the next release is scheduled to 2008
15:09 < MikeSeth> Debian.
15:09 < _cheerios> in run debian
15:09 < MikeSeth> Because It's Your Last Distro Ever (TM)
15:10 < nagaozen> hm... looks like it's far easy to find support using debian XD
15:11 < nagaozen> thank you all
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16:25 < _cheerios> i was not tied to the computer for 1hr20mins. that's a record.
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16:53 < _cheerios> ttj, Higher Ground concert. Join along to feel the message of God?
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17:32 < _cheerios> "At his first trial he had said he mistook the bible she (a nun) was taking out of her bag for a gun."
17:33 -!- Kodeart [i=kodeart@89.185.194.43] has joined #agavi
17:34 < Kodeart> 'evening
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18:39 < Wombert> home =>
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19:06 < _cheerios> Ellen Mason of the British Heart Foundation said: "It is tragic irony that whilst much of the world is starving, many developed countries across the world are in the grips of an obesity crisis.
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20:26  * _cheerios hugs Wombert 
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22:10 < Wombert> nn
22:10 < splatch`> :)
22:11 < splatch`> Wombert: do you got kazek mail?
22:11 < Wombert> yes
22:11 < splatch`> great :)
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--- Log opened Wed Oct 24 08:31:40 2007
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08:31 -!- Irssi: #agavi: Total of 26 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 25 normal]
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08:32 < Chuckwalla> re :>
08:34 < Wombert> lolz? :p
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08:35 < Chuckwalla> i just felt like speaking a word after idling for sooooo long
08:36 < _cheerios> anyone here using cruisecontrol or similar ?
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08:49 < jake> _cheerios, I am
08:58 < Wombert> see, teh jake rocks
08:58 < Wombert> jake: that's good
08:59 < RossC0> lol
08:59 < Wombert> you can help me build teh agavi integration then :>
08:59 < Wombert> anyway
08:59 < Wombert> office =>
08:59 < RossC0> I remember talking about cruisecontrol and CI and I got shot down :/
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08:59 < Wombert> by me?
08:59 < Wombert> bo way
08:59 < Wombert> *no
08:59 < RossC0> yup
08:59 < Wombert> nonono
08:59 < Wombert> maybe I said "not now"
09:00 < _cheerios> hehe RossC0 :)
09:00 < RossC0> man I'm just not as cool as jake!!
09:00 < RossC0> :D
09:01 < Wombert> no seriously
09:01 < Wombert> I didn't say "no, thx, bai", did I
09:01 < Wombert> I guess it was "let's do that for 1.0" or something like that
09:01 < Wombert> right?
09:01 < Wombert> :(
09:01  * Wombert hugs RossC0 
09:02 < RossC0> actually it was Mike!
09:02 < Wombert> aaah that explains it
09:02 < Wombert> I never listen to Mike :>
09:02 < RossC0> lol
09:02 < Wombert> in any case, it's related to that whole testing thing
09:03 < Wombert> which I'll tackle soon on the road to 1.0
09:03 < RossC0> I think the crux of the argument is about calling it a 'build'
09:04 < Wombert> wooot gmail gets imap
09:04 < Wombert> woot woot woot
09:04 < Wombert> woot woot woot
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09:07 < jake> heh, I'm not using it with Agavi today, I'm using CruiseControl with a couple of java projects
09:07 < jake> gmail got imap? Sexy
09:08 < Wombert> but still cannot send mail via smtp right?
09:09 < jake> I'm sure
09:09 < jake> is the IMAP ssl enabled?
09:10 < Wombert> yes
09:10 < Wombert> ace, isn't it
09:10 < Wombert> each label is a folder it seems
09:10 < Wombert> very cool
09:10 < jake> yeah that's what I thought they would do
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09:12 < Wombert> how does that work w/ the trash and other imap accounts
09:12 < Wombert> I wonder
09:12 < Wombert> at least in apple mail
09:12 < Wombert> hmmm
09:12 < Wombert> well need to wait till my gmail is imap enabled anyway
09:12 < Wombert> but... very cool indeed
09:13 < MikeSeth> I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE
09:13 < MikeSeth> I mean
09:13 < MikeSeth> huomenta :D
09:13 < Wombert> hai :)
09:14 < jake> hey, they do support smtp sending
09:16 < Wombert> yeah just realized that
09:17 < jake> heh, awesome
09:22 < E_mE> Huomenta!!
09:34 < Wombert> now, really
09:34 < Wombert> office ->
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09:55 < MikeSeth> marklar: ping
10:10 < lordHelmchen1977> hey! does anyone of you have an example how to use the AgaviOroperatorValidator in registerValidators?
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10:15 < MikeSeth> lordHelmchen1977: mmm
10:15 < MikeSeth> yeah
10:17 < MikeSeth> http://pastebin.ca/747765
10:17 < MikeSeth> (this isn't necessarily a *good* example)
10:18 -!- kaos|work [n=dominik@dialbs-213-023-052-058.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
10:18 < jake> MikeSeth, can you substitute the value with a posted value? I'm thinking of password confirmation
10:19 < MikeSeth> in a validator?
10:19 < jake> yeah
10:19 < jake> I'm thinking like pass1=$val; pass2=$val2; pass1==pass2
10:19 < MikeSeth> in principle you can, though I've never done that before
10:19 < MikeSeth> for example the date validator can enforce date format IIRC
10:19 < kaos|work> just give it multiple arguments
10:20 < kaos|work> <validator class ="equals><argument>pw1</argument><argument>pw2</argument></validator>
10:20 < kaos|work> would compare those 2 params
10:21 < kaos|work> but only some builtin validators support multiple arguments
10:21 < jake> where pw1 could also be fetched as $rd->getParameter('pw1') ?
10:21 < kaos|work> yes
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10:22 < jake> sexy
10:23 < kaos|work> lordHelmchen1977: build what you want in xml and look at the generated php file in app/cache/config
10:25 < lordHelmchen1977> hey! that's the perfect hint! thanks!
10:25 < MikeSeth> :D
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10:53 < JamieWolf> Morning
10:57 < _cheerios> myspace.com/northernkings
10:59 < JamieWolf> not the type of music i listen too :)
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11:46 < jake> that picture is hilarious _cheerios 
11:47 -!- RossC0 [n=lawleyr@80.4.120.163] has joined #agavi
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12:00  * Wombert pokes RossC0 
12:00 < Wombert> no blogging today? :(
12:04 < RossC0> busy busy
12:04 -!- codecop [n=codecop@78-61-128-127.ip.zebra.lt] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
12:04 < RossC0> just starting to read my links!
12:04 < RossC0> :D
12:05 -!- codecop [n=codecop@78-61-128-127.ip.zebra.lt] has joined #agavi
12:06 < RossC0> have posted one!
12:18 -!- epaulin [n=epaulin@219.137.33.48] has quit ["Ex-Chat"]
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12:39 < RossC0> Wombert: I have a unknown follower! :-/
12:39 < Wombert> RossC0: oO
12:39 < Wombert> me? :S
12:40 < RossC0> no: http://junkdrawer.tumblr.com/ and http://luckyluke.tumblr.com/
12:40 < RossC0> I'm famous!
12:40 < RossC0> :-S
12:41 < RossC0> hmm when you reblog it doesnt link back to the original person :<
12:42 < Wombert> yeah
12:44 < shoan> luckyluke is moi
12:52 < RossC0> ah phew
12:52 < RossC0> I like to know my stalkers!
12:55 < shoan> :)
12:57  * MikeSeth pokes marklar 
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13:14 < MikeSeth> Wombert: is there a way to validate attributes in the user object?
13:15 < Wombert> no
13:16 < MikeSeth> should there be one?
13:16 < Wombert> why
13:16 < MikeSeth> Wombert: well, I have a set of actions that should never ever proceed if certain conditions in the user object are unsatisfied
13:16 < MikeSeth> Wombert: this isn't security related
13:17 < Wombert> write a validator that reads the user attributes? :p
13:18 < MikeSeth> yep :D
13:18 < MikeSeth> i was wondering if there's anything architecturally wrong
13:19 < MikeSeth> btw, do xpointer includes work for validator configuration too?
13:19 < Wombert> why wouldn't they
13:22 < MikeSeth> I dont know
13:23 < MikeSeth> I guess I still can't completely comprehend the pwn factor of Agavi ;)
13:26 < Wombert> xincludes are resolved by the xml parser :p
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13:38 < blackthorne> :)
13:39 < blackthorne> i'm sold to the devil
13:39 < blackthorne> asp.net the best!
13:39 < Wombert> what devil
13:39 < Wombert> hah
13:40 < blackthorne> joking :D
13:40  * MikeSeth lights up a torch 
13:40  * MikeSeth hands out pitchforks
13:40 < MikeSeth> we were saying?
13:40 < MikeSeth> :D
13:40 < Wombert> brb, vpn
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14:10 < marklar> hai
14:15 < E_mE> eeekk: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7059881.stm
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14:20 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["moogavicouch()"]
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14:51 < marklar> mike
14:51 < marklar> I'm moving out in 20min
14:52 < marklar> plz2ack
14:56 < Wombert_> I thought in december
14:56 -!- Wombert_ is now known as Wombert
14:56 < Wombert> HAH
14:56 < marklar> moving out as in taking the bus
14:56 < marklar> heh
14:56  * Wombert got another piece of that delicious pastry because kaos doesn't want his
14:56 < Wombert> today is a goooooood dahaahaaayyyyyy
14:56  * Wombert sings
14:56 < marklar> *stab*
14:56 < marklar> :(
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15:24 < _cheerios> :)
15:46 < MikeSeth> marklar: report
15:46 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has quit ["Konversation terminated!"]
15:46 < MikeSeth> omg what a nigra
15:46 < MikeSeth> he went to my place and im not f'ing there
15:48 < _cheerios> *g* http://sata.laif.fi/ "100 naista - 100 naista vuodessa raportti" (=100 women - 100 women in a year report), "My name is Teppo M and this is my projectblog. I'm 37 years-old and and I've slept with a total of three women in all my life"
15:48 < Wombert> there is his trick
15:48 < Wombert> 100 women - 100 women = 0 women in a year
15:49 < Wombert> nasty
15:54 < _cheerios> The writing is witty. I might actually follow this one :)
16:13 < Wombert> zomg why is naming things so difficult
16:13 < Wombert> let's assume I have my custom user implementation
16:13 < Wombert> and I want to have my product name in there
16:14 < Wombert> and I want to have Agavi in each name to avoid collisions down the road
16:14 < Wombert> i.e. not SkittlesUser, but SkittlesAgaviUser
16:14 < Wombert> easy
16:14 < Wombert> but
16:14 < Wombert> SkittlesAgaviBaseAction?
16:14 < Wombert> SkittlesBaseAgaviAction?
16:14 < Wombert> SkittlesAccountBaseAgaviModel?
16:14 < Wombert> SkittlesAccountAgaviBaseModel?
16:14 < Wombert> SkittlesAgaviAccountBaseModel?
16:15 < _cheerios> are you writing a demo app?
16:18 < _cheerios> wouldnt the product name alone ensure no collisions in future?
16:18 < Wombert> yes, but that's not related atm
16:18 < Wombert> no, because you have a database object called "user"
16:19 < Wombert> etc etc
16:19 < Wombert> so I add in "Agavi"
16:19 < Wombert> which keeps me safe
16:19 < Wombert> so now only the order of terms matters
16:21 < kaos|work> SkittlesAccountAgaviBaseModel
16:21 < kaos|work> imho
16:23 < _cheerios> i began naming my classes with project name in front, then switched to a shorthand syntax of that, and now Im wondering why have it there at all choosing to name the class itself by functionality, rather. User vs UserRecord vs UserModel etc.
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16:27 < Wombert> _cheerios: and then you use a 3rd party library that has a "User", too...
16:28 < Wombert> namespaces ftw, but they're not here yet
16:34 < MrJeep> you would name FooAgaviSecurityUser instead of FooSecurityUser ?
16:34 < Wombert> not until two hours ago when I thought about it
16:35 < Wombert> it's a very theoretical problem, but if you call it FooUser, that could mean trouble
16:35 < Wombert> FooAgaviUser is much better IMO
16:36 < MrJeep> I don't see how doing PDropSecurityUser extents AgaviSecurityUser could possibly cause any problems
16:36 < MrJeep> Adding "Agavi" is, imo, overkill
16:37 < MrJeep> unless you have a good example
16:38 < MrJeep> (for personal classes of course)
16:39 < Wombert> it can be an issue for PDropUser
16:39 < Wombert> if you have a table called user
16:39 < Wombert> and your prefix is PDrop
16:39 < Wombert> and you use propel
16:39 < Wombert> then you get a PDropUser
16:39 < MrJeep> yeah, I agree in this case
16:39 < MrJeep> this is why I have a member table :P
16:41 < MrJeep> would'nt it be better to set a different prefix to propel instead ?
16:41 < MrJeep> I don't like the idea of changing the whole app name structure for a library
16:41 < MrJeep> am I wrong ?
16:43 < Wombert> well but you ae not using those names anywhere in your code so...
16:45 < MrJeep> for the factory classes
16:45 < MrJeep> but the same problem may happen with any classes
16:46 < MrJeep> anyway, when I have these troubles, I just try to think of a better name
16:46 < MrJeep> and hope my database won't get a million tables
16:47 < Wombert> ONE HUNDRED BILLION TABLES
16:47 < Wombert> :>
16:48 < MrJeep> lol :P
16:54 < MrJeep> btw, did you download Leopard ?
16:54 < MrJeep> it's on most bittorrent site
16:54 < Wombert> uh
16:54 < Wombert> no
16:54 < Wombert> I'll walk into a store and buy it :p
16:54 < MrJeep> yeah, I would buy it too
16:55 < MrJeep> 120something is pretty cheap
16:55 < MrJeep> but having a mac right now, I would have downloaded it to try it
16:55 < MrJeep> I'm seriously thinking about a mac right now
16:55 < MrJeep> I'm feeling for a change
17:01 < blackthorne> macbook
17:01 < blackthorne> btw, this is very obvious but
17:02 < blackthorne> don't buy a Mac before they ship with Leopard
17:02 < MrJeep> I don't plan to buy a book before next year
17:03 < MrJeep> but thnx for the tip
17:03 < MrJeep> but I'm looking for a workstating
17:03 < MrJeep> a mac pro
17:03 < blackthorne> bad choice
17:03 < MrJeep> I don't like the idea of a laptop as my main computer
17:03 < blackthorne> (imho)
17:03 < Wombert> then get an iMac
17:04 < Wombert> mac pros are sooo expensive
17:04 < blackthorne> yes
17:04 < Wombert> I think I wouldn't ever buy one
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17:04 < blackthorne> i think laptops are becoming by far the best choice for those who don't want to play games (everybody that buys a Mac, basically)
17:05 < blackthorne> they do everything is necessary and their advantages are too great to make any other choice but still not buying a laptop
17:05 < blackthorne> i would go for an iMac
17:07 < MrJeep> like discussed before, I just don't like to put all my eggs in the same nest. If something break, I strongly prefer to just replace the piece myself instead of re-shipping the whole thing and waiting a month
17:08 < MrJeep> If I would buy a laptop
17:08 < MrJeep> i would buy the 17" macbook pro
17:08 < Wombert> well
17:08 < MrJeep> still expensive
17:09 < Wombert> in case of a mac, you bring it to the apple store, they repair it, you come pick it up a couple of days after
17:09 < MrJeep> but I agree for hte common use, (and the use I think I'll do) an Imac would work
17:09 < MrJeep> until it does not work
17:09 < MrJeep> but hte thing wit the imac is the screen
17:10 < MrJeep> screen break, you're screwed
17:10 -!- Arme[N] is now known as Arme[0]
17:10 < MrJeep> imo
17:10 < Wombert> well you can hook up an external monitor :p
17:10 < Wombert> and how often does a screen just "break"
17:10 < MrJeep> I knew you were going to say that
17:10 < Wombert> I'd be more worried about the hard drive
17:11 < MrJeep> can you manually replace the hard drive on an imac ?
17:11 < Wombert> I think so
17:11 < Wombert> on the large ones
17:11 < MrJeep> or add memory
17:11 < Wombert> not sure though
17:11 < Wombert> of course
17:11 < MrJeep> change the processor ?
17:11 < Wombert> come on, that would be ridiculous
17:11 < Wombert> no
17:11 < Wombert> why would you want to
17:11 < Wombert> you use it for a couple of years and then you throw it away :)
17:11 < MrJeep> lol 
17:12 < Wombert> seriously
17:12 < Wombert> the most relaxing thing about using a mac
17:12 < MrJeep> let me give you a good example
17:12 < MrJeep> you buy a macbook, all your stuff is on
17:12 < MrJeep> the mobo break
17:13 < MrJeep> for some reason
17:13 < MrJeep> you need your stuff
17:13 < MrJeep> what do you do, open it, and void your guarantee ?
17:13 < MrJeep> anyway the disk is way too small to fit somewhere else
17:14 < MrJeep> my stuff is stuck on the laptop and I just can't get my data back untill the whole thing is fixed
17:14 < MrJeep> on a tower
17:14 < MrJeep> you take out hte hdd and put it on another computer, copy and I'm ready again
17:15 < MrJeep> this is why I don't really like all-in-one things
17:15 < Wombert> lets say the display breaks on my laptop
17:15 < Wombert> or the keyboard
17:15 < Wombert> or so
17:15 < Wombert> I plug it into another mac with firewire, boot the other mac from the laptops hard drive, done :p
17:15 < Wombert> or just use it as a disk and copy my stuff
17:15 < Wombert> and sure you can plug in all laptop hard drives into a "normal" computer
17:16 < Wombert> if the motherboard breaks on your laptop, then that's bad luck, it is a risk you have to take ;)
17:16 < MrJeep> i guess you need some adapter
17:16 < Wombert> that costs five bucks
17:16 < MrJeep> 5 bucks! too expensive
17:17 < Wombert> if that's too expensive then your data is not important
17:17 < MrJeep> hehe ( i was kidding)
17:17 < Wombert> then you can also wait a month to get your computer back
17:17 < Wombert> let me put this different
17:17 < Wombert> did you ever have a hard drive die on you?
17:17 < MrJeep> yeah
17:17 < Wombert> me too
17:17 < Wombert> okay
17:17 < Wombert> did that happen within two years after purchase?
17:18 < MrJeep> memory too, power supply
17:18 < MrJeep> yeah, it was guarantee
17:18 < Wombert> maybe that's because you didn't buy quality components :p
17:18 < Wombert> MACS DO NOT DIE ON YOU DURING WARRANTY
17:18 < Wombert> JUST THE DAY AFTER!!
17:18 < Wombert> :>
17:18 < MrJeep> this is even worse ! 
17:18 < kaos|work> just like any sony product
17:18 < kaos|work> xD
17:18 < Wombert> I think you take this too seriously
17:18 < Wombert> I wouldn't be so concerned
17:19 < MrJeep> yeah it's possible
17:19 < MrJeep> let'S say you buy a car, how would you like to take your car to the garage for a month when a tire is flat ?
17:19 < MrJeep> it's " "" " almost " "" "" the same thing
17:20 < MrJeep> with a lots of  ""
17:20 < Wombert> you don't
17:20 < Wombert> you bring it to the store
17:20 < Wombert> they repair it
17:20 < Wombert> you get it back
17:20 < Wombert> if you buy cheap laptops like acer, well, then you might need to wait for a month
17:20 < MrJeep> all I know is shit happens, and according to murphee's law, it happens at the worst time
17:22 < MrJeep> from my point of view, a tower is better because you can easily upgrade it, and easily repair it (compared to a laptop or an iMac)
17:22 < MrJeep> and because it heats my room during winter :P
17:23 < MrJeep> but I understand that, for most things, a macbook or an Imac would be okay
17:23 < MrJeep> except if I want to get a larger screen someday
17:23 < MrJeep> or if I need more than 2 screen (less probable but possible)
17:24 < Wombert> you might also want to use it to fly to the moon :p
17:24 < Wombert> you can't have everything
17:24 < Wombert> each decision in life implies a tradeoff
17:24 < Wombert> sometimes you just have to worry less
17:24 < MrJeep> yeah, I prefer to trade money at this point
17:26 < MrJeep> I don't have a lot of expenses, and I'm sure I won't have much for 3 year
17:26 < MrJeep> so I guess I could have some luxury
17:27 < MrJeep> I'll sure think about what you all said, but it's going to be hard to not get a workstation
17:28 < Wombert> :p
17:28 < MrJeep> if I buy a mac, it's far from being done too :P
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17:31 < MrJeep> except the price, what's wrong with a mac pro ?
17:32 < Wombert> the price
17:32 < Wombert> why do you need a 64 core xeon machine with a jet engine and a flux capacitor and... blah
17:32 < Wombert> for web development
17:33 < MrJeep> 2499 to start with, 24" inches imac is 2299
17:33 < Wombert> it is the most affordable workstation you can buy
17:33 < Wombert> beats any comparable pc
17:33 < Wombert> (in fact, macs mostly do)
17:33 < Wombert> but still, do you need it?
17:34 < MrJeep> well, seeing how my sister mac book pro can be slow when she's working with photoshop, i guess a snappy photoshop is one reason
17:35 < Wombert> no
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17:35 < Wombert> that is because she has an old photoshop, compiled on powerpc, and OS X is emulating a powerpc processor
17:35 < MrJeep> she has CS3
17:35 < Wombert> (actually, it's translating the machine code on the fly. that is called "rosetta")
17:36 < Wombert> how much ram does she have
17:36 < MrJeep> 1 gig
17:36 < Wombert> see
17:36 < Wombert> there you have the problem :p
17:37 < MrJeep> possible
17:38 < MrJeep> very possible
17:38 < Wombert> I know it :p
17:38 < Wombert> aks kaos|work 
17:38 < Wombert> *ask
17:39 < kaos|work> oh yeah
17:39 < kaos|work> mac os has some interesting swapping mechanics
17:40 < kaos|work> which makes some programs react rather slowly in some times ,)
17:40 < kaos|work> with 1 gb ram
17:41 < MrJeep> well, photoshop was horrible on my last 3.2 ghz with 2g ram (osx86)
17:41 < MrJeep> but I guess i can't exacly use this example :P
17:44 < kaos|work> <- home
17:44 < Wombert> home ->
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18:04 < _cheerios> http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44195000/jpg/_44195465_seoul_203.jpg ain't that cuuute?
18:04 -!- kaos|work [n=dominik@dialbs-213-023-052-058.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
18:23 < jake> _cheerios, how much data?
18:27 < _cheerios> not entirely the amount of data, but mostly also the redundancy. I've been looking at MogileFS to do this for a long time. The crux would be able to put in/pull out machines at whim (with boxes not even needing to be in the same datacenter), without losing data.
18:27 < jake> Is this for a production system?
18:27 < _cheerios> that's always the goal
18:27 < jake> I would almost certainly use S3
18:28 < _cheerios> it would probably work as a backup back-end, yes
18:28 < jake> I would use it as the primary backend
18:28 < _cheerios> it's not that cheap :)
18:29 < jake> Well, it is if you require true redundancy and availability
18:31 < jake> If you use MogileFS it will appear to cost you less but in the long run will be more expensive due to maintenace, down time, configuration, hardware, etc. If I have any kind of budget at all, I throw everything into S3 these days
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18:34 < _cheerios> for those whom can foot the bill, EC2+S3 are amazing.
18:35 < MrJeep> hey wombert
18:35 < MrJeep> maybe you can help me a little with this
18:35 < MrJeep> I'm currently stuck with the way I'll store the picture for my site
18:35 < MrJeep> option 1 : Database + cache, agavi page to check the permissions and the (if applicable) read the cache and output it
18:36 < MrJeep> option 2 : store all files in public directory under un-predictable path
18:36 < MrJeep> and add .htaccess
18:36 < MrJeep> option 1 is good for security but very bad for server load
18:37 < MrJeep> option 2 is very lite, but less secure if someone can guess the path of a file
18:37 < jake> do not use a db
18:37 < jake> blobs in a db is a crime
18:37 < MrJeep> option 1 uses cache
18:37 < Wombert> MrJeep: for your image hosting service?
18:37 < jake> doesn't matter
18:37 < MrJeep> yeah
18:38 < Wombert> duuuude! don't use database storage!
18:38 < Wombert> you don't even need .htaccess
18:38 < Wombert> no service does it
18:38 < jake> If you go with option 2, just grab the md5 hash of the file
18:38 < Wombert> not even flickr
18:38 < Wombert> no, you need a random id
18:38 < MrJeep> original image are stored in database, so the user can change it in the future
18:38 < jake> then serve it up as like a2/ee/a2eef....jpg
18:38 < Wombert> don't do that MrJeep 
18:38 < jake> you don't need a random id
18:38 < Wombert> store them in the file system
18:38 < MrJeep> 1 min
18:38 < MrJeep> let me explain
18:38 < MrJeep> the image is not read from the database
18:38 < MrJeep> i store it for backup purposes
18:39 < MrJeep> anyway
18:39 < jake> Store the meta data in the db (md5, 'filename', etc) and store the actual images on the file system
18:39 < MrJeep> random id 
18:39 < jake> I've literally handled terabytes of data in that manner, and it's extremely effective
18:39 < MrJeep> ok, sounds good
18:40 < MrJeep> so you suggest I don't even store the image on the database for backup purposes ?
18:40 < jake> no, what's the point? If you use an effective disk layout you'll get redundancy anyhow
18:40 < _cheerios> keep files in the filesystem. the bigger the db gets, the harder it's to manage (backups etc).
18:41 < jake> _cheerios and I were just discussing distributed file stores
18:41 < Wombert> they rock
18:41 < Wombert> :)
18:41 < jake> If you have no money, RAID 10 some drives and there's your redundancy. If you have any cash, go with something like S3
18:42 < jake> I use MogileFS for scratch space, but that's about it
18:42 < _cheerios> (just make sure you monitor bandwidth with S3 :))
18:42 < MrJeep> ok, thanks for your advise :P
18:42 < MrJeep> do you think this kind of website uses a lot of badwith ?
18:42 < MrJeep> if it becomes somewhat popular of course
18:42 < Wombert> uhm
18:42 < Wombert> yes? :p
18:43 < jake> When I was doing it as a hobby it was doing almost 30mb/s of traffic
18:43 < MrJeep> I actually mean a shitload of bandwith
18:43 < jake> well, during peak anyhow
18:43 < Wombert> just some advice, you need to do this fulltime or not at all if you want to make money off it
18:43 < Wombert> it's not somthing you set up and then it runs forever
18:43 < jake> it's hard to compete too. Places like imagshack kind of own the market
18:44 < _cheerios> and so many free 1GB offerings to get anyone to fork over cash
18:44 < jake> free hosting with flickr, image shack, google images, etc
18:44 < jake> yeah, exactly
18:44 < MrJeep> I'm not looking to take over the market
18:44 < MrJeep> but.. you'll see I have some idea that might be good
18:44 < jake> cool
18:44 < MrJeep> might be not but I have to try it
18:44 < jake> Well, I've always liked the planet for hosting startups
18:45 < jake> They give you 2TB of bandwidth in the default package, which is like $200/month
18:45 < MrJeep> in the worst case I have a cool website to put on my resume
18:45 < jake> and to get unmetered 10mb/s it's like an extra $100/month
18:45 < MrJeep> i guess with some ads it's realistic to make 200$ a month
18:46 < MrJeep> in the case I need a 200$/month host
18:46 < jake> I pay $200/month for hosting my stuff today, and it's just like personal web sites
18:46 < MrJeep> ... I've always wondered how much ads can pay
18:46 < MrJeep> anyone knows ?
18:47 < jake> well 
18:47 < jake> We had a site up for a while that was earning around $1k/week
18:47 < MrJeep> oh jeez omfg
18:47 < jake> then the RIAA had it shut down. fuckers.
18:47 < MrJeep> this is damn good
18:47 < MrJeep> ahh lol
18:47 < MrJeep> what was that website ?
18:48 < MrJeep> www.download-porn-music-and-software-for-free.com ?
18:48 < jake> blinks.com
18:48 < jake> er, bleenks.com
18:48 < MrJeep> how much do you think an ad of digg's fontpage may worth ?
18:49 < jake> well, I know how much it was at myspace, which does a lot more traffic than digg
18:50 < MrJeep> how much ?
18:52 < jake> Well, the trouble was with that site, they had so much traffic, it was difficult to monitize all of it
18:52 < jake> You basically paid every time an ad was displayed
18:52 < jake> It was a few pennies
18:53 < jake> since digg uses the ms ad network, you could advertise on there by going through ms
18:53 < MrJeep> oh, I was not looking to advertise on digg
18:54 < MrJeep> I was just wondering how much money it costed to
18:54 < MrJeep> in other words
18:54 < MrJeep> how much money's going into digg creator's pocket
18:54 < jake> on digg it's $15 for like 3k impressions
18:55 < jake> oh, some of it. Digg is full on corporate, they've gotten millions in financing
18:56 < jake> I now kind of hate digg, but not cause of that. They offered me a job with crap pay and crap benefits
18:56 < jake> After that I was like, "go to hell digg, go to hell"
18:56 < MrJeep> (btw, that site's so funny : http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/)
18:56 < MrJeep> :S
19:00 < _cheerios> jake :)
19:00 < _cheerios> i lost interest on digg when they introduced was it v2 or v3? the whole thing wouldnt load on firefox-linux
19:00 < _cheerios> they fixed it a few months later.
19:01 < jake> I've never looked at those, I always consume digg via rss via netvibes
19:01 < MrJeep> well, I like digg :)
19:01 < MrJeep> more that reddit
19:01 < jake> same
19:01 < jake> I like the site, just not the people :)
19:02 < MrJeep> how much did they offered you, if is not too personal
19:03 < jake> I had 4 offers and theirs was by far the worst at $90k plus 16k options
19:03 < MrJeep> jeez 90k
19:03 < MrJeep> it's a load of money !
19:03 < MrJeep> I would take it
19:03 < MrJeep> :D
19:04 < MrJeep> please tell me you're older than 24 
19:04 < jake> I am, but I was making more than $90k when I was 24
19:04 < _cheerios> 16k options = in % what?
19:04 < jake> well, you don't really value options that way. You value options by size of the pool, number of rounds of funding, and a bunch of other stuff :)
19:05 < jake> I estimated the 16k options would, in the absolute best case scenario, be worth about $200k
19:05 < _cheerios> i wasnt after the current value, rather how much they gave you from the total pool.
19:06 < jake> It was like 0.1 - 0.05%
19:06 < _cheerios> that would be quite a bright best case for 0.1 to bid for that much
19:06 < jake> wait, sorry, that's not right
19:06 < jake> in my 'best case' they would get bought for $200 million
19:07 < jake> in any case, I didn't go there :)
19:11 < Wombert> :p
19:12 < Wombert> MrJeep: just mind you that if you focus on image hosting, then there's not much room for ads
19:13 < jake> Wombert, quick q
19:13 < Wombert> and to be able to charge money for it, you need a good infrastructure, and that takes time and manpower, which you don't have
19:13 < MrJeep> i know, but I'm not looking to flood every empty possible space with an ad
19:13 < Wombert> which brings me to the question, MrJeep 
19:13 < Wombert> why not open source the app? :>
19:13 < Wombert> jake: shoot
19:13 < jake> I want to apply a different template based on the HTTP_HOST, what would you recommend?
19:13 < Wombert> do it in the view
19:13 < Wombert> you read the host via $rd
19:13 < Wombert> you need to validate it in order to be able to read it though, mind yoiu
19:13 < jake> Yeah, that's what I did, in the ProjectBaseView
19:14 < Wombert> well you don't, unless you have conidtional or strict validation on
19:14 < Wombert> jake: how did your app porting go anyway
19:14 < jake> uh
19:14 < jake> heh
19:14 < jake> unset_input false
19:15 < jake> shove all logic into views
19:15 < jake> templates were already using smarty
19:15 < Wombert> lawl
19:15 < jake> bam, done
19:15 < jake> now as new projects come I throw out all the old code and write it properly
19:15 < Wombert> I think I need to remove the "unset_input" line from the logs :p
19:15 < jake> haha
19:15 < jake> all the old code is quickly going away anyhow
19:15 < Wombert> migrating old code is pretty easy actually w/ the routing
19:15 < Wombert> yeah I figured
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19:16 < jake> I've already converted all hardcoded links, we're using RBAC, we're using the database 'properly', etc
19:16 < jake> so I did make _some_ improvements, but it's still crap code. Like, all validation done in the view, etc
19:17 < MrJeep> you mean something like creating a wordpress for image hosting ?
19:17 < Wombert> MrJeep: yes
19:17 < MrJeep> didn't think about that
19:17 < MrJeep> you thinks this could be usefull ?
19:17 < Wombert> that's not the question
19:17 < jake> Wombert I wrote an AgaviMysqliDatabase class, you want it?
19:17 < Wombert> jake: aye
19:18 -!- kaos|work [n=dominik@ppp-62-245-160-15.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #agavi
19:18 < Wombert> I'm more concerned about your financial well-being, MrJeep :p
19:18 < jake> k, I'll create a ticket and check it in
19:18 < Wombert> jake: ace
19:18 < Wombert> jake: I'll add that to 1.0 though
19:18 < Wombert> jake: speaking of which, we'll have a CLA, can you have a look at it once I finished it?
19:18 < jake> absolutely
19:18 < Wombert> (and then if you can sign it of course for that and the coming contributions :p)
19:18 < Wombert> cool
19:19 < jake> that's great, I was going to ask you about that
19:19 < jake> I assume CLA == Cross Licensing Agreement?
19:20 < MrJeep> hehe my financial well-being ?
19:20 < MrJeep> how hard can I screw up ?
19:20 < Wombert> Contributor License Agreement
19:20 < Wombert> MrJeep: running such a service costs you money
19:20 < jake> ahh, well, you should consider the CLA I was thinking of too :)
19:20 < Wombert> explain that 
19:21 < jake> the ability to pay to get a version of agavi that is non-LGPL
19:21 < Wombert> doubt that could be done
19:21 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/331 btw
19:21 < jake> why? Forgetting about the ICU and other unicode work
19:21 < Wombert> so many contributions from the past we need to get permission for to monetize it
19:21 < Wombert> plus, the mojavi3 heritage
19:22 < Wombert> maybe agavi2, if there is a point to it
19:22 < Wombert> privmsg btw
19:26 < _cheerios> damn that second last line was scary, out of context.
19:26 < Wombert> haha
19:26  * Wombert hugs _cheerios 
19:28 < Wombert> champions league ->
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20:56 < _cheerios> linux <3
20:57 -!- JanK__ [n=JanK_@muedsl-82-207-220-081.citykom.de] has quit []
20:58 < Wombert> LINUCKS IS TEH SUX
21:01 < _cheerios> :takes long deep breaths:
21:13 < _cheerios> lol @ 1.6% facebook shares for 169mil
21:20 -!- Xylakant [n=fgilcher@obc-r22-325-217-66-62-6.exozet.com] has joined #agavi
21:20 < Xylakant> hi, just wanted to ask a quick question, maybe someone has seen that before
21:21 < Xylakant> i just noticed that an url ending in ?param=value& throws agavi routing severly off balance
21:22 < Xylakant> the trailing ampersand seems to trigger rather nasty behaviour, obviously the base href gets set to some strange value
21:23 < Xylakant> anyone else seen that and can confirm it - if not, i'll whip up a testcase
21:23 < kaos|work> sounds rather strange to me 
21:25 < Xylakant> i was pretty puzzled first as well - it looked like some wrong routing config to me
21:32 < Xylakant> ok, if noone has ever seen it, i'll try to narrow it down
21:32 < Xylakant> thanks
21:33 < Wombert> Xylakant: trailing &s are stripped from the input for that reason
21:33 < Wombert> I think there are test cases for that, too
21:33 < Wombert> just tested, works fine
21:34 < Wombert> web server?
21:34 < _cheerios> not sure what agavi versionn i have, but baseurl disappears if i run a url with /?param=value&
21:34 < Wombert> web server?
21:34 < _cheerios> apache2.2
21:35 < Wombert> okay
21:35 < Wombert> 2tics
21:36 < Xylakant> lighttpd
21:37 < _cheerios> on r2078, fairly recent
21:37 < Xylakant> and baseurl gets set to the current url
21:37 < Wombert> okay thanks
21:37 < Xylakant> but it does not happen with the agavi sample app, so there must be another factor 
21:38 < Wombert> I'll fix that tomorrow
21:38 < Wombert> uh?
21:38 < Wombert> yeah I tested with that
21:38 < Wombert> any encoded stuff or so in the url?
21:38 < _cheerios> seconded on what Xylakant said, I was in / when i tested.
21:38 < Wombert> does it happen in the docroot, but not in subdirs?
21:38 < _cheerios> hmm :p
21:38 < Wombert> can you verify?
21:39 < Xylakant> no encoded stuff in the url, just word characters, digits, a dot and slashes
21:39 < Wombert> okay
21:39 < Wombert> testing in /?
21:39 < Wombert> or in a subdir
21:39 < _cheerios> both have the same symptoms
21:39 < Xylakant> subdir
21:40 < Xylakant> i did not try in '/'
21:40 < Wombert> hm
21:40 < Wombert> but why does it not happen in the sample app
21:40 < Wombert> do you have rewrites in the sample app?
21:40 < Wombert> or index.php
21:40 < Xylakant> it tried with and without
21:41 < Wombert> _cheerios: rewrites or not?
21:41 < Wombert> Xylakant: using the official "agavi way"?
21:41 < _cheerios> rewrites in virtualhost
21:41 < Wombert> with the exact same expressions as in the docs?
21:41 < Wombert> (that is important)
21:41 < Xylakant> and for me, it does not happen in '/', however I get routed to the not found page - which seems wrong as well
21:42 < Wombert> always, or just with the ampersand?
21:42 < Xylakant> uh, i once copied them from there, i'll check
21:42 < Xylakant> only with the ampersand
21:42 < Xylakant> tested with the sample app
21:43 < Xylakant> http://localhost:3000/~fgilcher/AgaviSampleApp/pub/?test=dummy shows the index page
21:43 < Wombert> didn't you say it did _not_ happen with the sample app?
21:43 < Xylakant> while http://localhost:3000/~fgilcher/AgaviSampleApp/pub/?test=dummy& goes to the 404 not found
21:43 < Xylakant> yes, the effect is different
21:43 < Wombert> so it happens with the sample app?
21:43 < Wombert> hm
21:43 < Wombert> and it doesn't happen at all in / ?
21:43  * Wombert is confused
21:44 < Wombert> you mean inthe sample app, you get the 404, and in your app, the base url is broken?
21:44 < Xylakant> ok, once from the beginning
21:44 < Xylakant> the effect is somewhat strange
21:45 < Xylakant> from now on, all in the sample app, I'll check my regexp for the rewrites first
21:46 < _cheerios> sample app has same bugs when i test
21:46 < _cheerios> in /, the http://hello.com becomes http:// and elsewhere it's the current route (eg. http://hello.com/login)
21:47 < Xylakant> i can confirm that as well
21:47 < Xylakant> the bugs are in the sample app as well
21:47 < _cheerios> tested on latest agavi rev
21:47 < Xylakant> and I do have the same regexp as in the cookbook
21:47 < _cheerios> apache 2.2.3
21:47 < Wombert> okay thanks
21:48 < Xylakant> lighttpd-1.4.15 
21:49 < Wombert> okay
21:49 < Xylakant> http://localhost:3000/~fgilcher/AgaviSampleApp/pub/en/?param=value& makes that all generated urls are of the format http://localhost:3000/~fgilcher/AgaviSampleApp/pub/en//en/
21:49 < _cheerios> and, doesn't matter if rewrites or not. both are bugged.
21:49 < Wombert> Xylakant: yup that's because of the base url
21:49 < Wombert> it's actually the prefix that is calculated incorrectly, and as a result, the base href is, too
21:50 < Xylakant> shall I open a ticket?
21:50 -!- MrJeep [n=jeanphil@modemcable175.240-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit []
21:50 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/599
21:50 < Wombert> mmmh that reminds me
21:50 < Xylakant> kk, perfect
21:50 < Xylakant> thanks
21:51 < Wombert> I want a 599GTB Fiorano
21:51 < Wombert> in blue
21:51 < Wombert> to fight boredom
21:51 < _cheerios> :)
21:51 < Xylakant> i want a Buell R1125 fight...
21:52 < Xylakant> a whatever. you don't fight with that...
21:53 < Wombert> :p
21:55 < Xylakant> thanks for helping me track that, good night. 
21:55 < Xylakant> need to get home, Bahnstreik tomorrow :P
21:56 < Xylakant> cu all
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21:56 < Wombert> I can reproduce
21:58 < Wombert> wow
21:58 < Wombert> that is foobard
21:59 < Wombert> first of all, no idea why that happens for non rewrites
22:05 < _cheerios> if it helps anything, ?param=value&amp; works fine
22:06 < _cheerios> this "feature" is a quick way to change a language to gibberish in sample app :)
22:08 < Wombert> _cheerios: I have a fix
22:08 < Wombert> can you test it
22:08 < _cheerios> sure
22:08 < Wombert> webrouting line 106
22:08 < Wombert> 		$qs = (isset($_SERVER['QUERY_STRING']) ? preg_replace('/&$/D', '', $_SERVER['QUERY_STRING']) : '');
22:08 < Wombert> please test rewrites and no rewrites, and docroot and subdir if you could
22:08 < Wombert> that would be great
22:08 < Wombert> thanks man, much appreciated
22:09 < Wombert> apache 1.3 used to strip a trailing ampersand from the query string
22:09 < Wombert> apparently, newer ones don't anymore
22:10 < _cheerios> works for plain, but not rewrites
22:10 < Wombert> okay
22:12 < Wombert> got it, just a second
22:12 < Wombert> can you apply a patch?
22:12 < _cheerios> sure
22:12 < Wombert> awesome
22:14 < Wombert> _cheerios: http://pastie.caboo.se/private/sdzo4teacjgunjayzsmpow
22:14 < Wombert> thanks so much
22:15 < Wombert> jake: would you happen to have an apache 2.0 running? (not 2.2)
22:16 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to: Apache 2.2 (not 2.0) users plz ping Wombert :: 0.11RC7 is out! :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA
22:16 < Wombert> err
22:16  * Wombert sighs
22:16 -!- Wombert changed the topic of #agavi to: Apache 2.0 (not 2.2) users plz ping Wombert :: 0.11RC7 is out! :: http://agavi.org :: http://trac.agavi.org/milestone/0.11 :: want SVN? http://svn.agavi.org/branches/0.11/ :: http://ohloh.net/projects/5907 (rate, stack, review and give kudos!) :: have a question? Just ask, and wait patiently, as patience is the key to happiness :: we're looking for documentation contributors :: logs at http://agavi.org/irclogs/ :: HUOMENTA
22:17 < _cheerios> looking good
22:17 < Wombert> yea?
22:17 < Wombert> ace
22:18 < Wombert> thanks for your help, _cheerios 
22:18 < _cheerios> works on both
22:18 < CIA-29> david * r2156 /branches/0.11/src/routing/AgaviWebRouting.class.php: Fixed routing getting confused by trailing ampersand on certain environments, closes #599
22:18 < Wombert> winner
22:19 < _cheerios> not sure i want to say this, but it occurs if you do & more than once in the end ;)
22:19 < _cheerios> but that's more a tampered url arleady.
22:20 < CIA-29> david * r2157 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: synced changelog
22:21 < Wombert> argh
22:21 < Wombert> of course, you're right
22:22 < _cheerios> nn
22:22 -!- _cheerios [n=jacklo@cs181068034.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["sleep"]
22:23 < CIA-29> david * r2158 /branches/0.11/src/routing/AgaviWebRouting.class.php: also catch multiple trailing ampersands, thanks jussi for spotting this, refs #599
22:59 < jake> Wombert, no, just 2.2
23:00  * jake is having a very strange AgaviSessionStorage issue....
23:02 < Wombert> shoot, jake 
23:03 < jake> I have managed to configure things, somehow, such that I am issued a brand new session every time I load a page
23:03 < jake> heh
23:03 < jake> I just need to take a nap, my 12 hour hack session is becoming unproductive
23:04 < Wombert> well
23:04 < Wombert> I'm about to hit the sack so
23:04 < jake> I know it's something dumb, no worries
23:04 < Wombert> show me the conf
23:05 < jake> the only thing different i did was add <parameter name="session_name">compendium_blog_sid</parameter>
23:05 < jake> for the storage factory config
23:05 < Wombert> no that can't be it
23:05 < Wombert> did you remove the sess cookie in your browser
23:05 < Wombert> or restart it
23:06 < jake> I don't have to do either. Literally, refreshing the page, I get a new cookie
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23:07 < jake> no worries, I'll figure it out in the morning
23:07 < jake> everything was fine until 20 minutes ago, I'll just look at my subversion logs
23:08 < Wombert> good luck
23:09 < jake> it annoys me that the menus for Firefox on Windows and Linux are different
23:11  * jake is changing X-Powered-By to read 'Wombert' instead of 'Agavi'
23:11 < Wombert> that one rocks, doesn't it ;)
23:11 < Wombert> people wanted it default on so... :p
23:11 < Wombert> firefox itself annoys me ;p
23:12 < jake> heh. I like the addons for it
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06:14 < shoan> huomenta
06:35 < Whisller> morning :)
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07:05 < _cheerios> huomenta
07:08 < ttj> Yo.
07:15 < _cheerios> Wombert/kaos: yesterdays ?param=value& issue prompted me to check a few other combinations and, /? /?& /& all lead to odd base url behavior, even with the current patch
07:29 < _cheerios> Wombert/kaos: Possibility to add true/false values to settings.xml? Maybe <setting name="show.ads" type="bool">false</setting>? Currently everything is a string.
07:29 < _cheerios> type="bool/int/string/...", default being string?
07:38 < _cheerios> nm about bool's, just ints become strings.
07:46 < v-dogg> aren't those values evaluated already? (ints and bools)
07:47 < v-dogg> oh, and: huomenta"
07:47 < v-dogg> !
08:03 < _cheerios> <setting>141</setting>,var_dumping gives (string) 141
08:04 < v-dogg> I stand corrected
08:05 < v-dogg> but it works for other configs though
08:05 < v-dogg> e.g. <filter ... enabled="false"
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08:08 < Wombert> _cheerios: multi-ampersands fixed, too
08:08 < Wombert> thanks for spotting this
08:10 < E_mE> huomenta!!! 
08:10 < _cheerios> better to spot before someone goes LOLOL I HACK AGAVI APPENDING & IN THE ENDZ! :D
08:11  * E_mE has to go to dentist in 20 minutes :S  have 2 fillings :'(
08:17 < Wombert> aaah the english and their bad teeth
08:17 < Wombert> xD
08:17 < Wombert> (sorry :p)
08:22 < E_mE> my dentist did a shite job last time... now those two that need work have clapsed :(
08:23 < E_mE> hopefully this densit will be better :)
08:23 < E_mE> but aahhh big needles!
08:23 < E_mE> cya later...
08:23 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@82.152.204.62] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
08:45 < _cheerios> how's this for a provocative article title? http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2007/10/24/notes102407.DTL
08:47 < MikeSeth> mmmmm 
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09:43 < _cheerios> anyone done a job queue with php? FIFO, with one task being run at a time? iirc, scribd had a nice example of this, as on uploads you face a "X tasks in line before you" ajax poller.
09:47 < _cheerios> with a bg process scheduling the jobs cron comes to mind, but it only runs at min. 1min intervals where less would be more desireable.
09:47 < _cheerios> then there is the implementation part, how to tie it into any code
09:52 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: yeah, I did it a couple of times
09:52 < _cheerios> out of the blue i was wondering if serializing an object would work. like always having a dedicated class method, eg. runProcess(), would work; if(Queue::empty()) { $this->runProcess(); // a lengthy process } else { serialize,save job (md5(serialized object)) to DB, return with ajax poller on our md5 hash }. Classes would have to be standalone for this to work...
09:53 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: yeah absolutely. Doctrine does most of this for you btw :D
09:53 < _cheerios> show meh the way oh experienced one
09:56 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: Doctrine ideally maps a PHP object with properties to it's database representation
09:56 < MikeSeth> so you write a Doctrine_Record class that is a strategy pattern
09:56 < MikeSeth> and use doctrine facilities to queue/read/execute code
09:56 < MikeSeth> or you can do it the qmail way
09:57 < MikeSeth> a lot of numbered text files in a filesystem directory, each containing a pseudoscript, a shell script, or PHP code
09:58 < _cheerios> setup classes as Doctrine_Record's that do not have anything to do with a database, to use Doctrine as a scheduler? huh?
09:58 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: no, you use Doctrine as an ORM foundation; it merely persists your objects in the database
09:59 < _cheerios> ah, for that part.
09:59 < MikeSeth> the queueing is really not a problem; you just execute the strategy objects one after another
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10:01 < MikeSeth> by the way doctrine also has nice inheritance features and templating; so you can be comfortable when working with multiple strategies
10:01 < jake> I always shy away from storing anything in 'php format' whether it's a serialized data structure or just php generated code
10:02 < jake> Pretty much everytime I've done one of those things, immediately afterwards someone has needed that data in another language :)
10:02 < MikeSeth> jake: no, it doesn't physically store the serialized object or anything
10:02 < MikeSeth> jake: object's properties are mapped into the database
10:02 < jake> I know, and that's a good approach, I was more replying to _cheerios
10:03 < _cheerios> this is not about long-term storage, jake
10:03 < jake> ORM systems are fine as long as they don't do weird language specific things
10:03 < jake> I would use the amazon queue service ;)
10:04 < MikeSeth> jake: yeah, for big projects, amazon infrastructure is killer
10:04 < jake> I'm poking fun at _cheerios. For two days, every question he's asked, I've been like, "Use amazon" :)
10:05 < MikeSeth> jake: I *do* use amazon ;)
10:05 < jake> yeah, I love S3/EC2. I've been a long time user of both services.
10:05 < MikeSeth> we're using the alexa database to scan competitors and extract comparative stats
10:06 < jake> I forgot Alexa was opened up. I think competitio.us and a bunch of other sites are using them too
10:07 < _cheerios> nothing against amazon today either. i prefer my bills fixed, until i can pay for fluctuating ones
10:07 < MikeSeth> jake: I wonder how legit that is
10:07 < jake> What's that MikeSeth ?
10:07 < MikeSeth> jake: awsp tos prohibits reusing data commercially
10:08 < MikeSeth> we can draw any conclusions from the scans but we can't sell the results
10:08 < MikeSeth> at least it was like that last time I looked
10:08 < jake> oh, hmm. I don't think at least competitio.us is using it 'commercially'. The service is free, and what you get just includes alexa graphs, at least last time I looked, like a year ago
10:09 < MikeSeth> oh
10:11 < jake> Yeah, with how more businesses are moving torwards an ad driven revenue model, a lot of "Not for commercial use" I think becomes grey
10:11 < MikeSeth> we must eat microsoft..
10:12 < jake> heh. With them running ads for Digg and now a stake in Facebook, they're trying to entrench themselves in a way they really haven't before
10:13 < MikeSeth> Digg is a brothel of news
10:13 < MikeSeth> I don't read it anymore
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10:23 < E_mE> £$%^&* dentists!!
10:24 < MikeSeth> HAHAHAHAHA
10:24 < MikeSeth> you actually have a pound character on your keyboard
10:24 < MikeSeth> it shows up when you are tapping mad ;)
10:25 < E_mE> of course... what do you have rupels or something?
10:26 < E_mE> went there expecting a couple of fillings ended up getting a mirror round my teeth, xray and then sent off to come back in 2 weeks!! £%$%&*
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10:40 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, what's the benefit over the added complexity of managing not only the Doctrine_Records, pumping them with the correct data (I assume they are used only as attribute holders) but having them also synced with the original objects state?
10:45 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: in simplest case, the objects' state including relationships with other objects IS represented by its attributes. In your case, you dont really need database specific features, just state persistence, and Doctrine is good at it. The benefit is that you write *much* less code and that it is *much* cleaner than if you were to do persistence with e.g. MDB2
10:45 < MikeSeth> you can implement queueing in literally 5-10 lines of code
10:48 < _cheerios> and, against storing the serialized object on the filesystem, when no schemas/db-interaction needed at all (beyond storing a pointer to the object)?
10:51 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: probably more code, but better performance, easier to debug, easier to implement radically different strategies
10:51 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I usually discover that after I've created a queue additional conditions to execution must be applied (e.g. some items must be always processed before others etc) so the queue stops being a true fifo
10:52 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dslb-088-064-090-214.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
10:57 < _cheerios> i have mixed feelings about your arguments.
10:58 < Wombert> re
10:58 < Wombert> friggen wifi
10:58 < Wombert> anyway
10:58 < Wombert> careful bout amazon's services
10:58 < Wombert> they only recently introduced an SLA
10:58 < Wombert> and it's just 99% (!!!!)
10:58 < Wombert> and you only get "credits" in case of breach
10:59 < Wombert> also, _cheerios, why not have a deamon that works through the queue and pings the application once it's done?
11:03 < _cheerios> um, that was already envisioned on the initial setup
11:06 < Wombert> easiest is to dispatch a task to it and give it the url to call when finished
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11:23 < v-dogg> was it so that I couldn't set get params in a routing cb?
11:24 < Wombert> you can now I think, v-dogg 
11:24 < Wombert> there was a bug
11:25 < Wombert> you mean for gen(), right?
11:26 < Wombert> nah doesn't work
11:26 < Wombert> still a bug then
11:26 < v-dogg> yup, but the bug (at least the one I reported) was about optional routing parameters
11:26 < Wombert> but gotta see if we can fix that
11:26 < Wombert> I believe it's gonna be difficult
11:28 < Wombert> very difficult actually
11:30 < v-dogg> where are additional params appended to the url?
11:31 < v-dogg> ah, webrouting:265 // get the parameters which are not defined in this route an append them as query string
11:33 -!- Arme[N] [n=Arme[N]@unaffiliated/armen/x-394205] has quit ["leaving"]
11:34 < _cheerios> eek, 250M sessions in db. need to clear that more often.
11:36 < Wombert> yes, v-dogg, but they're coming from the callback
11:40 < v-dogg> you mean they don't come from the callback? 
11:40 < v-dogg> but only originally given parameters are used (minus the parameter which were already used)
11:52 < Wombert> you
11:52 < Wombert> you#re setting the get params in the callback, right?
11:52 < v-dogg> I was hoping to, but now I see it's not going to happen :)
11:53 < Wombert> well hang in there
11:55 < Wombert> routing line 646
11:55 < Wombert> not sure why that is done there
11:55 < Wombert> ah I see it
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11:57 < v-dogg> but only parameters given to gen() are looped and appended as query string (webrouting lines 266-271)
11:59 < Wombert> yes
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11:59 < Wombert> I have a fix but I need to ask dominik if there is a reason why they are filtered out
12:06 < Wombert> v-dogg: err...
12:06 < Wombert> v-dogg: okay
12:06 < Wombert> v-dogg: it can't be done
12:06 < Wombert> :/
12:06 < Wombert> but I think we can extend it without bc breaks
12:08 < Wombert> yay
12:08 < Wombert> got it :>
12:09 < Wombert> now on to some testing
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12:10 < Wombert> v-dogg: okay got it. I just need to make sure it doesn't break anything else
12:11 < marklar> mike
12:11 < marklar> http://www.f5.com/products/big-ip/
12:11 < Wombert> I'll check in later, but I need to ask you to test it thoroughly, or else we need to run an RC8 to be safe :p
12:12 < v-dogg> great power comes with great responsibility
12:12 < marklar> spicy food comes with great rectal burning
12:12 < Wombert> marklar: spare us the details please
12:12 -!- Spica [n=miikka@thule.yok.utu.fi] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
12:13 < Wombert> in any case
12:13 < marklar> :P
12:13 < Wombert> I've been wanting to go to the office for houuuuurs
12:13 < Wombert> and always held up by stupid work stuff
12:13 < Wombert> working from home is uncool, however
12:13 < Wombert> therefor
12:13 < Wombert> ->
12:14 < v-dogg> wtf, either tortoise or winmerge just ass-raped my working copy
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12:33 < v-dogg> there, penetration reverted
12:43 < v-dogg>  Strict standards: Only variables should be passed by reference in ....\libs\agavi\storage\AgaviPdoSessionStorage.class.php on line 318
12:43 < v-dogg> $stmt->bindParam(':time', date($this->getParameter('date_format', 'U')));
12:44 < v-dogg> kaos|work: should I change that to bindValue?
12:45 < kaos|work> yeah
12:45 < v-dogg> I'm on it
12:52 < CIA-29> v-dogg * r2159 /branches/0.11/src/storage/AgaviPdoSessionStorage.class.php: Strict standards fix. Closes #600.
13:02 < v-dogg> what special chars are allowed in an url?
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13:14 < Wombert> v-dogg: okay looks good
13:15 < Wombert> will commit in a bit
13:28 -!- RossC0 [n=RossC0@80.4.120.163] has joined #agavi
13:28 < RossC0> Huomenta!
13:28 < Wombert> man RossC0 you seem to be in big stress lately
13:28 < Wombert> hope you're fine
13:28 < Wombert> and welcome
13:28  * Wombert hugs RossC0 
13:29 < RossC0> eh?
13:29 < Wombert> not?
13:29 < Wombert> :(
13:29 < RossC0> busy busy
13:29 < RossC0> :D
13:29 < Wombert> not online so often, not talking so much, not blogging
13:29 < Wombert> see!
13:29 < Wombert> :>
13:29 < RossC0> ah just installed linux
13:29 < Wombert> zomg!
13:29 < RossC0> so still setting stuff up
13:29 < Wombert> yes, and for the next three months
13:29 < RossC0> well with windows this old PC was dead
13:29 < Wombert> and then you need to install some app which needs some new library version and then you can throw everything away
13:30 < RossC0> Wombert: I am linux desktop master
13:31 < RossC0> I have KDE3 and KDE4 compiz all the bling
13:31 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dialbs-213-023-052-058.static.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
13:31 < RossC0> zomg Mac's eh Wombert ;p
13:32 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dialbs-213-023-052-058.static.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
13:33 < Wombert> re
13:33 < Wombert> wanna know what happened? :p
13:33 < Wombert> my mac froze :p
13:33 < Wombert> just like that :P
13:33 < Wombert> boooh
13:33 < RossC0> (14:33:32) RossC0: zomg Mac's eh Wombert ;p
13:33 < RossC0> lol
13:33 < RossC0> :D
13:33 < _cheerios> heh
13:33 < Wombert> pff
13:33 < Wombert> THEY ROCK
13:34 < Wombert> AND I'M GONNA WEAR A STEVE JOBS TSHIRT TONIGHT WHEN I QUEUE FOR LEOPARD AT TEH APPLE STORE IN TRUE FANBOI FAHSION
13:34 < RossC0> Wombert: I know I have one at home!!
13:34 < Wombert> zomg zomg 26 hours left!
13:34 < Wombert> :>>>
13:34 < RossC0> ZOMG U LUV STEVIE JOBBY
13:34 < Wombert> YES
13:34 < RossC0> I cancelled my order
13:34 < Wombert> seriously, guys, anyone have an apache 2.0 install
13:35 < Wombert> RossC0: why
13:35 < RossC0> well ££
13:35 < Wombert> as far as I can tell, it's really, really good
13:35  * RossC0 saving for a mac & PS3
13:35 < RossC0> :D
13:35 < Wombert> RossC0: did you see that on my blog
13:35 < RossC0> maybe next month
13:35 < Wombert> about GT5
13:35 < RossC0> no..
13:35 < Wombert> ZOMG!
13:35  * RossC0 goes to ze blog
13:36 < Wombert> well I wanted to wait for a month and 10.5.1 or so to be sure all uncool bugs are ironed out
13:36 < Wombert> but my mac freezes so often recently :/
13:36 < Wombert> hope it's not a hardware defect
13:36 < RossC0> Wombert: its cause of the move
13:36 < Wombert> what move
13:36 < RossC0> move and it'll probably work
13:36 < RossC0> to leopard
13:36 < Wombert> lawl
13:36 < RossC0> I have funky stuff on my mac - i.e. iLife 08
13:36 < Wombert> :>
13:37 < Wombert> does that come with leopard?
13:37 < Wombert> zomg I need to buy iLife? haha no fucking way
13:37 < RossC0> zomg
13:37 < RossC0> n00b
13:37 < Wombert> I only need iTunes, really
13:38 < RossC0> no I bought that and things borked like iPhoto iMovies etc..
13:38 < RossC0> I reckon its because it is ready for leopard really
13:38 < Wombert> that would be retarded
13:38 < RossC0> I mean all my cameras movies break iPhoto - I mean come on!
13:38 < Wombert> zomg
13:38 < RossC0> crappy mac devs
13:40 < RossC0> that video is a GAME??
13:40 < Wombert> noooo
13:40 < Wombert> zomg
13:40 < Wombert> scroll down
13:40 < RossC0> few
13:40 < Wombert> but gt5 is gonna look like that :p
13:40 < RossC0> zomg lol
13:40 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/16988877 this
13:40  * RossC0 uber n00b
13:41 < Wombert> and check out ze couchdb joins
13:41 < Wombert> <3 couchdb
13:41 < RossC0> ah delicious'd it this morning
13:41 < jake> Wombert, do you have a working couchdb instance somewhere?
13:42 < jake> Their demo is the suck
13:42 < Wombert> jake: yeah
13:42 < Wombert> download and compiled
13:42 < Wombert> pretty easy
13:43 < jake> damn it. effort?!? I'm an American, screw that. I demand a working demo!
13:43 < Wombert> THEN ASK THE GOVERNMENT YOU STUPID LIBERAL TREE HUGGING COMMUNIST
13:43 < Wombert> :>>
13:44 < jake> haha
13:44 < Wombert> MAYBE AL GORE WILL COMPILE IT FOR YOU
13:44 < jake> well, he did invent the internet
13:45 < jake> If he can master the complexities of routing protocols, TCP/IP, etc, I'm sure he can run 'make' for me
13:47 < shoan> was that guy the internet plumber?
13:47 < Wombert> no
13:47 < Wombert> but I was about to say
13:48 < jake> you mean the tubes guy?
13:48 < Wombert> that governor
13:48 < jake> That's Sen Stevens', one of our brilliant representatives
13:48 < Wombert> yes
13:48 < Wombert> :>
13:48 < Wombert> he invented the tubes
13:48 < jake> I didn't vote for him, don't blame me
13:49 < Wombert> see http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14097755 :p
13:50 < jake> haha, that rocks
13:50 < jake> can you have two routes with the same pattern?
13:50 < Wombert> you can even buy cups with that stuff
13:51 < Wombert> jake: ah yes but why? :p
13:51 < Wombert> of course you can
13:51 < jake> heh
13:51 < Wombert> you could also use a callback to decide if they should match at all :p
13:51 < jake> Well, I need a routing callback that will match one of them if my system knows the HTTP_HOST and the other if it doesn't
13:51 < Wombert> aaah
13:51 < Wombert> hehe
13:51 < Wombert> you could also use a source for that
13:51 < jake> well, the HTTP_HOST is db driven
13:52 < Wombert> okay
13:52 < Wombert> still
13:52 < Wombert> use a source
13:52 < Wombert> :>
13:52 < jake> different layouts are applied based on the HTTP_HOST
13:52 < Wombert> and a callback, ofc
13:52 < jake> well, different layouts are applied but also slightly different routing rules for ^/$
13:52 < jake> cool, I'll check out sources
13:53 < Wombert> <route name="foo" pattern="^lolz.myservice.com$" source="_SERVER[HTTP_HOST]" ... />
13:53 < _cheerios> that VW Golf W12 from the CAR pics link on your blog W, looks quite wicked
13:53 < Wombert> mind you though, once a route matched, and it has children, there is no getting out of it anymore
13:53 < jake> sure
13:53 < Wombert> _cheerios: it's still a golf
13:53 < jake> Yeah, I've got some sick routes in place now. The guys who designed the original system were asshats
13:53 < Wombert> jake: unlike routes w/ no children where you can have a stop="false" to continue on a match
13:53 < Wombert> haha
13:53 < Wombert> well put
13:54 < jake> heh
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14:02 < MikeSeth> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
14:02 < MikeSeth> guys
14:03 < MikeSeth> this is the URL 
14:03 < MikeSeth> http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=1282579&size=L&width=1200&height=899&sok=JURER%20%20%28qngrfgnzc%20%3E%20qngr_fho%28ABJ%28%29%2C%20VAGREINY%2024%20UBHE%29%29%20%20BEQRE%20OL%20ivrjf%20qrfp&photo_nr=3
14:03 < MikeSeth> it was posted like that on reddit
14:03 < MikeSeth> look what happens when you run it through rot13
14:03 < MikeSeth> uggc://jjj.nveyvaref.arg/bcra.svyr?vq=1282579&fvmr=Y&jvqgu=1200&urvtug=899&fbx=WHERE  (datestamp > date_sub(NOW(), INTERVAL 24 HOUR))  ORDER BY views desc&cubgb_ae=3
14:03 < MikeSeth> ahahahahahhaha
14:04 < Wombert> laawl
14:04 < Wombert> well they should have rot13ed it twice then
14:04 < Wombert> to make it really safe
14:04 < _cheerios> huh huh
14:08 < jake> that's awesome
14:08 < jake> Wombert, stop only applies on a successful match right?
14:08 < Wombert> jake: correct
14:08 < Wombert> stop="false" prevents stopping on match
14:08 < Wombert> mind you though
14:08 < Wombert> in your callback, you return true or false
14:09 < Wombert> to indicate success or failure
14:09 < jake> oh, true
14:09 < jake> heh
14:09 < Wombert> that way, even if the pattern matched, you can still tell agavi whether or not to consider the route as matched
14:09 < jake> and imply?
14:09 < Wombert> in other news, gmail has IMAP IDLE support, and leopard's Mail is apparently getting that, too, and my ISP just upgraded their servers, mmmh good good
14:10 < Wombert> imply means that the route is always included when you generate, even if you don't explicitly list it
14:10 < jake> ok
14:10 < jake> and the d-word?
14:10 < Wombert> mind you...
14:10 < Wombert> <route name="rss" pattern="/rss$" stop="false" cut="true" ... />
14:10 < Wombert> <route name="foo" pattern="^/bar$" ... />
14:10 < Wombert> $ro->gen('foo+rss');
14:10 < Wombert> yields "/foo/rss"
14:10 < Wombert> d-what?
14:10 < jake> Documentation!
14:11 < Wombert> well you still have an svn account :p
14:11 < jake> haha, nice
14:11 < jake> which reminds me, I need to add the Mysqli stuff today
14:11 < Wombert> no, seriously, we'll get to that soon
14:11 < Wombert> I can sync trunk for ya
14:11 < Wombert> (not into 0.11 anymore please)
14:12 < jake> I know. It would be nice if the documentation was in wiki format, there are a lot of comments I'd like to make but not actually commit
14:12 < Wombert> yes
14:12 < Wombert> but wikis suck
14:12 < jake> I really like the codehaus documentation system
14:12 < Wombert> we'll have something like www.djangobook.com
14:12 < Wombert> w/ the comments
14:12 < Wombert> and I think I'll build it on couchdb this weekend
14:13 < Wombert> (just occured to me :p)
14:13 < jake> awesome
14:13  * Wombert ponders
14:13 < Wombert> dude!
14:14 < Wombert> hah
14:14 < jake> dude?
14:14 < Wombert> we make it docbook
14:14 < Wombert> rendered live w/ an xsl
14:14 < Wombert> aaah that will rock
14:14 < marklar> mike
14:14  * Wombert slaps MikeSeth 
14:14 < jake> as long as you can add comments that's fine by me
14:14 < Wombert> that way, his computer bleeps, marklar :p
14:14 < Wombert> jake: it's gonna be better, much better
14:14 < Wombert> OOOOH MAN :> hahahah :> ace ace ace
14:15 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
14:15 < MikeSeth> mmm?
14:16 < MikeSeth> you want client-side rendering?
14:16 < Wombert> bo
14:16 < Wombert> no
14:17 < Wombert> the ace thing is
14:17 < Wombert> the comments are a property of the document
14:17 < Wombert> and
14:17 < Wombert> couch versions
14:17 < Wombert> so when you submit a change, you can say "this and this comment is resolved by this change"
14:17 < Wombert> and then the comments are left out when saving
14:17 < Wombert> WOOT WOOT WOOT
14:17 < Wombert> :>
14:17 < Wombert> still need to think about the details, but this is gonna rock
14:17 < marklar> MIKE
14:17 < MikeSeth> DO WANT
14:17  * Wombert slaps MikeSeth 
14:17 < Wombert> LISTEN TO THE MARKLAR
14:18 < jake> Wombert, you want me to commit this to trunk?
14:18 < Wombert> jake: mh yeah I guess
14:18 < Wombert> my suggestion is that you call it mycustommysqlidatabase
14:18 < jake> mmk
14:18 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I've set him up with a job in a very large, bery serious financial organization where he shall begin agavi propaganda
14:19 < jake> I called it AgaviMysqliDatabase
14:19 < Wombert> yes yes
14:19 < Wombert> but
14:19 < Wombert> one day you update agavi and then
14:19 < Wombert> tadaa
14:19 < Wombert> well it's not gonna break (autoload ftw), but still
14:19 < jake> oh, sure. I'm going to call my local one mycustommysqlidatabase :)
14:19 < Wombert> jake: coding standards please, and no commit w/o ticket
14:19 < Wombert> yes exactly
14:20 < MikeSeth> Wombert: are you going to commit the couch adapter?
14:20 < Wombert> MikeSeth: no
14:20 < Wombert> that's a spin-off project and I need to finish it first
14:20 < Wombert> but I can't be arsed atm because
14:20 < MikeSeth> aight
14:20 < Wombert> did I tell you bout my problems w/ file_get_contents?
14:21 < MikeSeth> um no
14:21 < Wombert> agavi will get an adapter for that spinoff project though
14:21 < Wombert> well
14:21 < Wombert> file_get_contents(...)
14:21 < MikeSeth> something with stream handling and http 201?
14:21 < Wombert> yes
14:21 < Wombert> that
14:21 < Wombert> SO UNCOOL ZOMG
14:21 < MikeSeth> yeah, fail
14:21 < MikeSeth> patch it up :(
14:21 < Wombert> I really need to use fsockopen
14:21 < Wombert> and do the whole http communication myself
14:21 < Wombert> I mean, that is SO FUCKED UP
14:21 < MikeSeth> what for? use curl
14:21 < Wombert> then people need curl
14:22 < MikeSeth> ah um
14:22 < MikeSeth> yeah.. fsockopen it is then
14:22 < jake> hmm, how do you feel about me just adding a 'type' flag to the existing Mysql one? Where type defaults to mysql but could also be mysqli
14:22 < Wombert> jake: hmm
14:22 < jake> The only changes I had to make to the existing code were the connection and close parameters
14:22 < jake> It even extends the existing class
14:23 < Wombert> oh?
14:23 < Wombert> so just two methods?
14:23 < jake> yep
14:24 < Wombert> well then we don't need to test it or do we
14:24 < jake> and they're almost identical (the methods)
14:24 < jake> well, I'm already using it in production, so it better work :)
14:24 < marklar> wow
14:25 < Wombert> okay butz
14:25 < marklar> f5 training is $
14:25 < marklar> :(
14:25 < Wombert> what about OO style, jake 
14:25 < jake> oh yeah, big money
14:25 < Wombert> f5?
14:25 < jake> Wombert the only difference is that instead of mysql_open you do new mysqli
14:25 < jake> and instead of mysql_close you do connection->close()
14:25 < Wombert> jake: then lets have a mysqlidatabase extends mysqldatabase
14:25 < MikeSeth> Wombert: it's an exotic load balancer
14:25 < Wombert> w/ a type attribute
14:25 < Wombert> or... style
14:26 < Wombert> default "procedural" or so
14:26 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has joined #agavi
14:26 < jake> yeah, it does seem weird, since one is an OO interface and one is a procedural one
14:27 < Wombert> can you grab the resource from a mysqli object?
14:27 < jake> yeah, I currently just do $this->getContext()->getDatabaseConnection()->query($sql) or whatever
14:27 < marklar> Wombert: www.f5.com
14:27 < Wombert> jake: and from the mysql object
14:28 < Wombert> can you call... getResource() to grab the mysqli resource
14:28 < Wombert> so you can do mysqli_query('...', $mysqli->getResource());
14:28 < Wombert> or can you use $mysqli there
14:28 < jake> yeah, because $this->resource =& $this->connection
14:28 < jake> so yes
14:29 < Wombert> no I mean does mysqli allow that
14:29 < jake> oh, yes
14:29 < Wombert> how
14:29 < Wombert> can you pass the object to procedural calls?
14:30 < jake> mysqli_query($mysqli->getResource(), "QUERY")
14:30 < jake> yeah
14:30 < Wombert> so resource === connection then
14:30 < Wombert> getResourhce() ?
14:30 < jake> yes
14:30 < Wombert> does it have that
14:30 < Wombert> I didn't see that
14:30 < Wombert> I mean just mysqli now, w/o any agavi stuff
14:30 < jake> not sure what you mean. Yes, mysqli has a procedural interface where you can pass in a $mysqli instance. And yes, resource === connection
14:31 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["gooooooodDay......andHelloToYou()"]
14:31 < Wombert> http://php.net/manual/en/function.mysqli-real-connect.php
14:31 < Wombert> hmmm
14:31 < ttj> mysqli-fake-connect
14:32 < Wombert> so $mysqli->init() returns a mysqli resource?
14:32 < jake> Right now, all I do is $this->connection = new mysqli. $this->resource =& $this->connection. And you can use either the procedural or the oo interface with getResource()
14:33 < Wombert> but what does http://de3.php.net/manual/en/function.mysqli-init.php do then
14:33 < jake> I have no freakin' clue
14:33 < jake> I use connect
14:34 < jake> which seems to be what everyone else uses too
14:35 < Wombert> I wonder if init() returns the resource
14:35 < Wombert> then we could assign that to $this->resource
14:35 < Wombert> also, do we use connect or real_connect? :p
14:36 < jake> heh, I use connect, and I assign connect to resource, and all seems to be well. I'll do some googling and see if I can out what the difference is
14:36 < Wombert> I just want to have it 100% perfect, you know ;)
14:37 < jake> well, real_connect is the right way to go then
14:37 < jake> because it takes mysqli_options
14:37 < Wombert> http://de3.php.net/manual/en/function.mysqli-connect.php hmmm
14:37 < Wombert> seems new Mysqli() connects right away
14:37 < Wombert> so init() would make an obj, but not connect
14:37 < Wombert> prolly a static method
14:37 < Wombert> interesting
14:38 < Wombert> how nice of them to document that
14:39 < jake> well, AgaviDatabase::connect isn't called when the object is initialized right?
14:40 < Wombert> no
14:40 < jake> then it doesn't matter if we use connect or real_connect
14:40 < jake> except for specifying options
14:40 < jake> The options would be nice because you can do things like add ssl parameters and such
14:41 < Wombert> sweet
14:41 < Wombert> so
14:41 < Wombert> let's leave that for 1.0
14:41 < Wombert> it need testing and such ;)
14:41 < jake> okay, then do you want me to commit as is, or make some improvements and then commit to trunk?
14:42 < Wombert> if I understand it right, though, it doesn't matter if we invoke it procedural or OO style, you can always use it either way no matter what
14:42 < jake> that's right
14:43 < Wombert> jake: create a ticket "Add AgaviMysqliDatabase", then check in what you have with "... refs #ticketno" in the message (to trunk), and annotate the ticket with the work that's left to be done
14:43 < jake> okay, sounds good. it's ticket 601
14:43 < Whisller> hmm
14:44 < Wombert> okay jake give me two minutes to merge changes to trunk
14:44 < jake> Whisller weighs in?
14:44 < jake> cool
14:45 < Whisller> jake ?
14:46 < Wombert> Whisller: he thought you were about to say something about this mysqli stuff
14:46 < jake> ^^
14:46 < Whisller> no 
14:46 < Whisller> today we show milestone
14:47 < Whisller> and I think is good
14:47 < Wombert> agavi powah!
14:47 < Whisller> this application is without agavi
14:47 < Whisller> and this sucks
14:47 < jake> heh
14:48 < Whisller> really
14:48 < Whisller> it is big problem in this company
14:48 < Whisller> they don't want agavi ;p
14:48 < jake> you should quit, that's what I did
14:48 < jake> "No agavi? Fuck you then, I'm out"
14:49 < Whisller> jake it isn't that simple :P
14:49 < Whisller> Company is really good
14:49 < jake> I'm mostly joking. Wombert got a pastebin I can show you something at?
14:50 < Whisller> but why without agavi why ....
14:50 < jake> Wombert: http://pastebin.ca/749205
14:51 < jake> I think I can do that in one route, the problem is the \S+ gobbles up the '/'
14:51 < jake> and I can't remember how to specify, "Stop matching at the first / you see" with a regex
14:51 < Whisller> hmm in this week  they give us The Witcher, I'm curious is it that good like everyone are saing
14:52 < CIA-29> david * r2160 /branches/0.11/src/routing/ (AgaviRouting.class.php AgaviWebRouting.class.php): Routing callbacks can now set additional arguments that are not in the pattern (e.g. extra query args), closes #602
14:54 < CIA-29> david * r2161 /trunk/ (12 files in 10 dirs): merging in changes from branches/0.11, [2145:2160]
14:55 < Wombert> jake: uh that .php thing
14:55 < Wombert> what is that
14:55 < Wombert> can you give me example urls
14:56 < Wombert> jake: why not (blog_token:[^/]+)
14:56 < Wombert> ?
14:56 < Wombert> or actually
14:56 < Wombert> why don't you make some of those args optional
14:56 < jake> I did, but the blog_token would gobble everything when they were optional
14:57 < Wombert> it's too greedy
14:57 < Wombert> don't think \S is appropriate there
14:57 < jake> Yeah, [^/]+ would be okay
14:57 < jake> then use optionals
14:57 < Wombert> problem with optionals is
14:57 < Wombert> if you have two of them
14:58 < Wombert> you can have a url with the second, but not the first
14:58 < Wombert> and it still matches
14:58 < Wombert> you can work around that with ugly lookbehind assertions but still...
14:58 < jake> Yep, which is why you see several rules there, longest -> shortest
14:58 < jake> What I have works, I just know it's not elegant 
14:59 < Wombert> yup
15:00 < jake> but I think the regex might actually become difficult to maintain, so I may just leave it as is
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15:05 < jake> oh nice, I can modify the request data holder in a routing callback, yes?
15:10 < MikeSeth> jake: global request object is used to pass data back and forth
15:11  * Wombert smacks MikeSeth 
15:11 < Wombert> that was noot his question :p
15:11 < Wombert> jake: yes, you can
15:11 < Wombert> but mind you, your stuff might be overwritten by later routes
15:12 < Wombert> jake: what are you doing anyway :p
15:12 < jake> haha, breaking stuff left and right I guess
15:12 < Wombert> nah :p
15:12 < Wombert> if you just want to modify the params that matched
15:12 < Wombert> you can use the argument itself
15:12 < Wombert> array &$parameters
15:13 < jake> really just trying to get my head around all the moving parts. I'm actually just using getRequest()->setAttribute but in looking at getRequestData I noticed that it isn't locked during framework initialization
15:13 < Wombert> yes
15:13 < Wombert> but remember
15:13 < Wombert> $container (you get that in the callback) is the first container that _might_ run
15:13 < Wombert> so setting it there is probably not safe
15:13 < Wombert> you likely need $this->context->getRequest()->getRequestData()
15:14 < jake> true
15:14 < jake> If I override initialize() in the container, and do $context->getRequest()->setAttribute(), is that safe?
15:14 < Wombert> totally
15:14 < Wombert> only request data access is forbidden
15:15 < jake> great
15:15 < Wombert> :)
15:16 < Wombert> oh man
15:16 < Wombert> i am new to soap and xml
15:16 < Wombert> i am get http://www.nabble.com/file/p13407919/works.php works.php ting soap
15:16 < Wombert> response like the following and i use the code like this but is  too hard to
15:16 < Wombert> read the xml format.
15:16 < Wombert> I need hotel name and hotel detail from it.
15:16 < Wombert>        $xmlstr=simplexml_load_string($res);
15:16 < Wombert> php-soap list cracks me up
15:16 < jake> heh. php developers often crack me up
15:17  * Wombert smacks v-dogg 
15:17 < Wombert> changelog!
15:17 < jake> did you finish merging trunk Wombert?
15:17 < Wombert> yah
15:18 < jake> sweet
15:18 < CIA-29> david * r2162 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: changelog for #600/[2159]
15:18 < jake> no ssl on svn?
15:19  * Wombert looks at kaos|work 
15:19 < kaos|work> hm
15:19  * kaos|work hides
15:20 < E_mE> hehehehe:  http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/01/2001808227952005328_rs.jpg
15:23 < jake> I hate lol catz with a passion
15:23 -!- RossC0 [n=RossC0@80.4.120.163] has quit ["Leaving."]
15:23 < Wombert> lolcatz rock
15:23 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dialbs-213-023-052-058.static.arcor-ip.net] has left #agavi []
15:23 < jake> it's one of the few sites on the net that makes me want to put a gun in my mouth
15:23 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dialbs-213-023-052-058.static.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
15:24 < Wombert> jake: http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/14355981
15:24 < Wombert> :>
15:24 -!- epaulin [n=epaulin@219.137.33.195] has quit ["Ex-Chat"]
15:24 < MikeSeth> Wombert: if you think that rocks you should check out /b/
15:24 < Wombert> what rocks
15:24 < Wombert> and what is /b/
15:24 < Wombert> :p
15:25 < MikeSeth> Wombert: 4chan.org, click 'random'
15:25 < MikeSeth> http://www.flickr.com/photos/sosgatinhos/99440264 <- heh
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15:31 < CIA-29> jake * r2163 /trunk/src/database/AgaviMysqliDatabase.class.php: 
15:31 < CIA-29> Initial commit of the Mysqli stuff, refs #601. This isn't yet ready to be
15:31 < CIA-29> closed. After some discussion it would be better to use real_connect instead
15:31 < CIA-29> of connect so that options can be passed in. That requires some unit tests,
15:31 < CIA-29> etc at a minimum. Will revisit later.
15:31 < jake> Crap, if I had remembered about CIA I would have said something disparaging about Wombert
15:32 < Wombert> heh
15:44 < E_mE> MikeSeth: that picture is GREAT!
15:44 < E_mE> but jesus thats a horde 
15:45 < Wombert> gawd i hate zuckerberg
15:46 < jake> hehe, you hate his millions, but you love zuckerberg
15:46 < Wombert> nah, I hate both
15:47 < Wombert> http://www.spiegel.de/img/0,1020,1002552,00.jpg that's why I don't like him
15:47 < Wombert> he's such a moron
15:47 < Wombert> he's trying so hard to be cool and hip and all
15:47 < jake> you dick
15:47 < jake> now I hate him too
15:48 < Wombert> I read an interview the other day where he was laughing about and being proud of simply not responding to someone anymore after he got bored in an IM conversation
15:48 < Wombert> apparently some investor or whatever
15:48 < Wombert> he's so full of himself, it's unbearable
15:48 < Wombert> he's wearing flip flops all the time just to prove that he's a moron
15:48 < Wombert> soooo uncool
15:57 < jake> awesome, aparently lighttp -> apache is already HTTP_X_FORWARDED_FOR aware
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16:04 < Wombert> jake: mmh?
16:06 -!- MrJeep [n=jeanphil@modemcable175.240-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #agavi
16:08 < jake> I didn't do anything and HTTP_X_FORWARDED_FOR was already being set correctly. I really nice surprise :)
16:09 < jake> well, adding rss was sure painless
16:20 < CIA-29> david * r2164 /branches/0.11/src/view/ (2 files): Fixed #603: Template layers do not expand empty parameters in formatting strings
16:20 < CIA-29> david * r2165 /branches/0.11/CHANGELOG: 123qwechangelog
16:21 < jake> Wombert. Different privileges for read vs write?
16:22 < Wombert> ?
16:22 < Wombert> mh?
16:22 < Wombert> you mean in getCredentials() ?
16:22 < jake> Like, I want executeWrite to require privilege X and executeRead to require privilege Y
16:22 < jake> yeah
16:22 < jake> getReadCredentials?
16:22 < Wombert> nah it doesn't do that I think
16:22 < Wombert> sec
16:23 < jake> I don't think it does. Is there a method I can call to tell if the request is a read or a write? I could put a little logic in getCredentials
16:23 < Wombert> hey good catch
16:23 < Wombert> I think we should add that
16:23 < jake> me too
16:23 < Wombert> yes you can
16:23 < Wombert> request has getMethod()
16:24 < jake> great
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16:41 < Wombert> I
16:41 < Wombert> HATE
16:41 < Wombert> PHP
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16:49 < CIA-29> david * r2166 /branches/0.11/src/view/ (2 files): properly fixes #603
16:50 < jake> heh
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16:53 < CIA-29> david * r2167 /trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): merging in changes from branches/0.11, [2161:2166]
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16:57 < _cheerios> heroes, prisonbreak or own projects.
16:57 < _cheerios> with choices i usually go for all of them
17:00 < kaos|work> zomg apache :s
17:01 < kaos|work> using NameVirtualHost *:80 and multiple <VirtualHost *:80> results in apache always serving the first vhost
17:01 < kaos|work> wtf is wrong there now :s
17:02 < _cheerios> your setup! :D
17:03 < kaos|work> it just doesn't work at all ffs
17:07 < kaos|work> https://svn.agavi.org/
17:08 < kaos|work> kaos: 1 
17:08 < kaos|work> apache: 0
17:08 < kaos|work> win !
17:13 < jake> Wombert
17:13 < jake> is there a static method I can call to fetch baseHref?
17:14 < jake> Something like AgaviContext::getInstance()->getRouting()->getBaseHref() ?
17:19 < jake> hahah
17:20 < jake> awesome
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17:53 < _cheerios> "joined the group fuck off... I don't want to be a pirate/vampire/werewolf/zombie." :p
17:53 < jake> dude, no kidding
17:53 < jake> I've started blocking applications left and right
17:54 < _cheerios> what's your name, i'll add ya
17:54 < _cheerios> (no vampires included)
17:54 < _cheerios> is there an Agavi group on facebook yet?
17:56 < _cheerios> no, but there is a symfony group with 76 members
17:57 < _cheerios> and rails group with 1000+
17:57 < _cheerios> code igniter 113
17:58 < Wombert> lawl
17:58 < Wombert> jake: don't do that
17:58 < Wombert> why statically?
17:58 < jake> heh, I need to do that
17:58 < jake> it's just for phasing out legacy code
17:59 < jake> I have the guts of some dao's that need that info, and I can't go modifying all the function prototypes to pass the info in
17:59 < Wombert> k
18:00 < jake> It's really just while I phase the stuff out. The issue is, the domain where you manage content is different than the domain where you view content
18:01 < jake> So agavi wants to generate a url to managementdomain.com/path instead of contentdomain.com/path
18:01 < Wombert> you realize that you can force this, right
18:02 < Wombert> you have callbacks in the HTTP_HOST routes already
18:02 < Wombert> in onGenerate, you can set $options
18:02 < Wombert> you can set the host name there if you like
18:03 < Wombert> $ro->gen('foo', array('one' => 'two'), array('authority' => 'www.contentdomain.com'));
18:03 < jake> except the daos still don't have access to that info, so regardless, I need AgaviContext::getInstance
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18:27 < _cheerios> that's one cool dad in heroes :D
18:32 < Wombert> which dad
18:32 < Wombert> the one who's like "stop killing people and come home"? :p
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18:37 < jake> hah
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18:38 < JanK__> <parameters name=".*jan"><parameter />...</parameters> works, right?
18:39 < Wombert> eh?
18:40 < Wombert> no not <parameters>
18:40 < JanK__> so i need to duplicate the wrapping element (database)?
18:41 < Wombert> what are you doing exactly
18:42 < JanK__> i need different user/password/db config per user
18:42 < JanK__> for one database class
18:43 < JanK__> i've looked in another project, there you created a <configuration> per user
18:43 < Wombert> yes you need to duplicate everything
18:43 < Wombert> yes
18:43 < Wombert> but the "user" is actually just an environment name
18:43 < JanK__> yeah,  i know
18:43 < Wombert> and environment="development-jan" or so only works on <configuration>
18:44 < JanK__> thanks man
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20:46 < MrJeep> Wombert, do you know a good way to develop application (not web) that works on mac and pc ? (except Java)
20:46 < Wombert> adobe air?
20:46 < MrJeep> not web application
20:47 < MrJeep> but air looks nice
20:48 < Wombert> it depends on what you want to do, MrJeep 
20:49 < MrJeep> Learn something new that I can run on both mac and pc
20:49 < MrJeep> of course Java comes to my mind
20:49 < MrJeep> but maybe this is not the best choice, i don't know
20:54 < Wombert> java is good for learning
20:55 < Wombert> other than that, c#?
20:55 < Wombert> why does it have to be pc and mac
20:55 < Wombert> there are tons of cross platform toolkits
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02:11 < Wombert> woot woot
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03:59 < shoan> huomenta!
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05:37 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:11 < _cheerios> huomenta
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07:31 < _cheerios> http://blog.notdot.net/archives/32-LOLCode.net-Now-your-LOLCats-can-use-the-CLR!.html
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07:39 < _cheerios> Wombert, should I make a ticket of ?,& appended to urls messing up base url?
07:39 < RossC0> Huomenta!
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07:48 < _cheerios> does anyone here add rbac roles to their users after login?
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07:55 < _cheerios> just wondering, as there's no lookup for what role a credential belongs to?
07:55 < v-dogg> not sure what you mean but I'll answer "yes"
07:56 < _cheerios> given i have an action, with a required credential (of a role with 9 more credentials), if the user passes that credential; how do i apply the role (and those 9 other credentials) for this user?
08:03 < v-dogg> isn't there a grantRole() method?
08:07 < _cheerios> yes, but how do I know which role the credential belongs to?
08:07 < v-dogg> ah, that I don't know
08:10 < _cheerios> i guess the point is just to save on deep checks on the further 9 credentials, by applying the role to the user when one of the credentials matches.
08:12 < _cheerios> will whip up some xpaths and see how goes
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08:24 < E_mE> huomenta!
08:24 < E_mE> when i create my own library, for example xmlSpreadsheet... I create all my library files etc... Do i then use a model to connect to it throw agavi?
08:24 < E_mE> or just link it directly with autoload.xml
08:36 < v-dogg> what ever suits your needs
08:38 < Whisller> czesc
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08:43 < v-dogg> if you need AgaviContext the easiest way is to inherit AgaviModel
08:44 < v-dogg> if you don't need it autoload is a tad simpler (imo)
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08:47 < E_mE> jah, im going to leave it as my own library
08:47 < E_mE> and just call  $xmlFile = xmlSpreadsheet(xmlSpreadsheet::EXCEL, $data);
08:49 < E_mE> i think Agavi is making me a better programming, its forcing me to keep everything contained in logically locations and files :D
08:50 < _cheerios> there's a slight inefficiency (?) with rbac role/credential handling and sessions. as credentials belong to roles, the numerous credentials need not be saved. esp. staff/admin members can quickly amass hundreds of credentials into their session, where this would be only a few roles.
08:51 < v-dogg> it has been noted before that the default rbac implementation doesn't scale that well
08:51 < _cheerios> k. something for 1.0.
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08:52 < v-dogg> or not. better implementations might be to case specific
08:52 < v-dogg> *too
08:52 < v-dogg> dunno
08:52 < _cheerios> im not saying get rid off rbac
08:53 < v-dogg> no no, I didn't mean that
08:53 < _cheerios> k :)
08:54 < _cheerios> i can extend rbac to my needs quite well. not sure what to do about that session storage. it's probably not a big worry, but every bit counts! :D
08:55 < v-dogg> I'm just saying that further development might not be feasible because projects too complex to use the current implementation are likely to have such features that a general implementation wouldn't work anyway
08:57 < _cheerios> that's a big might without examples, but i get ya
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09:01 < v-dogg> yeah, in the end I don't know jack about the whole domain so I'm just blabbering on here :)
09:03 < RossC0> _cheerios: you can always just assign roles
09:03 < RossC0> but then you move 100's credentials into a few roles and then just checking roles
09:04 < RossC0> which means you could just refactor out 100's of credentials :-S
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09:04 < RossC0> so it depends on implementation and what exactly your needs are i.e. how fine grain you need the credentials
09:04 < _cheerios> i can just unset($this->credentials) before saving the user object too, and have the users credentials matched on roles, and filled up when checked against (hasCredentials)
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09:05 < jake> yeah. The last RBAC implementation I did had significantly more data
09:06 < _cheerios> would require more processing when credentials checked, atleast the first time, but would save on session user object sizes significantly. and session traffic is quite big in web apps.
09:06 < jake> A more typical implementation has Users, Roles, Permissions, Objects
09:06 < RossC0> well guys - release the code if you can ;)
09:06 < _cheerios> RossC0, working on it :)
09:07 < _cheerios> jake, anything online on that "last rbac implementation" for comparison?
09:08 < jake> Well, the NIST standard specifically maps out those 4 items
09:08 < jake> And the last implementation I did was to the NIST spec
09:08 < RossC0> well we have Users Roles and Credentials ..
09:09 < RossC0> so its not far off
09:09 < jake> Sure, although to be fair the 'Credentials' are really 'Permissions' :) You're just missing objects
09:09 < jake> _cheerios, what don't you like about the current rbac implementation?
09:09 < RossC0> what do the Objects do?
09:09 < RossC0> very generic name!
09:11 < jake> Well, a user has roles assigned to them. Each role has one or more permissions. Each permission maps to one or more objects. An object can be anything.
09:11 < jake> In agavi, you essentially store the object info in getCredentials()
09:11 < jake> However the purpose of an object in an RBAC system is to make the system much more fine grained
09:11 < jake> For instance, you could imagine a DAO object
09:12 < jake> And it has read and execute permissions
09:12 < jake> and the DAO object lives entirely outside of Agavi
09:13 < jake> The other disadvantage of storing the object info in getCredentials() is you can't ask the question, "Tell me all objects in our system that user X has access to"
09:14 < _cheerios> jake, im extending it to work on permissions that exist in the database (= a group and an ID association); like forum access rights with 10 000 private forums. Instead of mapping that into a huge rbac_definition, the same few rules are re-mapped with an appended ID => forum.member.10 (credential).
09:14 < _cheerios> (net being choppy atm., getting like 10 lines at a time)
09:16 < _cheerios> jake, somewhat similar to what im doing. Im mapping a credential to an object(+method).
09:17 < jake> You have 10k private forums?
09:17 < jake> Also, just override loadDefinition, that's what I did
09:19 < RossC0> cool - go guys
09:21 < _cheerios> numbers were to explain the reasoning behind doing what i did. sometimes small scale ops dont have the same problems, and cant see the limits of eg. a single xml file with all definitions in it.
09:21 < _cheerios> jake, that's one possibility - but it seems like pure overhead, when you can just query the database directly?
09:22 < _cheerios> A small forum could have 15 000 members. A load definitions would have to map all their rights.
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09:30 < jake> no it doesn't
09:30 < jake> loadDefinitions just loads up your roles
09:30 < jake> Then on login, you do setCredentials()
09:30 < jake> then you use getCredentials() in an action
09:31 < _cheerios> and that's silly :)
09:31 < jake> uhm, why? That's how you _should_ implement_ things
09:33 < RossC0> heh Wombert_ I see theres going to be  a couchdb talk at the PHP conf - should be good
09:34 < RossC0> _cheerios: you making things harder for yourself again
09:34 < _cheerios> jake: i disagree
09:34 < _cheerios> RossC0, how's that?
09:35 < jake> Back it up then. I'm using that same scheme with more than 100k users and it scales fine
09:35 < jake> hell, I used the exact same scheme on another site with 5 million memebers, and had no issues
09:36 < _cheerios> it's not the size of the network, it's how networked the network is. How many credentials on average did those users have?
09:37 < jake> Mmm, 50-100
09:37 < _cheerios> how many of those credentials did they use per session?
09:37 < jake> Most of them at the company with 5 million users. There we had a full RBAC implementation.
09:37 < jake> although I don't know how that question is relevant to the discussion
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09:39 < _cheerios> it's simple, load no more than you need. if the user has 50-100 or even 500 credentials, but only uses 3 of them during a session (and mind you these credentials (currently) are all stored in agavi's sessionstorage), that is a big waste.
09:41 < jake> I guess. database contention is always a much bigger deal then session contention, so I offload the db whenever possible
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10:04 < E_mE> does the XML Parser in PHP automatcally generate XML code for you, or do you need to actually create your own XML text and throw it into the parser?
10:04 < digitarald> Huomenta!
10:04 < E_mE> huomenta!
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10:10 < _cheerios> E_mE, you need a document to have something to parse?
10:10 < E_mE> ive been advised of DOMDocument
10:12 < _cheerios> that'll do for both creating, parsing. also, for parsing simplexml is swell.
10:15 < Whisller> hmm
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10:23 < jake> love me some simplexml
10:24 < _cheerios> it's friday? WOOHOO!
10:24 < _cheerios> that means an extra heavy gym session :p
10:29 < digitarald> whats a good hoster for my private sites and project development, that means with svn
10:29 < digitarald> e.g. mediatemple?
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10:41 < _cheerios> pick the cheapest place you have a good ping to (if you are going to work in the shell much)
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10:53 < digitarald> v-dogg, where do u host?
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11:15 < RossC0> <3 Bytemark
11:16 < RossC0> digitarald: I use bytemark.co.uk for a VPS
11:16 < RossC0> tis good
11:16 < RossC0> but not cheapest
11:16 < digitarald> i want it cheap!!
11:16 < digitarald> ;)
11:16 < RossC0> but you can install anything
11:16 < RossC0> well use assembla for svn - its free!
11:17 < E_mE> i might be wrong, but im sure there is a way of inserting a DOMNode into a element of a DOMDocument... if so what function is it?!?
11:17 < E_mE> ive been looking throw the documentation for ages looking for inserting into elements
11:18 < digitarald> appendChild?
11:18 < digitarald> ah ... thats js ;)
11:21 < E_mE> appendChild on the DOMDocument appends to the end of it :(
11:21 < E_mE> i need a insertChild or so
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11:41 < Wombert_> RossC0: really, a couch talk? ace
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11:42 < Wombert> _cheerios: that bug is fixed already isn't it?
11:42  * Wombert confused
11:42 < Wombert> you tested it :p
11:42 < Wombert> (the ampersand thing)
11:43 < Wombert> _cheerios: the idea is that you grant roles, those imply permissions, but you check only permissions
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11:44 < Wombert> if you'd like to check for roles, not for credentials, just write your own security filter
11:45 < Wombert> E_mE: insertBefore()
11:45 < E_mE> Wombert: i want to insert inside <Table></Table>
11:45 < Wombert> then call appendChild on the table element
11:45 < Wombert> http://de3.php.net/dom
11:46 < E_mE> Wombert: so do i: $table = $dom->getElementsByTagName('Table'); and then $table->appendChild($myElement);  ... then does it insert it into the $dom
11:47 < _cheerios> Wombert, ?param=value& was fixed. but a single ?,& elicits the same bug
11:47 < Wombert> ?,&
11:47 < Wombert> like that?
11:47 < _cheerios> hello.com?
11:47 < _cheerios> hello.com&
11:47 < _cheerios> or with an added /
11:47 < Wombert> nah can't be
11:47 < _cheerios> (infront)
11:47 < Wombert> wtf?
11:48 < Wombert> show me concrete examples please
11:49 < _cheerios> http://dummy.com/gallery& => (the same link on the page) http://dummy.com/gallery&/gallery
11:49 < _cheerios> http://dummy.com/gallery? => http://dummy.com/gallery/gallery
11:49 < Wombert> RossC0: where did you see the couch talk
11:49 < Wombert> _cheerios: uuuh okay
11:49 < Wombert> but those are all not in the query string
11:49  * Wombert confused
11:49 < Wombert> I can have a look
11:50 < Wombert> maybe another stupid apache 2.2 (?) thing
11:50 < _cheerios> http://dummy.com? and baseurl disappears
11:53 < Wombert> without a trailing slash?
11:54 < Wombert> how does apache even allow that
11:54 < Wombert> is gallery a folder?
11:54 < Wombert> or a route
11:54 < _cheerios> apache doesnt allow these on folders. this is on an agavi app
11:54 < _cheerios> normal response to these would be not found in apache
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12:03 < _cheerios> problems only occur using rewrites
12:21 < Wombert> ok
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12:46 < RossC0> Wombert: ah its on the couchdb mailing list -but its at the Frankfurt UG not the conf
12:55 < Wombert> okay
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13:02 < _cheerios> rbac filters :p
13:05 < _cheerios> i've been wondering how to perform maintenance on parts of a site, or wholly, without taking it down
13:08 < _cheerios> so, with rbac credentials in place, and say we needed to upgrade photo uploads (quick 5-10min job) but not take the site down. So, we add a filter to "photo.upload" (credential) to have the rule "fail" (for everyone) prompting a "Maintenance is being performed on photo uploads, 5-10mins, cheers!" message appear on the action to note that it won't work. Cool?
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13:09 < Wombert> you could do that, but why don't you add a credential that nobody has
13:09 < Wombert> call it "maintenance", require it, and in the SecureAction, display the message
13:09 < v-dogg> remember that you can also disable modules
13:09 < Wombert> yup
13:09 < Wombert> you can!
13:09 < Wombert> :>
13:09 < _cheerios> v-dogg, then you disable a lot of stuff
13:09 < v-dogg> sure
13:09 < _cheerios> (instead of just the one you need)
13:10 < Wombert> what does update mean
13:10 < Wombert> upload new app version?
13:10 < _cheerios> Wombert, with the filter you don't need to find out where that credential is used (or if it's in several)
13:11 < _cheerios> Can close down whole sections of a site, or very fine-tuned.
13:11 < Wombert> then you could also do a filter that calls isDisabled() on the action
13:11 < Wombert> why do you need to do it via rbac
13:11 < Wombert> ...
13:12 < _cheerios> Cuz i'm all rbac today :)
13:12 < Wombert> man you're worse than me
13:12 < Wombert> and I'm german!
13:12 < Wombert> ACHTUNG THIS IS NOT KOMPLIKATED ENAFF
13:12 < _cheerios> it wouldn't work via actions!
13:13 < _cheerios> rbac is the key
13:13 < _cheerios> :D
13:13 < _cheerios> further example, forums (!), as they all use the same actions - how would you close forum #505 ?
13:15 < _cheerios> or say you've archived all slashdot pages, but get a notice that #500000 and #101 have porn on them. So, you give "document.view.101 etc." a fail-mark, until you have time to inspect. Everyone is happy, and you can go on with your work :)
13:17 < E_mE> i keep getting foo_barXmlView does not implement executeHtml()  ... ive got the routing rule saying output_type="xml" ... ive got return "Xml"; in the action... what am i doing wrong?
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13:18 < _cheerios> ZE KOMPLIKATED POSSIBILISSIMO IST ENDLESS :p
13:18 < RossC0> Wombert: ACHTUNG THIS IS NOT KOMPLIKATED ENAFF
13:18 < RossC0> omg Womberts going to invade
13:18 < Wombert> YES ZE PANZERS ARE ALREADY ON ZE WAY
13:18 < Wombert> AUTOBAHNS!!!!!!
13:18 < RossC0> _cheerios: ZE KOMPLIKATED POSSIBILISSIMO IST ENDLESS :p
13:19 < RossC0> zomg _cheerios waves a red flag to ze deutsche Bull
13:19 < Wombert> hahaha
13:19 < RossC0> :D
13:19 < _cheerios> :)
13:27 < _cheerios> mmm, rbac wildcard filters forum.europe.* if(!gotTanks && outOfAmmo) { surrender! }
13:28 < E_mE> how can i make the the http_header force the browse to download the content?
13:29 < E_mE> im send pure xml data to the browser and want it to ask the user where to save the data
13:30 < E_mE> or shall i just dump the XML streight into the template?
13:30 < _cheerios> www.php.net/header
13:32 < _cheerios> Wombert, I just have these crazy rules I need to do. Like for a forum, how would you only allow access to forum #9 if they're female and between 19-35 ?
13:32 < _cheerios> And then #11 if they're male and from Elbonia.
13:33 < _cheerios> I saw rbac rules + filters like a good match. Atleast, until proven horribly wrong :D
13:35 < v-dogg> E_mE: Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="download.xml"
13:35 < Wombert> without quotation marks
13:35 < v-dogg> either in output_types.xml <parameter name="http_headers"> or in View::init
13:35 < v-dogg> without?
13:35 < v-dogg> ok then
13:37 < _cheerios> v-dogg's three last lines do not seem so crazy when Wombert's line is factored in.
13:38 < v-dogg> :)
13:39 < _cheerios> any objections to my rbac-filled plans until i proceed with the KOMPLIKATED
13:40 < _cheerios> jake, you've done full rbac implementations before. does this seem sane?
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13:44 < E_mE> v-dogg: ive got it set in the out_types... but its not working
13:44 < E_mE> the web browser just goes blank
13:45 < E_mE> ive also got setContent(MyXMLData); set in executeXml()
13:49 < _cheerios> filename="" needs a path to a file on the filesystem
13:50 < E_mE> _cheerios: on the servers filessystem?
13:51 < Wombert> wrong, _cheerios 
13:51 < _cheerios> uh, nvm. i remembered wrong.
13:51 < _cheerios> probably just the filename you want users to download it as
13:51 < E_mE> thats what i thought
13:53 < E_mE> ive got $this->getContainer()->getResponse()->setContent($myXmlData);  in the executeXml view... and a output_type for XML... but its doing bugger all
13:54 < E_mE> and got output_type="xml" in my routing rule
13:54 < _cheerios> unbugger your code! :D
13:54 < E_mE> have <parameter name="Content-Type">text/xml</parameter>
13:55 < E_mE> if i do die() in my view it dumps the xml to screen :S
13:55 < E_mE> die(xmldata)
13:55 < E_mE> im going to bugger it good =P
14:01 < Wombert> and how are you setting the header
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14:06 < E_mE> Wombert: in output_type
14:06 < E_mE> Wombert: in output_types.xml
14:10 < Wombert> show
14:12 < E_mE> Wombert: http://www.pastebin.ca/750406
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14:14 < Wombert> E_mE: as I said...without quotes!
14:14 < Wombert> and you should set that header in the view I think
14:14 < Wombert> since the file name might not always be the same
14:14 < Wombert> and
14:15 < Wombert> <parameters> is not necessary
14:15 < E_mE> well its performing a download... but the files are always empty
14:16 < _cheerios> Wombert, rbac-filter on photo.upload: if(user==steve && isFriday) { "dude! no more posting of photos when drunk, privates are to be kept private!" } KOMPLIKATED FRIDAY CRAZYNESS
14:16 < Wombert> lawl
14:16 < Wombert> E_mE: fix the header first
14:16 < Wombert> and
14:17 < Wombert> you can just return the xml string
14:17 < Wombert> no need to setcontent bla
14:18 < E_mE> whats the function path  for setOutputType()
14:18 < E_mE> or object path
14:21 < E_mE> Wombert: do i need to use setContentType()
14:26 < Wombert> eh?
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14:26 < Wombert> return $xmlString
14:26 < Wombert> and
14:26 < Wombert> $this->getResponse()->setHttpResponseHeader('Content-Disposition', 'attachment; filename=foo.xml');
14:30 < E_mE> called undefined method agaviwebresponse::setHttp...
14:30 < E_mE> do i need to setup a new context for xml data files?
14:31 < Wombert> no
14:31 < v-dogg> $this->getResponse()->setHttpHeader
14:31 < Wombert> setHttpheader then
14:31 < E_mE> blank browser window
14:32 < v-dogg> use live_http_headers to check the headers
14:32 < v-dogg> (firefox add-on)
14:33 < Wombert> and you have xml output type set
14:33 < E_mE> ill show you routing
14:35 < E_mE> http://pastebin.com/d1e1372e7
14:38 < E_mE> the http header says:
14:38 < E_mE> Content-Type: applciation/x-www-form-urlencoded
14:38 < Wombert> you don't need module="Sop" everywhere
14:39 < E_mE> i am using a POST request to fire the a confirm but thats it
14:39 < Wombert> children inherit settings from their parents
14:39 < E_mE> ah ok :D
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14:40 < Wombert> and if you die in the view then it's fine
14:40 < Wombert> and if you leave out the attachment header?
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14:40 < Wombert> oh hey
14:40 < Wombert> I was wrong
14:40 < Wombert> it must have quotation marks
14:40 < Wombert> sorry v-dogg and E_mE 
14:41 < v-dogg> ok :)
14:44 < E_mE> if i run die($myXmlData); in the view... it dumps to the browser 
14:44 < Wombert> and if you return the $myXmlData
14:44 < Wombert> that is a string, right?
14:44 < Wombert> return it _and_ do not send the attachment header
14:44 < Wombert> does it work then?
14:45 < Wombert> are you calling setupHtml
14:45 < Wombert> or loading a layout?
14:45 < E_mE> ive got:
14:45 < E_mE> public function executeXml(AgaviREquestDataHolder $rd)
14:45 < E_mE> {
14:45 < Wombert> please pastie the view if you can and output_types.xml
14:45 < E_mE> ok
14:46 < E_mE> the view is only 3 more lines
14:46 < E_mE>   $data = $this->getAttribute('xmldata');
14:46 < E_mE>   return $data;
14:46 < E_mE> }
14:46 < E_mE> and ill pastie output
14:47 < v-dogg> (why do you need $data :)
14:47 < E_mE> http://pastebin.com/d220ac41a
14:47 < E_mE> no... =P  but i was tampering around so much it was like 2 millisecond quick to move around =P
14:48 < v-dogg> :)
14:48 < v-dogg> Content-Disposition is missing the quotes
14:48 < v-dogg> not that it probably causes this 
14:48 < Wombert> can you please please please leave out that header just to see if that is the issue
14:48 < Wombert> maybe your browser acts up because it's text/xml
14:49 < v-dogg> smack it in the face
14:50 < E_mE> Wombert: the disposition header correct
14:50 < Wombert> yes, remove it
14:50 < Wombert> is that IE6 by any chance?
14:51 < E_mE> no firefox
14:51 < E_mE> 2.0.0.8
14:52 < E_mE> still same probelm, even with disposition removed
14:52 < Wombert> you get a white page?
14:52 < E_mE> and even did it with the disposition enabled in the view
14:52 < E_mE> yes
14:52 < Wombert> noooooo
14:52 < Wombert> please
14:52 < v-dogg> did you check the headers?
14:52 < Wombert> no  disposition at all
14:52 < Wombert> and change output_types.xml to text/plain
14:52 < Wombert> does that work then
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14:54 < E_mE> still blank
14:54 < E_mE> and the headers is only showing 
14:54 < E_mE> HTTP/1.x 200 OK
14:54 < E_mE> and nothing after that
14:55 < v-dogg> php errors are enabled and visible?
14:55 < E_mE> nothing.. all blank
14:57 < E_mE> here, try it:
14:57 < E_mE> http://81.168.18.2/sop/custSpareTextAnalysis/confirm
14:59 < Wombert> Safari can’t open the page.
14:59 < Wombert> Safari can’t open the page “http://81.168.18.2/sop/custSpareTextAnalysis/xml” because the server unexpectedly dropped the connection, which sometimes occurs when the server is busy. You might be able to open the page later.
14:59 < Wombert> so it crashes somewhere
14:59 < Wombert> The View "Sop_CustSpareTextAnalysisSuccessView" does not implement an "executeXml()" method to serve the Output Type "xml", and the base View "ProjectBaseView" does not implement an "executeXml()" method to handle this situation.
15:00 < E_mE> yeah, the XML returning happens in a executeWrite()
15:00 < Wombert> so that's POST
15:00 < v-dogg> wherE?
15:01 < E_mE> and the executeRead() is accessed via /confirm
15:01 < E_mE> so means you need to click the button on the /confirm screen to download it
15:01 < Wombert> then I get
15:01 < Wombert> Safari can’t open the page.
15:01 < Wombert> Safari can’t open the page “http://81.168.18.2/sop/custSpareTextAnalysis/xml” because the server unexpectedly dropped the connection, which sometimes occurs when the server is busy. You might be able to open the page later.
15:01 < E_mE> :S
15:02 < Wombert> when I click, and it's post
15:02 < E_mE> odd
15:02 < E_mE> let me try it from another computer
15:02 < E_mE> out on the internet
15:02 < E_mE> because i dont get that error
15:04 < Wombert> ---request begin---
15:04 < Wombert> POST /sop/custSpareTextAnalysis/xml HTTP/1.0
15:04 < Wombert> User-Agent: Wget/1.10.2
15:04 < Wombert> Accept: */*
15:04 < Wombert> Host: 81.168.18.2
15:04 < Wombert> Connection: Keep-Alive
15:04 < Wombert> Content-Type: application/x-www-form-urlencoded
15:04 < Wombert> Content-Length: 0
15:04 < Wombert> ---request end---
15:04 < Wombert> [POST data: ]
15:04 < Wombert> HTTP Anforderung gesendet, warte auf Antwort... Keine Daten empfangen.
15:04 < Wombert> Closed fd 4
15:04 < Wombert> Erneuter Versuch.
15:05 < Wombert> "keine daten empfangen" = "no data received"
15:05 < Wombert> can you skip the xml stuff
15:05 < Wombert> just return "foo"
15:06 < E_mE> try it now
15:06 < E_mE> its dump some HTML to the screen
15:06 < E_mE> with foo
15:06 < E_mE> this is weird?!?!
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15:08 < E_mE> im using DOMDocument->saveXML(); to get the xml data which is a return type of string
15:09 < E_mE> i mean the XML data i am throwing at the return is proberbly about 8-900K
15:12 < E_mE> wombert: am i being a fool or is there something wrong
15:14 < Wombert> <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/loose.dtd">
15:14 < Wombert> <?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8' ?><html><body><p>foo</p></body></html>
15:14 < Wombert> that means FPF ran
15:14 < Wombert> show me your global_filters.xml
15:15 < Wombert> <parameter name="output_types">
15:15 < Wombert>   <parameter>html</parameter>
15:15 < Wombert> is what you need
15:15 < E_mE> http://pastebin.com/d61ca049a
15:17 < Wombert> yes
15:17 < Wombert> fpf runs for all output types
15:17 < Wombert> and your javascript loader filter runs, too
15:18 < Wombert> you need to implement such functionality there
15:18 < Wombert> btw if you do context="web" you don't have to disable them anymore for cli expliclty
15:18 < Wombert> got it so far?
15:19 < E_mE> yes
15:19 < E_mE> :D
15:20 < E_mE> eeek it seems to be crashing my browser now :D
15:20 < E_mE> :S
15:20 < E_mE> yeepeee!
15:20 < E_mE> its transfered :D
15:21 < E_mE> here im adjusted one:
15:21 < E_mE> http://pastebin.com/d50519ccc
15:21 < E_mE> that i presume is all correct Wombert
15:21 < E_mE> :D
15:22 < Wombert> well you need to add code to your javascript loader filter
15:22 < E_mE> ive never used it :S
15:25 < E_mE> thank you a million Wombert :D
15:25 < E_mE> i would of never held the FPF responsible for that!
15:30 < Wombert> oh feck it's late!
15:30 < Wombert> zomg need to buy leopard!
15:30 < Wombert> zomg
15:30 < Wombert> office ->
15:30 < E_mE> i thought you had it on order
15:30 < Wombert> nah
15:31 < Wombert> need ram anyway and kaos needs a power adapter and stuff so I'll just head to the gravis store
15:31 < Wombert> zomg can't wait for germany's first apple store!
15:31 < Wombert> in muuuunich!
15:31 < Wombert> :>
15:31 < Wombert> I WILL GO THERE WITH ALL MY FANBOI SHIRTS FOR THE GRAND OPENING MAYBE I'LL SEE STEVE JOBS OMG OMG
15:31 < Wombert> anyway
15:31 < Wombert> =>
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15:57 < E_mE> bye by
15:57 < E_mE> e
15:57 < E_mE> have good weekend
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16:14 < MrJeep> no one's sleeping in the street to get osx ?
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17:02 < _cheerios> woot woot
17:04 < _cheerios> sick http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/tees/7063366.stm
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18:15 < Wombert> wootz
18:15 < Wombert> leopard install :>
18:24 < _cheerios> lolz
18:35 < MrJeep> install done ?
18:40 < jake> wootz, getting my macbook pro next week
18:41 < MrJeep> did you suggest me to buy a simple macbook ?
18:41 < MrJeep> i mean, didn't you suggest me
18:41 < MrJeep> mbp 17 ?
18:51 < MrJeep> you guys know Buckley's sirop medicine
18:51 < MrJeep> where the slogan is "it tastes awefull, but it works"
18:52 < MrJeep> i think i have something even worse
18:59 < JanK__> "it tastes aweful, and don't work"?
19:00 < v-dogg> mmm... this beer tastes good and it always works
19:01 < _cheerios> :)
19:02 < _cheerios> i had to give up beer. doesn't feel right anymore.
19:05 < v-dogg> how so?
19:05 < _cheerios> upsets my stomach
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19:10 < jake> that's because of your vagina
19:10 < v-dogg> come again?
19:11 < v-dogg> I fail to see the connection between these two and I doubt _cheerios has a vagina
19:12 < _cheerios> looks like ive been insulted on ze internets for not drinking beer
19:12 < jake> Teh internets is no joke
19:13 < jake> And you should fully ignore me for like 12 hours. I've been up for way too long, I'm going to bed now :)
19:14 < Wombert> laaaawl
19:14 < Wombert> :>
19:14 < Wombert> no not installed yet
19:14 < Wombert> and
19:15 < Wombert> I drank lotsa beer yesterday
19:15 < Wombert> and I didn't like it either
19:15 < Wombert> bloody froth :/
19:15 < Wombert> you can't get drunk properly on beer
19:15 < Wombert> at least not when drinking from bottles
19:15 < Wombert> OKTOBERFEST FTW :>
19:16 < Wombert> hmm do I install now over my existing install
19:16 < Wombert> or do I go buy an external hard drive and do a clean re-install
19:18 < MrJeep> put your main system on a usb drive ?
19:18 < MrJeep> won't that be slow ?
19:21 < Wombert> no
19:21 < Wombert> my mac has firewire 800 :>>>>
19:21 < Wombert> <3 firewire
19:22 < Wombert> hmm well
19:22 < Wombert> I'll go buy a hard drive now
19:22 < MrJeep> why are you afraid to upgrade ?
19:23 < Wombert> because I've had lots of freezes recently
19:23 < Wombert> and shutting down takes 20 minutes
19:23 < Wombert> and I have a really old powerbook g4, my tiger install is 2 years old, and a new install will make me happy :p
19:23 < MrJeep> good points :)
19:24 < MrJeep> carry on :)
19:24 < Wombert> YES STRIKE WOOT WOOT
19:24 < Wombert> Leopard Mail has IMAP IDLE
19:24 < Wombert> yeeehaw
19:48 < splatch`> hello
20:05 < _cheerios> ive been worried of hw troubles (like hd dying), but nothing yet on a comp bought in '01.
20:20 < _cheerios> scotts & bicycles <3<3
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20:38 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, airliners.net seems to be chuggin' along still. That site has cool shots http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=0163613&WxsIERv=Nveohf%20N320-214&Wm=0&WdsYXMg=Vorevn&QtODMg=Onepryban%20%28-%20Ry%20Ceng%29%20%28OPA%20%2F%20YROY%29&ERDLTkt=Fcnva&ktODMp=Znl%2012%2C%202001&BP=1&WNEb25u=Zneyb%20Cyngr%20-%20Vorevna%20Fcbggref&xsIERvdWdsY=RP-UXA&MgTUQtODMgKE=Gbb%20ybj%21%21%21%21%20V%20jnf%20fubbgvat%20n%2Fp%20ba%20Ejl%2020%20jura%20V%20ernyvfr
20:38 < _cheerios> q%20gung%20guvf%20320%20jnf%20nccebnpuvat%20jnl%20gbb%20ybj%20naq%20ghearq%20gur%20pnzren%20gb%20pncgher%20vg.%20Sbeghangryl%20gur%20gehpx%20qevire%20uvg%20gur%20oenxrf%20orsber%20cnffvat%20orybj%21%20Nf%20lbh%20pna%20frr%2C%20lbh%20pna%20trg%20ernyyl%20pybfr%20gb%20gur%20npgvba%20urer.%20%28Nf%20bs%20zvq-Whar%202001%20guvf%20ebnq%20frpgvba%20unf%20orra%20pybfrq%20naq%20qrivngrq%29%20Nvepensg%20jnf%20er-ertvfgerq%20RP-UHY%20va%20Whyl%202001.%20%3
20:38 < _cheerios> Cn%20uers%3Duggc%3A%2F%2Fjjj.nveyvaref.arg%2Ffrnepu%2Fcubgb.frnepu%3Fvq%3D246659%2C163613%3EFrr%20n%20abezny%20nccebnpu%3C%2Fn%3E&YXMgTUQtODMgKERD=1056900&NEb25uZWxs=2001-05-17%2000%3A00%3A00&ODJ9dvCE=&O89Dcjdg=1347&static=yes&width=846&height=670&sok=%20BEQRE%20OL%20ivrjf%20qrfp&photo_nr=7&prev_id=0239080&next_id=1025605
20:38 < _cheerios> (and LONG urls :))
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20:45 < _cheerios> heh @ craiglist http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/cpg/460249817.html
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21:57 < Wombert> aaalright
21:57 < Wombert> hard drive bought
21:57 < Wombert> off to back things up :>
22:02 < MrJeep> :D
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--- Day changed Sat Oct 27 2007
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03:23 < Wombert> mh
03:23 < impl> I agree.
03:23 < Wombert> leopard annoys me already
03:24 < Wombert> gawd I hate this
03:24 < Wombert> actually, I love it
03:24 < Wombert> but
03:24 < Wombert> I need to migrate all my stuff
03:24 < Wombert> and I cannot be arsed to do that
03:24 < Wombert> but I fear that if I just do an upgrade install
03:24 < Wombert> things are gonna be as slow and fucked up as they were with tiger
03:29 < impl> haha
03:29  * impl hugs Linux ;D
03:31 < Wombert> this is so fucking annoying, no kidding
03:31 < Wombert> gah
03:32 < Wombert> I could run migration assistant now
03:32 < Wombert> mmmh
03:32 < Wombert> and see what that does
03:32 < Wombert> but will that move my apache settings?
03:32 < Wombert> or not?
03:32 < Wombert> is it gonna fuck up things and move too much stuff over I don't want anymore?
03:32 < Wombert> but how do I get back my iCal database
03:32 < impl> Yes, duh.
03:32 < Wombert> how do I move over all my passwords
03:32 < impl> I thought everything was supposed to work perfectly on Macs
03:32 < impl> what's going on here
03:33 < Wombert> well
03:33 < Wombert> it is
03:33 < Wombert> if I clicked "upgrade" during the install, everything would be as I left it
03:33 < Wombert> except I'd be running a new OS
03:33 < Wombert> however, I've done too much fiddling with the old system
03:33 < Wombert> freezes and such
03:33 < Wombert> and my powerbook is old and slow
03:33 < Wombert> all the junk and the hard drive fragmentation... you get it
03:34 < Wombert> so I decided a clean install would be best
03:34 < Wombert> how do I move over my application licenses
03:34 < Wombert> BOOOOOOOH
03:34 < Wombert> I HATE THIS
03:35 < Wombert> other than that, I really, really, really like it
03:35 < Wombert> except for 100 things that bother me already
03:35 < Wombert> oh man this is baaaaaaad
03:35 < Wombert> sighs
03:36 < impl> http://www.debian.org/
03:36 < Wombert> go away
03:36  * impl grins
03:37 < Wombert> oh fuck this is ace
03:38 < Wombert> you hold a window with the mouse
03:38 < Wombert> then you switch to a space with ctrl-1 ctrl-2 (or with arrows)
03:38 < Wombert> and that way you take the window with you
03:38 < Wombert> coolo
03:38 < impl> oh oh
03:38 < impl> did you see the Website clipping feature
03:38 < impl> that was the coolest thing evr
03:38 < Wombert> until that site changes the dom structure :p
03:39 < impl> I ALMOST decided to buy a Mac just for that.
03:39 < Wombert> it's pretty trivial actually
03:39 < Wombert> heh
03:39 < Wombert> I love it but this migration stuff annoys me
03:39 < Wombert> very, very, very much
03:44 < Wombert> impl: help me :<
03:45 < impl> what with?
03:50 < Wombert> cries
03:50 < Wombert> ZOMG
03:50 < Wombert> cries
03:50 < Wombert> zomg
03:50  * Wombert cries
03:51 < Wombert> NOT EVEN THAT WORKS ANYMORE
03:51 < Wombert> BOOOHOOOHOOOOO
03:51 < impl> :S
03:51 < Wombert> the thing is
03:51 < Wombert> I could move over my stuff
03:51 < Wombert> but I don't wanna
03:51 < Wombert> now I could move stuff by hand
03:51 < Wombert> but then I have all the plugin crap in mail again and
03:51 < Wombert> beh
04:04 < impl> :s
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07:46 < _cheerios> guten morgen!
07:47 < _cheerios> 03:33 < Wombert> all the junk and the hard drive fragmentation... you get it
07:47 < _cheerios> ^^ i've all forgotten about defragmentation for years, linux <3<3
07:48 < v-dogg> huomenta
08:00 < _cheerios> mmm, no commits on personal project for 2 days. lazy me!
08:02 < _cheerios> commits on 25/28 days this month, totaling 170 commits. i have too many bugs in my code evidently :|
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08:20 < trophaeum> _cheerios, unit testing ftw!
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08:22 < _cheerios> i'll be one of them unit testers soon :)
08:24 < MikeSeth> yo
08:24 < MikeSeth> a quick note about Doctrine
08:25 < MikeSeth> this is especially important when using mix-in templates
08:25 < MikeSeth> a model class must have a setTableDefinition() method
08:25 < MikeSeth> if it doesn't, it can't be loaded automatically for export operations etc
08:26 < _cheerios> mix-in templates?
08:27 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: yeah, Doctrine has a delegation system, chapter 15 in the manual
08:27 < MikeSeth> it's <3 awesome
08:29 -!- Arme[N] is now known as Arme[0]
08:32 < Whisller> hi
08:32 < MikeSeth> hallo
08:47 < _cheerios> having read ch15, it all seems a bit clunky
08:50 < _cheerios> while 15.1+15.2 make sense, in 15.3 setImpl(), isn't it a straint to remember to do such a thing at runtime? then 15.4, i don't see the elegance of putting login() logic to a DR.
08:50 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: you have to define application-specific implementations somehow
08:51 < MikeSeth> or else how would you delegate calls from actual models to template methods?
08:51 < _cheerios> im just commenting on the examples given
08:51 < _cheerios> they did nothing to win me over
08:53 < MikeSeth> well in my case these come really handy
08:53 < _cheerios> can you give an example from your own needs
08:55 < MikeSeth> I'm writing a library of business objects. Target application creates its own implementations using the library's templates
08:56 < MikeSeth> So for instance a Product object can use a template to store a price including currency information, or another one without
08:56 < MikeSeth> You get interchangeable components that you can plug into your final orm class
08:59 < _cheerios> what's in the template that made you use one tobegin with ?
09:01 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: using templates means implementor doesn't have to commit to particular classes
09:01 < MikeSeth> better yet, implementor may need to attach the abstract notion of price to something that the author (me) did not foresee
09:01 < MikeSeth> he can do it in one line of code
09:02 < MikeSeth> or, for instance, there may be a special case of a product that has three prices, or a table of prices
09:03 < MikeSeth> in general, this substitutes for multiple inheritance in cases when you need to compose your business objects from a number of different class families
09:03 < MikeSeth> templates allow you to break up concepts to classes
09:05 < _cheerios> right. i had too much of a single-application mindet going on. it makes more sense on what you're after.
09:06 < MikeSeth> beside just being cool :D
09:06 < MikeSeth> I can even do polymorphism with little effort
09:08 < MikeSeth> class ProductTemplate ... { function setPrice($args) { $priceObj = factory(...); call_user_func_array(array($priceObj, 'SetPrice'), $args); }
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09:46 < _cheerios> been listening to Nightwish latest album again and again, and it really is great <3
09:48 < MikeSeth> yeah? with the new vocalist?
09:48 < MikeSeth> cuz I was really wondering how'd they still be Nightwish without that woman
09:49 < _cheerios> they're moving forward with style
09:50 -!- JanK_ [n=JanK_@muedsl-82-207-193-171.citykom.de] has quit []
09:52 < _cheerios> with a 175 (!) member orchestra backing their songs up, there's a lovely spectrum of subtle detail to the songs
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10:13 < stachu> could anyone tell me or give example how to return array in soap routing?
10:26 < _cheerios> would love to, but i don't do soap
10:35 < v-dogg> I don't even get the question
10:36 < _cheerios> i understand the question but it doesn't make sense
10:39 < stachu> recently when i was using soap, i wanted to create method which was returnnig array, I had to use complexTypes or something like that. Does agavi support it?
10:42 < stachu> Do you understend my question?
10:44 < stachu> something like <wsdl:output><wsdl:part name="products" type="xsd:array" /></wsdl:output>
10:44 < splatch`> hello :)
10:44 < splatch`> xsd:array this type doesn't exist in XML Schema Definition, i gess
10:45 < stachu> i know
10:45 < splatch`> stachu: try to use SOAP namespace
10:46 < stachu> could you give me an example? 
10:51 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: 175?! that's big balls
10:59 < splatch`> stachu: what type you want send
10:59 < splatch`> tell me :)
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11:57 < v-dogg> is it still so that there are no good php IDEs for windows and I need to continue with Zend Studio?
11:58 < splatch`> v-dogg: try PHP Development Tools
11:59 < v-dogg> does it finally have a decent code completetion?
11:59 < v-dogg> not just for core php functions but classes in the project?
12:00 < v-dogg> does it complete based on phpdoc tags? (e.g. $this->context->getu .. finds getUser() from AgaviContext?
12:06 < v-dogg> bah.. eclipse.org is ever so helpful... 
12:07 < v-dogg> is it just me or is the whole site full of meaningless information and nothing concrete?
12:10 < v-dogg> a screenshot or two would help a little, a feature list or even a little marketing would do a lot
12:10  * v-dogg is annoyed
12:11 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: emacs :D
12:11 < MikeSeth> if I ever finish my agavi-mode..
12:13 < v-dogg> as I don't really use any of the real IDE stuff in Zend Studio I could just as well use a normal editor with code completetion, class browser and some other basic features
12:14 < v-dogg> so yes, even emacs is an option
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12:15 < v-dogg> although I'm so much a windows use that I can't live without Ctrl+arrow for jumping over words, shift for selecting and of course Ctrl+c/x/v :)
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12:21 < _cheerios> eclipse + phpeclipse for the basics
12:21 < _cheerios> but i dont use any autocompletion stuff. annoys me usually.
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12:22 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: will you believe me if I tell you emacs can do it better? ;)
12:37 < _cheerios> what can emacs not do!
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13:06 < v-dogg> MikeSeth_: maybe :)
13:06 < v-dogg> but old dogg and new tricks... ya know :)
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13:11  * Wombert still annoyed by leopard
13:18 < v-dogg> hmm.. pdt has improved
13:19 < v-dogg> WHOAA! eclipse is currently using 220Mb memory :D
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14:03 < trophaeum> v-dogg, for eclipse thats not much!
14:04 < trophaeum> pity i cant get eclipse with pdt 1 to even START on this box
14:04 < trophaeum> *sigh*
14:04 < trophaeum> i blew up my eclipse the other day
14:04 < trophaeum> havnt fixed it yet
14:05 < trophaeum> weeeee, reverse engineering someone's lame encoding on a string to try to encrypt it, they are using character replacement that changes every time a / is seen in the url
14:05 < trophaeum> fun but my head is starting to hurt
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15:15 < _cheerios> v-dogg, add "eclipse -vmargs -Xmx512M" to have eclipse run smoother
15:17 < trophaeum> or you can hack at eclipse.ini
15:18 < v-dogg> how?
15:19 < v-dogg> ah, wasn'y hard to figure out :)
15:20 < v-dogg> what's that vm parameter?
15:21 < _cheerios> java virtual machine argument, gives it 512 megs for use
15:22 < trophaeum> i normally double both of the memory settings for eclipse, specially if you use agavi+propel+zend framework in 1 project *cringe*
15:22 < v-dogg> I do...
15:27 < trophaeum> u and i both, let eclipse eat all the ram it wants :(
15:34 < jake> why would you use the zend framework and agavi?
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15:37 < MikeSeth> haha
15:37 < MikeSeth> I broke Doctrine
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16:13 < v-dogg> jake: I use http client and pdf modules from zned
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16:15 < Wombert> WHAT
16:15 < Wombert> ZEND
16:15 < Wombert> OU ARE USING ZEND
16:15 < Wombert> ZOMG
16:15 < Wombert> CHANSERV; BAN THEN BAN THEM
16:16 < _cheerios> lol
16:17 < ttj> Wombie \o/
16:17 < ttj> http://www.hs.fi/kotimaa/artikkeli/Poliisiauto+ajoi+p%E4in+punaisia+ja+t%F6rm%E4si+humalaisen+kuljettamaan+bussiin+Turussa/1135231362340 <-- Haha. Only in Turku. :P
16:18 < v-dogg> Wombert: you knew I use zned!
16:18 < Wombert> I DID NOT!
16:18 < Wombert> ZOMG!
16:18 < Wombert> ZOMF!
16:18 < jake> haha
16:18 < Wombert> you know Asterix in Switzerland
16:18 < Wombert> where they're eating the fondue
16:18 < v-dogg> and I keep using it until someone codes a pdf library that doesn't suck
16:18 < Wombert> INTO THE LAKE, INTO THE LAKE, WITH BALLAST TIED TO THEIR FEET
16:19 < ttj> A police car was going to check out a Russian truck that was assumed to be driven under the influence of alcohol but instead the cops crashed into a bus. Then it turned out that the bus driver was drunk too. And then a firetruck that was coming to the scene also crashed into some car. :P
16:19 < ttj> This supports my theory that everyone in Turku is drunk. :P
16:19 < v-dogg> haha
16:20 < Wombert> heh
16:38 < _cheerios> oi, jarkko nieminen made it into the final vs Federer. odds are against him; 7 previous games, 7 losses, 0 set wins :)
16:39 < Wombert> I think Federer is a clone of Stephane Chapuisat
16:39 < Wombert> or a twin brother
16:42 < stachu> hey Wombert
16:42 < stachu> does agavi support complexType?
16:44 < Wombert> stachu: hm?
16:45 < stachu> i am trying to understand soap in agavi and i want to create method which would return array
16:45 < stachu> for example array of products
16:46 < stachu> how shoud i do it
16:46 < stachu> ?
16:47 < Wombert> ah
16:47 < Wombert> well in the usual soap fashion ;)
16:47 < Wombert> create a type ArrayOfProducts
16:49 < stachu> maybe you have an examlpe?
16:50 < Wombert> mmmmh
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16:50 < Wombert> you need to make a complexType
16:50 < Wombert> and
16:50 < Wombert> mh
16:50 < Wombert> yes I can but not right now
16:51 < v-dogg> how do I control what char encoding eclipse uses?
16:51 < stachu> when i should ask for it?
16:52 < _cheerios> v-dogg, not 100% sure, but if you right-click on a project, there's an option for encodings.
16:52 < Wombert> v-dogg: you can set it globally and per project
16:52 < Wombert> eclipse still assumes iso
16:53 < Wombert> so does zend neon lala
16:53 < Wombert> it's appaling
16:53 < v-dogg> ah, thanks
16:53 < Wombert> and while you're at it, set line endings to unix
16:53 < v-dogg> send neon?
16:53 < Wombert> but that's not gonna help
16:53 < _cheerios> iso? it assumses utf-8 for me
16:53 < v-dogg> *zend
16:53 < Wombert> no, eclipse, pdt and zend neon default is iso
16:53 < _cheerios> maybe on a mac :)
16:54 < Wombert> no, _cheerios, everywhere
16:54 < Wombert> line endings sometimes work, and sometimes not, so you have 1000-line-commits from cow workers \n => \r\n
16:54 < v-dogg> mine says "Inherited from container (Cp1252)"
16:54 < Wombert> it's miserable
16:54 < Wombert> lawl that's even worse :p
16:54 < _cheerios> Wombert, shrug. I've never touched the encoding settings, it's used utf-8 always.
16:54 < v-dogg> triangle nads for eclipse (or windows)
16:55 < Wombert> no triangle nads, as a matter of fact
16:55 < Wombert> triangle nads indicate awesomeness
16:55 < Wombert> eclipse is far from awesome
16:55 < Wombert> _cheerios: I know for sure, it's always iso-8859-1
16:55 < v-dogg> turn your Finnish Sarcasm Detector on, please
16:55 < Wombert> I've seen it a million times on linux, windows and mac. always some encoding, but never utf8
16:56 < _cheerios> Wombert, it depends on your setup. my linux setup has been utf-8, so it picked that up.
16:56 < _cheerios> Probably the detection is just b0rked and makes the wrong choice for many, or they've had iso setups.
16:56 < jake> What editors/ide do folks in here use?
16:56 < Wombert> www.macromates.com
16:56 < jake> I'm feeling old because I still use vim :)
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16:58 < jake> Wombert what's the easiest way to specify an alternate template for a view, from a view?
16:58 < v-dogg> and how old are you, if you don't mind me asking jake?
16:58 < jake> 28
16:59 < v-dogg> jake: $this->getLayer()->setTemplate() iirc
16:59 < v-dogg> I'm 27 next month
16:59 < jake> I use emacs for scheme/lisp development, emacs for Java development, and vim for everything else
16:59 < jake> old bastard
16:59 < Wombert> $this->getLayer('content')->setTemplate('lolz');
16:59 < Wombert> w/o extension, mind you
17:00 < _cheerios> i thought v-dogg was like 46
17:00 < v-dogg> haha
17:00 < Wombert> __call overload for setParameter('template', 'lolz');
17:00 < Wombert> yeah _cheerios me too
17:00  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
17:00 < v-dogg> why why why? :D
17:00 < Wombert> we have tons of people in their 20s with bald hair here :p
17:00 < Wombert> okay well ross is 30 now :p
17:01 < Wombert> dude he's approaching 40 now real soon!
17:01 < jake> heh
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17:10 < jake> Wombert, for certain output_types I want the error handler to be different (e.g. don't output an html error for exceptions when the output type is png)
17:10 < jake> Thoughts?
17:11 < Wombert> <output_type name="png" exception_template="...">
17:11 < Wombert> ;)
17:11  * Wombert slaps jake around with some Agavi-always-sees-things-coming
17:12 < jake> heh, I figured there was a way. So that's in the output_types.xml?
17:22 < Wombert> yup
17:33 < jake> hmm. I've got a view that's using gd and imagepng, and agavi hates it
17:34 < Wombert> why
17:34 < Wombert> jake: you can set resources into the response btw
17:34 < Wombert> it will then fpassthru() them for you
17:34 < Wombert> works with caching, too
17:34 < jake> imagepng doesn't return a resource, it just outputs the image
17:34 < Wombert> if you have a sendfile capable web server like lighty, you can also tell agavi to use that instead of sending it itself
17:35 < Wombert> jake: hah but
17:35 < Wombert> you can write to a file
17:35 < Wombert> :)
17:35 < Wombert> and then
17:35 < Wombert> hang on
17:35 < jake> heh, but I don't want to write to a file :)
17:35 < jake> the image is generated using constantly changing data, and it's unique to each customer. I don't want to cache the image
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17:37 < Wombert> jake: streams to the rescue
17:37 < Wombert> :>
17:37 < jake> yeah that's what I was looking at
17:37 < Wombert> you could write to php://temp
17:37 < Wombert> I think
17:38 < jake> heh, except, of course imagepng takes a filename, not a resource to write to :)
17:38 < Wombert> yeah I think you need the same resource
17:38 < Wombert> but mh
17:38 < Wombert> 2 tics
17:39 < jake> ass clowns. sometimes I just hate php. Why would you accept a filename and not a resource?
17:39 < v-dogg> Wombert: btw, me and the missus were wondering how do you pronounce your name - the english way or the german way?
17:39 < Wombert> english
17:40  * Wombert has an australian daddy
17:40 < v-dogg> k :)
17:40 < Wombert> oh
17:40 < Wombert> query
17:42 < jake> hmm, I could write a custom renderer I guess
17:43 < Wombert> jake: or ob_start(); imagepng($img); $this->getResponse()->setContent(ob_get_contents()); ob_end_clean();
17:43 < jake> oh wait
17:43 < jake> yeah, that's what I just did :)
17:43 < Wombert> move that to a model :p
17:43 < jake> this is still for the 'migration', hacks abound
17:45 < Wombert> could add that to 1.0
17:45  * Wombert ponders
17:45 < Wombert> so you can set gd resources, I mean
17:45 < _cheerios> A380 sure looks comfy inside http://www.news.com/2300-11397_3-6213545-1.html
17:46 < Wombert> _cheerios: thanks I was looking for images of the actual SA interior
17:47 < _cheerios> they've *beds* !
17:47 < Wombert> _cheerios: that's nothing special
17:47 < Wombert> especially singapore airlines has had those for years in business class
17:47 < Wombert> full 2m beds that recline to a flat surface
17:48 < Wombert> well not double beds
17:48 < Wombert> ace
17:48 < _cheerios> "Passengers in all classes have access to 100 movies, 108 TV shows, 700 music albums and 22 audio channels--all on demand.
17:48 < _cheerios> Passengers can play, pause, rewind and resume video or audio at any time. In addition, 65 games are playable, including some Nintendo Game Boy Advance titles. The range will be increased to 120 in the future."
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17:49 < Wombert> what's the brown stuff in the cockpit
17:49 < _cheerios> looks like every passenger has an LCD screen infront of them
17:49 < Wombert> is that sun visors or HUDs?
17:49 < Wombert> yes, 11 inch for economy it said
17:50 < _cheerios> havent travelled much lately. never had LCD screens for me @ economy class.
17:51 < Wombert> me neither :p
17:51 < Wombert> all I ever had in economy was not enough legroom and asshats in front that reclined their seats
17:51 < Wombert> fockers
17:52 < _cheerios> economy = http://i.n.com.com/i/ne/p/2007/1026airbus17_440x286.jpg
17:52 < _cheerios> still as cramped, but atleast you can play games! :D
17:52 < Wombert> is that ethernet and usb ports?
17:52 < Wombert> oO
17:52 < _cheerios> yep
17:53 < _cheerios> more photos here http://www.news.com/2300-11397_3-6215473-1.html?tag=ne.gall.pg
18:12 < jake> Wombert, how do I use the user source for a route?
18:12 < jake> I have two routes. One should only match if the user is not authenticated, the other should match if the user has a particular credential
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18:21 < jake> looks like source="user[authenticated]" and source="user[credentials][Credential Name]"
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18:25 < jake> Does this route setup look right? http://pastebin.ca/751772
18:38 < Wombert> it's a bool cast, jake 
18:38 < Wombert> so ^1$ for true and ^$ for false
18:38 < Wombert> I believe
18:39 < Wombert> remember to anchor your patterns
18:39 < jake> yep. Do me a favor and check out that pastebin url
18:39 < Wombert> and that one route does not have a pattern
18:39 < Wombert> don't think that's gonna work
18:39 < jake> it does work
18:40 < jake> why is it important to anchor the patterns? Speed?
18:41 < Wombert> that, and for safety's sake
18:41 < Wombert> <route pattern="^/products" module="Foo" action="Bar />
18:41 < Wombert> then /productsZOMGHAXOR would match, too
18:41 < Wombert> so use
18:42 < Wombert> <route name="products" pattern="^/products" module="Products">
18:42 < Wombert>   <route pattern=".index" pattern="^$" action="Index" />
18:42 < Wombert>   <route pattern=".latest" pattern="^/latest" action="Latest" />
18:42 < Wombert> products.index etc
18:42 < Wombert> leading dot appends to parent value
18:42 < Wombert> works with acitons, too, for sub-actions
18:44 < jake> sure. okay, do the routes look okay though? I wasn't sure about that top level one not having a module, action, name, etc
18:44 < Wombert> that should work but I don't get the structure
18:44 < Wombert> you could move the stuff from the first subroute into the parent
18:45 < Wombert> also you need names to generate routes
18:45 < jake> yeah, since those are just the same as getBaseHref() I'm okay
18:46 < jake> well, if I move the stuff from the first subroute into the parent, and the callback returns false for onMatched, will the subroutes be used?
18:46 < _cheerios> Wombert, does source="" use accumulate ? eg. in that above example source="user[credentials][foo]" (Products) and then Latest with source="user[credentials][bar]" (needs foo+bar) ?
18:48 < Wombert> no, not gonna be used, jake
18:49 < jake> yeah, that's why the structure is as it is
18:49 < Wombert> didn't you say you were migrating an app
18:49 < Wombert> will you have a new url scheme some day?
18:49 < jake> yeah, probably
18:49 < Wombert> why are you doing this<route pattern="0" module="%actions.login_module%" action="%actions.login_action%" source="user[authenticated]" />
18:50 < Wombert> agavi does that if the action isSecure()
18:50 < Wombert> _cheerios: nope, processing stops on a match
18:50 < jake> If someone loads /, and they are logged in, I don't want them to go to the login action
18:50 < jake> but if they are not logged in, they should go to the login action
18:50 < _cheerios> k, nothing i'll ever need. was just curious.
18:51 < Wombert> jake: I'm not sure if that will work, I believe the first subroute without the pattern might always count as matched
18:51 < Wombert> so processing stops there
18:51 < Wombert> jake: but why do that via a route
18:51 < Wombert> the / action requires login, right?
18:51 < jake> no
18:51 < Wombert> return true in the action#s isSecure() and the user will be shown the login page if not logged in
18:51 < Wombert> eeeh?
18:51 < jake> that's not what I'm trying to do
18:51 < jake> I read those routes like this
18:54 < jake> if ( $url == "/" ) { if ( isKnown($HTTP_HOST) ) { $module = "Blog"; $action = "List"; } elseif ( !$user->isAuthenticated() ) { $module = "User"; $action = "Login"; } elseif ( $user->hasCredentials('Default Permissions') ) { $module = "Default"; $action = "UserDashboard"; } elseif ( $user->hasCredentials('Network Administrator') ) { $module = "Default"; $action = "AdminDashboard"; } }
18:55 < jake> I suppose you're right though, I could drop the part testing for the user being logged in since when they hit either of those other two actions they'll get sent to the login screen anyhow
18:56 < jake> well, no, I can't, since if the user isn't logged in both of those other routes will fail
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22:01 < _cheerios> http://www.google.com/webhp?complete=1&hl=en&q=terrorize (+ type a space, and wonder about the last result :))
22:01 < _cheerios> ZOMG http://www.google.com/webhp?complete=1&hl=en&q=agavi (+type space) 
22:01 < _cheerios> <3
22:02 < _cheerios> plant, php, framework, or... that is too funny :p
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01:36 < jake> I also got "Triangle nads" as an option. WTF is "agavi triangle nads"?
01:46 < Wombert> ahahahah :>
01:47 < Wombert> jake: http://agileweb.org/post/14990641 explains it :D
01:48  * Wombert nudges impl 
01:48 < Wombert> hai?
01:48 < impl> hai
01:55 < Wombert> :>
01:55 < Wombert> impl: my plan
01:56 < Wombert> butflux editor
01:56 < Wombert> wysiwyg xml in ze browser
01:56 < Wombert> docbook stylesheets
01:56 < Wombert> couchdb for storage (versions!)
01:56 < Wombert> => perfect online documentation editing tool for agavi
01:56 < impl> o_O
01:56 < impl> Sounds cool
01:56 < Wombert> shouldn't take me more than a handful of days to write
01:57 < Wombert> comments are just a property of the document
01:57 < Wombert> so if you submit a change, you can say "this and this comment is resolved by this fix"
01:57 < Wombert> => all awesome
01:58 < impl> :D
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02:44 < Wombert> zomg @ propel dev list
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02:53 < Wombert> these netsplits are too much for poor colloquy :p
02:54 < Wombert> impl: zomg some symfony fanboi asshat wants to fuck up my nested set work and make it LIKE SFPROPELACTASNESTEDSETPLUGIN UUUUUUH
02:54 < Wombert> wtf
02:54 < Wombert> and guess what, he's french
02:58 < shoan> whats the french connection?
03:01 < MrJeep> french from france or canadian ?
03:02 < Wombert> french, france
03:02 < Wombert> I guess
03:02 < Wombert> french canadians are cool :p
03:02 < MrJeep> hope you say that :P
03:02 < MrJeep> well, good night, actually I don't know what time is it where you are
03:02 < MrJeep> but here it's 11 pm and I have a real bad cold
03:02 < MrJeep> so
03:03 < MrJeep> see ya all later!
03:12 < Wombert> 4am
03:12 < Wombert> dst change!
03:21  * shoan is watching wwdc keynote
03:40 < Wombert> eh
03:40 < Wombert> stacks suck, spaces need improvement
03:40 < Wombert> time machine is a little slow, not sure why
03:40 < Wombert> mail is fucking awesome, sooooo fast and responsive
03:40 < Wombert> ical is great, too
03:40 < Wombert> looks very sexy
03:40 < Wombert> finder is much much improved as well
03:42 < shoan> you got leopard already?
03:45 < Wombert> yup
03:45 < shoan> cool
03:45 < shoan> still waiting for my pgrade
03:46 < shoan> upgrade
03:46 < Wombert> still on the ibook?
03:47 < shoan> got a macbook as well
03:47 < shoan> 2 macs now :)
03:52 < Wombert> cool
03:53 < Wombert> be sure to get plenty of ram :)
03:53 < shoan> i got 2G on the macbook and 512m on the ibook
03:54 < Wombert> don't try on the ibook then :p
03:55 < Wombert> anyway, off to bed
03:55 < Wombert> nn
03:55 < shoan> nite
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08:49 < _cheerios> ah, winter time! one more hour to work on projects today :p
08:58 < v-dogg> huomenta
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09:06 < MikeSeth> huomenta
09:06 < MikeSeth> Wombert_: I dug into Doctrine somewhat this weekend, man it's kickass but full of bugs :(
09:20 < _cheerios> oh really :)
09:31 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: yeah. Not critical, but annoying.
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09:51 < MikeSeth> hmmmm
09:51 < MikeSeth> can gettext strings embed html?
09:52 < _cheerios> begs the question, why would you do that
09:53 < v-dogg> I'm begining to like PDT
09:53 < _cheerios> i wouldnt mind using PDT, if it wasnt so slow when I did use it
09:54 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: just annoying little visual elements
09:54 < v-dogg> I just started a new project with it. let's see how slow it gets when the project grows
09:54 < _cheerios> but i might not have ran pdt with the vmargs setting. without that everything in eclipse was too slow to use.
09:54 < _cheerios> *shrug*
09:57 < v-dogg> this computer is and old hp desktop from the year 2005
09:58 < v-dogg> 1,5 Gb ram though
09:59 < _cheerios> mine is an oldie from 2001 (1Gb)
09:59 < v-dogg> ok :)
09:59 < v-dogg> can pdt/eclipse automatically override functions from base classes?
10:00 < _cheerios> it's a good comp for testing sites with too much JS fluff :D
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10:05 < _cheerios> (Wombert's mac is probably slower than my comp still, thus he complains about eclipse a lot more than me ;))
10:09 < v-dogg> hmm.. my action is secure when used normally but it also has to be accessible from another application with a single http request (authentication data is sent with the request)
10:10 < v-dogg> I could write an authentication filter, hack isSecure() and/or validate()
10:10 < v-dogg> opinions?
10:10 < v-dogg> filter sounds like a good idea
10:11 < v-dogg> because this functionality might spread to other actions too
10:15 < _cheerios> i'd like to see how that is done
10:16 < _cheerios> if it's going to be in multiple actions, maybe a catch-all route (like /rss) with that filter, to set the authenticated+credentials for the action to be run?
10:17 < v-dogg> actually, I can just do it like the sample app does cookie-based login in user::startup()
10:30 < MikeSeth> oooh
10:30 < MikeSeth> emacs has po-mode
10:30 < MikeSeth> victory :D
10:31 < _cheerios> has what?
10:32 < _cheerios> ah
10:32 < v-dogg> poo-mode
10:34 < _cheerios> only missing agavi<3 mode :D
10:34 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I'm working on it ;)
10:35 < _cheerios> did you check the google suggest for agavi? :)
10:35 < v-dogg> is there are shortcut to expand/collapse code folding per function?
10:35 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: I implemented this kind of thing by using an authentication override. In my case, a bot client authenticates around the normal logon mechanism
10:35 < v-dogg> in, eclipse/pdt :)
10:35 < _cheerios> probably. when you find it, let me know, i could use that :)
10:35 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: the user object checks if there are overriding auth credentials and uses them instead
10:36 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: ctrl + shift + l
10:36 < MikeSeth> that brings up a cheatsheep
10:36 < MikeSeth> cheathseet*
10:36 < MikeSeth> damnit!
10:36  * MikeSeth smacks $this
10:37 < v-dogg> ah, thanks
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10:39 < v-dogg> but expanding/collapsing doesn't work :(
10:39 < v-dogg> MikeSeth: this is how I did it in user::startup
10:40 < v-dogg> just like the sample app but not using a cookie but normal request parameters
10:40 < MikeSeth> should also work
10:40 < MikeSeth> agavi is flexible like that :D
10:41 < v-dogg> where did you do it?
10:41 < _cheerios> what do you pass in the request params? ?user=foo&pass=bar  ?
10:41 < v-dogg> yup
10:41 < v-dogg> (https baby)
10:42 < _cheerios> k :)
10:42 < v-dogg> and the pw is also hashed
10:42 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: in the user object and a special filter
10:43 < v-dogg> not that it really makes it any more secure :)
10:43 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: the filter detects HTTP authentication request and informs the User object that alternate logon credentials are present. During authentication, if there are alternate credentials, the User object uses them instead.
10:44 < v-dogg> ah, you use http auth, got it
10:44 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: it makes sense to map foreign agents to native authentication
10:45 < MikeSeth> besides, I really wanted the bot accounts to be heavily constrained in what they do, so security filter & ACL to the rescue
10:51 < Wombert_> v-dogg: now that I reinstalled, my mac is blazing fast :)
10:51 < Wombert_> also, do not use filters to do this auth stuff
10:51 < Wombert_> do it in User::startup()
10:52 < Wombert_> you could even consider creating a dedicarted context for that, with a NullStorage
10:53 -!- Wombert_ is now known as Wombert
10:54 < Wombert> and yes, http auth is much better!
10:54 < v-dogg> I don't see how it would be better for this
10:55 < v-dogg> the client only sends one http post. it's easy to add authentication data to that
10:56 < v-dogg> (and for the guy who codes the client it has to be as simple as possible :)
11:13 < Wombert> err
11:13 < Wombert> haha v-dogg 
11:13 < Wombert> come on :p
11:13 < Wombert> http://user:pass@...
11:13 < Wombert> is all you need!
11:13 < Wombert> that's not more difficult than appending query params
11:15 < v-dogg> didn't remember this user:pass@ syntax :D
11:16  * v-dogg blushes
11:16 < Wombert> it's the only way actually unless you want to use digest auth which really is a pain
11:16 < Wombert> $c = stream_context_create(array('http' => array('method' => 'post, 'content' => $postdata)));
11:16 < v-dogg> but when are those user and pw sent?
11:17 < Wombert> file_get_contents('http://user:pass@localhost/foo/bar', false, $c);
11:17 < v-dogg> the client first opens a socket (ssl) to mydomain.com and then sends those as a part of the http request?
11:18 < Wombert> maybe also send 'header'  => 'Content-type: application/x-www-form-urlencoded' as opt
11:18 < Wombert> yes
11:18 < Wombert> http://de3.php.net/manual/en/features.http-auth.php
11:19 < Wombert> that's how you read it then
11:20 < Wombert> if you're not using https and want things to be secure, you need digest auth
11:22 < v-dogg> but how is this better than plain post parameters? 
11:23 < v-dogg> taken that if in the future more than one request is needed, normal cookie based sessions can be used
11:27 < v-dogg> hmm.. now I need a http client again
11:27 < v-dogg> Zend or not to Zend
11:34 < Wombert> why
11:34 < Wombert> file_get_contents is enough
11:35 < Wombert> and you can send an http auth each time
11:35 < Wombert> or even ignore the http auth the second time and use the session
11:35 < Wombert> still possible
11:35 < MikeSeth> okay who put the path pattern parameter into the GetText translator?
11:35 < MikeSeth> raise hands
11:35 < MikeSeth> you get a hug.
11:35 < Wombert> I think it was dominik
11:36 < MikeSeth> ergo hug
11:36 < Wombert> could also be that I asked him to do that and then he yelled at me because it's additional work and then he wrote it :p
11:36 < MikeSeth> now you're fishing for affection :D
11:36 < MikeSeth> you people are life savers
11:36 < MikeSeth> I'd shoot myself if Agavi wasn't around
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11:38 < Wombert> nono, praise him, he wrote it after all ;)
11:59 < v-dogg> Wombert: with streams/file_get_contents how do I handle redirects and such?
11:59 < Wombert> it does for you
12:00 < Wombert> if there is a 404, however, then you get a warning, andno response content, and no way around that
12:00 < Wombert> it also does that on a 201 created or so
12:00 < Wombert> and that behavior is hardcoded in the http fopen wrapper
12:00 < Wombert> php devs are asshats
12:01 < Wombert> I wanted to write up a patch for that, but didn't get to it yet
12:07 < v-dogg> ok, thanks
12:24 < _cheerios> http://myp2p.eu/Other.htm anyone used?
12:26 < _cheerios> or some place to stream TV channels on linux?
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14:38 < _cheerios> load average: 157.75, 157.40, 151.75 = slow
14:52 < MikeSeth> uhm
14:52 < MikeSeth> is //foo[@class="something"][3] a valid xpath syntax?
14:52 < MikeSeth> e.g. element foo w/class something that is #3
15:00 < Wombert> yess
15:00 < Wombert> ah no
15:00 < Wombert> well
15:00 < Wombert> hang on
15:01 < Wombert> no
15:01 < Wombert> :p
15:01 < Wombert> what do you want
15:02 < Wombert> the third of the foos that has class something?
15:02 < Wombert> or the third child of a foo with class something
15:04 < Wombert> I'm not sure if that does what you think
15:04 < Wombert> it's a good question actually
15:04 < Wombert> /foo[@class="something"][3] I think selects all foos that have a class something, and from that, the third element
15:05 < Wombert> whereas //foo[@class="something" and position() = 3] would select the third foo if it also has "something" as class
15:05 < Wombert> also, consider situations where there are other classes on the element,MikeSeth 
15:06 < Wombert> so consider //foo[contains(@class, 'something')] instead
15:13 < MikeSeth> im looking for the former
15:13 < MikeSeth> point taken, let's try
15:15 < MikeSeth> doesn't work, expr[1] would return all matching items, expr[3] would return null
15:15 < MikeSeth> something is wrong.
15:18 < Wombert> and //foo[@class="something" and position() = 3]
15:18 < Wombert> ?
15:19 < Wombert> but I don't think that will work 
15:19 < Wombert> it will return the third node if it has something as class
15:19 < Wombert> not the third foo with something as class
15:19 < MikeSeth> b
15:21 < MikeSeth> oh, it can handle relative queries
15:21 < MikeSeth> screwn that then
15:51 < splatch`> helo
15:52 < splatch`> XPath in use :)
15:57 < Wombert> MikeSeth: mh?
16:00 -!- codecop [n=codecop@78-61-128-127.ip.zebra.lt] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
16:02 < Wombert> why not do $xpath->query('//foo[@class="something"]/*[3]');
16:02 < Wombert> that should work too
16:02 < Wombert> oh no
16:02 < Wombert> ofc not
16:02 < Wombert> but ->item(3) :p
16:04 < _cheerios> Leopard Upgraders Getting "Blue Screen of Death" ? Seems you were lucky, Wombert ! :D
16:04 < Wombert> uh oh
16:04 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@82.152.204.62] has joined #agavi
16:04 < Wombert> phone bricked
16:05 < Wombert> conneciton lost during firmware upgrade
16:05  * Wombert kicks his windows pc
16:05 < Wombert> ah no its still working
16:05 < Wombert> but wtf
16:05 < E_mE> huomenta!!
16:05  * E_mE Wants a Mac
16:06 < splatch`> E_mE: what for? ;)
16:06 < Wombert> LOL plugged it into a different usb port
16:06 < Wombert> and now
16:06 < E_mE> because its a lovly machine :D
16:06 < Wombert> windows installs drivers again
16:06 < E_mE> and i use to own a mac
16:06 < Wombert> oh man windows is suuuuuch a pain
16:06 < E_mE> whats wrong Wombert?
16:07 < Wombert> well the usb connection dropped while I flashed my phone
16:07 < Wombert> it still works but I decided to plug it into a different port
16:07 < E_mE> and i want Mac OS X too.. because its unix base :D
16:07 < Wombert> however, that installs all drivers again
16:07 < _cheerios> i had that happen with an external drive that had a bad connection
16:07 < Wombert> modem
16:07 < Wombert> foo
16:07 < Wombert> bar baz
16:07 < E_mE> eekk
16:07 < Wombert> ITS THE SAME FUCKING DEVIC WINDOWS
16:07 < Wombert> gaaah and twenty notifications
16:07 < Wombert> on a mac, you plug sth in and it works
16:07 < E_mE> remove all previous references of the phones drivers
16:07 < Wombert> on windows, to install a printer ZOMG INSTALL SOFTWARE FIRST OR EARTH WILL EXPLODE
16:08 < Wombert> E_mE: no... can't be bothered
16:08 < Wombert> then you install the software, which, in case of canon printers, creates a canon folder in c:\
16:08 < Wombert> and 20 icons and helper apps that run
16:08 < Wombert> then you restart
16:08 < E_mE> or what i prefer, kick! ;)
16:08 < Wombert> then you plug in the printer
16:08 < Wombert> then you restart again and then it works
16:09 < Wombert> on a mac, you plug it in, choose file->print, it's there right away, print, works, awesome
16:09 < E_mE> windows an printers can be quite a random challenge i find... so get very angry if you plug them in before you install the drivers
16:09 < Wombert> saves you 20 minutes or so
16:09 < E_mE> some what the printer plugged in first
16:09 < E_mE> blah blah blah and on and on
16:09 < Wombert> alrighty lets try teh update again
16:09 < E_mE> Wombert: you got Leapold yet?
16:10 < Wombert> if this bricks my phone for good, I'll go smack bill gates, then go kick michael dell, then call dell customer support and yell at then, then take the phone to nokia and toss it in their face
16:10 < Wombert> yes
16:10 < Wombert> but it's called leopard :p
16:11 < E_mE> well, if you call dell, you go throw there whole diaognaistics before you can tell them waht the problem is
16:11 < E_mE> ive been there many times
16:11 < E_mE> well, the CD drives is broken... well okay sir, can you please put in the diagonistics CD first and reboot
16:11 < Wombert> don't forget the indian accent ;)
16:11  * Wombert hugs shoan 
16:12 < E_mE> yes but the CD drive is dead... 
16:12 < E_mE> Wombert: yes
16:12 < Wombert> shoan: installed 10.5 yet?
16:12 < Wombert> FUCKING HELL IT HAPPENED AGAIN
16:12 < Wombert> gah
16:12  * E_mE will look how much it costs to rent Macbook Pro
16:12 < Wombert> rent?
16:12  * Wombert blinks
16:13 < _cheerios> you can be cool for a day renting a mac!
16:13 < Wombert> ah feck
16:13 < Wombert> I think now it's really dead
16:14 < E_mE> yes... you can rent the computers and then update it for the latest Mac in a couple of years
16:14 < E_mE> but its meerly a dream ;) hehehe
16:14 < E_mE> i want a MAC LAPTOP!! grrr
16:16 < E_mE> £58/mth
16:17 < Wombert> ...
16:17 < Wombert> and why don't you lease one
16:17 < Wombert> if you want one so badly
16:18 < E_mE> if i get that PHP Programmer job i might just do that ;)
16:19 < Wombert> leasing is cheaper than renting anyway (obviously)
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16:20 < E_mE> whats the difference 
16:40 < v-dogg> how does file_get_contents w/ stream_context handle http error codes (50x and fellows)?
16:47 < Wombert> as I said, it's gonna throw a warning and you cannot access the response content
16:48 < Wombert> no way to work around that
16:48 < Wombert> fopen() doesn't help either, it's in the stream wrapper
16:48 < Wombert> so you need to use fsockopen and do everything by hand
16:48 < Wombert> in almost 2008
16:48 < Wombert> cool, huh?
16:48 < Wombert> use curl, maybe
16:49 < _cheerios> curl <3
16:50 < Wombert> no it stinks
16:53 < _cheerios> pfft, lies
16:53 < v-dogg> Wombert: and when were you going to fix this wrongness?
16:53 < v-dogg> ;)
16:54 < Wombert> I was planning to have a look today but... uuuhm :p
16:54 < v-dogg> go go go
16:54 < Wombert> I've looked at the code
16:54 < Wombert> it should be simple
16:54 < Wombert> I just need to sit down to figure out this zend engine stuff
16:54 < v-dogg> your patch wont be accepted anyway
16:55 < Wombert> I think it would
16:55 < v-dogg> "Thanks for reporting this but this is not a bug. This is a feature and the behaviour is explained in the documentation. Thxbai"
16:55 < Wombert> heh
16:55 < Wombert> in fact, I just need to figure out how to read a context option value
16:55 < Wombert> it should be two or three lines, not more
16:55 < Wombert> I'll do it today :)
16:56 < Wombert> I just need to merge my propel branch first because otherwise those damn frenchie symfony fanbois are messing things up
16:56 < Wombert> "UUH IT MUST BE LIKE sfPropelActAsNestedSetPlugin UUUH UUUH UUUH"
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17:14 < impl> rofl
17:14 < impl> UUUH UUUH
17:18 < MikeSeth> 165457 <v-dogg> "Thanks for reporting this but this is not a bug. This is a feature and the behaviour is explained in the documentation.
17:18 < MikeSeth>                 Thxbai"
17:19 < MikeSeth> this is exactly what symfony people told me when I reported a bug in their database code that caused SQL functions' result aliases to be ignored, grouping the results with a numeric index instead
17:20 < MikeSeth> http://www.linux.com/feature/120359 
17:25 < Wombert> whhh
17:25 < Wombert> whhhhhhh
17:25 < Wombert> whhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
17:25 < Wombert> you uhm
17:25 < Wombert> :(
17:25 < Wombert> you used symfony?
17:25 < Wombert> :S
17:25 < MikeSeth> well actually
17:25 < MikeSeth> I tried most of these things
17:26 < MikeSeth> symfony was the last on the list and then it occured to me to check out how's Mojavi doing
17:26 < MikeSeth> guess which other frameworks went out of the window the moment I opened your trac ;)
17:27 < impl> ;o
17:29 < MikeSeth> it's ironic that symfony's developers' lameness pushed me to the extreme frustration that led me to agavi
17:29 < MikeSeth> i never believed a thing like this can happen unnoticed right under my nose xD
17:29 < impl> Makes you wonder whether there's more
17:30 < MikeSeth> maybe in private hands, but certainly not in public open source
17:30 < MikeSeth> there's a lot of pretending
17:31 < MikeSeth> there was this one guy on my blog who tried to convince me that everything shit and "Akelos framework" is not shit
17:32 < _cheerios> dbslayer! cool name
17:32 < MikeSeth> ironically, he was doing it in comments for an article that points out a major flaw in most frameworks, and it took me a minute to look up his docs 
17:32 < MikeSeth> his docs confirmed my suspicions verbatim
17:33 < MikeSeth> then of course I hit the main page
17:33 < MikeSeth> http://www.akelos.org/
17:33 < impl> Ports of RoR are such shit
17:33 < MikeSeth> impl: naturally
17:34 < MikeSeth> You have downloaded Akelos and made sure you'll be able to run PHP scripts from your console (not necessary to run Akelos, but it's required for this tutorial)
17:34 < MikeSeth> Now you can follow two paths:
17:34 < MikeSeth>    1. Create an Akelos application in a different folder and link it to the Framework libraries.
17:34 < MikeSeth>    2. Start coding your application from this folder with the security implications that has making available to the visitors of your site all your Application models, views, 3rd party libraries and so on.
17:34 < MikeSeth> that's the quintessence of 'retarded'
17:34 < impl> lawl.
17:34 < impl> Yes, yes it is.
17:35 < v-dogg> can't I create global models with agavi cli helper?
17:35 < impl> I think so
17:35 < MikeSeth> http://svn.akelos.org/trunk/docs/images/akelos_mvc.png <== FAIL
17:35 < impl> omg
17:35 < impl> hahah
17:35 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: the build script doesn't allow you, you need to specify a module
17:36 < v-dogg> that's a bug then
17:36 < impl> v-dogg: that script is such crap, it needs to be rewritten
17:36 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: I've been trying to figure out a way to get rid of the build scripts and do something natively nice for some time now
17:43 < MikeSeth> OH MY GOD
17:43 < MikeSeth> AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
17:43 < MikeSeth> final 100% proof that 99% of people do not understand MVC
17:44 < MikeSeth> http://images.google.co.il/images?q=mvc&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=N&tab=wi
17:45 < MikeSeth> http://heim.ifi.uio.no/~trygver/themes/mvc/MVC-2006.gif <= five tons of fail
17:47 < impl> what the fuck
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17:53 < MikeSeth> don't ask me
17:55 < v-dogg> how can I tell eclipse to trim whitespace when saving a file=?
17:56 < Arme[N]> shit I cant see that MVC-2006, its filterd here!!
17:56 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: you didnt miss a lot
17:57 < Arme[N]> hehe
17:58 < MikeSeth> http://images.google.co.il/images?q=mvc
18:05 < Arme[N]> forwarding to an action of a module is hany (IMHO) but in some framework such as CodeIgniter and Kohana there is no such ability, when I ask why there is no such ability those reply its against of MVC! 
18:05 < Arme[N]> I totally dont understand why?
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18:07 < MikeSeth> morons who can't tell a dispatcher from a controller shouldnt meddle with MVC architecture
18:08 < MikeSeth> if that was against MVC, MVC would be impossible outside of Web, and it was invented for that purpose in first place
18:09 < Arme[N]> hmmm
18:11 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: in the original MVC, there was no notion of templates, because views were actually hooked up into a windowing system
18:12 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: if the original mvc were to rely on the web model of request/response then the software would never be able to show anything new without the user pressing a button immediately before
18:15 < MikeSeth> if there's no forwarding between actions (or rather, complex controller state transitions), then it's effectively impossible to do anything without a message stack, and with a message stack it's even more retarded because you press a button and thirty windows that cropped up in last fifteen minutes pop uip
18:15 < _cheerios> "MVC would be impossible outside of Web, and it was invented for that purpose in first place" them hippie engineers in the seventies saw the web coming! :D
18:15 < MikeSeth> up*
18:15 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I meant that it was invented to work outside Web, in a loop model where requests aren't unidirectional or separate from each other
18:16 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: I may be wrong, but I believe the standard MVC solution for complex controller cases is subcontrollers
18:17 < MikeSeth> that's a necessity anyway in a windowed system
18:17 < MikeSeth> there isn't really a single event coming from the same place and landing into the same place
18:19 < v-dogg> the standard mvc model relied heavily on events and observers
18:19 < MikeSeth> yep
18:20 < MikeSeth> people think about MVC in terms of web applications, and make assumptions that aren't founded in MVC's logic
18:28 < v-dogg> wtf
18:28 < v-dogg> Error: Can't move 'I:\SVN\SmsGateway\db\transactions\5-1.txn\rev' to 'I:\SVN\SmsGateway\db\revs\6': The system cannot find the path specified.    
18:28 < v-dogg> after SVN commit
18:28 < v-dogg> and the commit fails
18:30 < Arme[N]> MikeSeth: thanks Mike
18:31 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: for what?
18:31 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: ooooh, repo suckage? :(
18:32 < Arme[N]> MikeSeth: for description
18:32 < _cheerios> DUDE, WHERE'S YOUR PATH
18:33 < Arme[N]> for sure I'm one of 99% of people which don't know any thing about MVC
18:33  * Arme[N] sighs
18:34 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: oh
18:35 < Arme[N]> MikeSeth: :P
18:35 < MikeSeth> Arme[N]: I think it's much more easy to understand - and interesting - when you take it in its historical context
18:35 < Arme[N]> yes I just kidding
18:35 < MikeSeth> it always helps to understand both the solutions and the challenges that prompted them
18:35  * MikeSeth smacks Arme[N] :D
18:36 < Arme[N]> :D
18:38  * _cheerios pictures Mike with hot coal rods, a menacing glare and shouts of HAS U UNDERSTANGING? to cowworkers.
18:39 < _cheerios> iowait 70... this is taking forever
18:42 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: actually, I've trained a guy
18:42 < MikeSeth> had him move texts from templates to gettext in one of Agavi apps we have
18:43 < MikeSeth> he said gettext feels clunky and uncomfortable compared to Agavi's niceness 
18:44 < MikeSeth> I told hi m he can use the simple translator and encode the text in config XML manually if so inclined ;)
18:47 < MikeSeth> voila! now I grok xpath! :D
18:47 < _cheerios> moving text from templates to gettext? gettext~~agavi? *shrug* you sure gave him a boring job
18:48 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: it's ok, next time he'll know when to use the translation manager and how to set it up, then we can just have the content monkeys write .po files
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19:44 < splatch`> hello
20:06 < _cheerios> uh huh
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20:25 < MikeSeth> #
20:25 < MikeSeth> while($r=mysql_fetch_array($display))
20:25 < MikeSeth> #
20:25 < MikeSeth> {       
20:25 < MikeSeth> #
20:25 < MikeSeth> $username=$r["username"];
20:25 < MikeSeth> these people make me cry
20:29 < _cheerios> you have to begin somewhere!!!
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21:13 < _cheerios> whom here as a vpn from their home box to ze office?
21:15 < MikeSeth> is ssh tunnel a vpn?
21:15 < _cheerios> shrug. i've used these technologies so little.
21:17 < Wombert> not yet, _cheerios 
21:17 < Wombert> why?
21:17 < Wombert> well I have other VPN accounts I use
21:17 < Wombert> I believe v-dogg has such a thing
21:18 < _cheerios> just seeking advice. i need to setup a secure connection between home&work soon, and was wondering how the dynamic IP part is handled, so that the connection doesn't drop all the time.
21:20 < Wombert> dynamic ip at work?
21:21 < _cheerios> at home :)
21:21 < Wombert> eh?
21:22 < Wombert> you are opening a connection to work
21:22 < Wombert> not the other way round
21:22 < _cheerios> well, i'd be doing it the other way around too
21:22 < _cheerios> so work comes to me :)
21:22 < Wombert> oh?
21:22 < Wombert> errrr
21:22 < Wombert> why
21:22 < _cheerios> a requirement
21:22 < Wombert> what do you need
21:23 < _cheerios> on the vpn front? no idea. havent had time to look around much.
21:24 < Wombert> no
21:24 < Wombert> what do you want to do
21:24 < _cheerios> have the work machine able to connect to my box, and vice versa
21:24 < Wombert> ... yes, but _why_
21:24 < _cheerios> to be able to do work!
21:25 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: ssh would do most of the things you need
21:25 < Wombert> I'm not sure you understand what exactly a vpn does
21:25 < MikeSeth> ahh Wombert ever so tactful ;)
21:26 < _cheerios> gee :D
21:31 < _cheerios> i have a komplikated taste :)
21:36 < Wombert> I mean, how does it help you
21:36 < Wombert> the effect of a VPN is that you are virtually working at the remote site
21:43 < _cheerios> two way? if i can make it work from home to work, i'd like to be able to contact my home box from work too.
21:47 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: with linux boxes, you don't really need anything more than ssh for everyday work
21:47 < _cheerios> yer, the usual tool
21:47 < impl> we use openvpn, but it kinda sucks
21:47 < MikeSeth> I used freeswan
21:48 < MikeSeth> it was super bitchy with setup, but worked nicely 
21:48 < impl> I think IPSEC is prly the way it's 'supposed' to be done
21:48 < MikeSeth> we traded anime across all continents on our vpn :D
21:48 < impl> not weird SSL-encrypted-UDP tunnels
21:49 < Wombert> I hate openvpn
21:49 < v-dogg> _cheerios: we use firewall boxes with built-in vpn. one co-worker has dynamic ip and everytime it changes we have to re-config the box in the office
21:49 < Wombert> I heart ipsec
21:49 < Wombert> :)
21:49 < MikeSeth> well, freeswan *IS* ipsec
21:49 < v-dogg> but it's not too dynamic after all :)
21:49 < MikeSeth> though it's discontinued iirc
21:49 < _cheerios> v-dogg, yeah, i was afraid of something like that :)
21:49 < Wombert> pkefc :p
21:49 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: routing was so painful
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--- Day changed Mon Oct 29 2007
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03:27 < shoan> Wombert: whats wrong with openvpn?
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07:22 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:39 < Whisller> hi
07:59 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #agavi
07:59 < _cheerios> huomenta
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08:11 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
08:13 < _cheerios> :)
09:01 < MikeSeth> huomenta!
09:17 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has joined #agavi
09:18 < E_mE> huomenta! 
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09:36 < MikeSeth> weee
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10:17 < _cheerios> <3<33<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3 AGAVI TRIANGLE NADS INVASION <3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3
10:18 < v-dogg> woot woot woot
10:23 < E_mE> gggrr! how can a company allow users to ONLY use IE5 or 6 to access there site :/  %$*&£$£
10:24 < v-dogg> haha
10:24 < v-dogg> send them hate mail
10:24 < E_mE> dlibrary.com.au
10:24 < E_mE> wankers!
10:24 < v-dogg> can't find the server
10:25 < E_mE> www.dlibray.com.au
10:25 < E_mE> www.dlibrary.com.au
10:25 < E_mE> :o it even asks on the registration form what OS you use.. and has Windows, MacOS or other
10:25 < E_mE> how you ment to get to the page with Other!!!! 
10:27 < E_mE> hehehe it wants extra information as part of the registration process... /me Rants away!
10:29 < _cheerios>  -> User-Agent "Internet Explorer 6.0 (Y RLY)"
10:30 < E_mE> hehehe
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10:48 < malax> HUOMENTA!
10:51 < malax> I want to add an error for a field in a action. I know i can get the ValidationManager via the current ExecutionContainer but there is no method which seems to fit my needs.
10:52 < malax> Has someone an idea how to do that?
11:04 < MikeSeth> malax: you may want to use the form population filter to do that
11:04 < MikeSeth> malax: it knows how to grab validator errors and embed them into the form's HTML
11:07 < malax> Jep, but i want to add an error in the action for field "foobar" which i cannot validate with a Validator.
11:09 < malax> An the FPF should display a fancy error then. wobert told me a few weeks ago that this is possible. But i forgot how :-/.
11:15 < MikeSeth> malax: I don't remember off the top of my head either, but FPF can do that
11:15 < shoan> malax: why don't you look through the irc logs. The channel topic has the url
11:20 < malax> shoan: he talked to me face to face, i hope this is not logged too. ;-)
11:21 < shoan> :)
11:21 < malax> MikeSeth: hmmm, i'll look into that... thanks to far! :)
11:29 < malax> Got it... Just i case someone googles or read the logs:
11:29 < malax> $this->getContainer()->getValidationManager()->setError("fieldName", "My wonderful errormessage");
11:29 < malax> Adds the error "My wonderful errormessage" to the field "fieldName" just like a validator will do.
11:33 < MikeSeth> yep :D
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11:55 < MikeSeth> http://phpnamespaces.org/wiki/
11:55 < MikeSeth> EPIC FAIL
11:57 < _cheerios> someone will be looking into spam protection...
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13:24  * Wombert hugs malax
13:25 < E_mE> NEVER EVER LET AN ACCOUNTANT TRY AND SETUP A COMPUTER SYSTEM!!
13:25 < E_mE> they will fuck you over for there benefit!
13:26 < _cheerios> is there some meat to this wisdom?
13:27 < MikeSeth> http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/lolcats-funny-pictures-blink.jpg
13:28 < E_mE> well my Fincial controller is expecting sales processors to setup Bill of matrial items... which consists of booking off 12 different codes of stock out of the system and contra'ing it back onto one code
13:28 < E_mE> which all in all takes 5-10 minutes
13:28 < E_mE> and if a custoemr is waiting for you to do that.. well ... they will either fall asleep or just forget you
13:28 < _cheerios> MikeSeth :)
13:34 < E_mE> no i would like to write a solution to this... but i'm not touching SAGE's API
14:04 < Wombert> wot
14:04 < Wombert> furniture :>
14:04 < Wombert> finally
14:08 < MikeSeth> pics or it didn't happen
14:08 < MikeSeth> :D
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14:08 < Wombert> not today
14:08 < Wombert> tomorrow, when the chairs are delivered :)
14:09 < E_mE> how long ago did you order your furniture?
14:12 < Wombert> hmm
14:12 < Wombert> four weeks or so?
14:12 < Wombert> yeah I think
14:12 < Wombert> and four or five for the chairs
14:12 < Wombert> those have a long delivery time
14:12 < Wombert> but they are ace :)
14:12 < E_mE> wow... where they fron
14:14 < E_mE> sounds like a very long time for them to arrive... or they been made for you ... on the backs of vrigins =P
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14:15 < E_mE> you got a link to a picture Wombert?
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14:16 < Wombert> nope
14:16 < Wombert> the furniture is just being delivered
14:16 < Wombert> or do you mean the chairs?
14:16 < E_mE> the chairs
14:16 < Wombert> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeron_chair
14:16 < Wombert> there's a product link there too
14:18 < MikeSeth> "The chair became a symbol of the rise and fall of the dot-com industry in the late 1990s. "
14:18 < MikeSeth> uh oh :D
14:19 < ttj> I want an Aeron chair too!
14:20 < Wombert> ttj: bitXtender > Nokia
14:20 < Wombert> :>
14:21 < Wombert> http://blog.bitxtender.com/post/17657809 wuhar
14:21 < ttj> Wombert: True. :-)
14:23 < Wombert> WAH
14:23 < splatch`> hello
14:23 < Wombert> MAIL ATE SOME IMAP FOLDERS
14:23 < Wombert> ZOMG
14:23 < splatch`> when agavi will start? :)
14:23 < splatch`> agavi site
14:23 < Wombert> ah no it didn't
14:23 < Wombert> splatch`: I'll start working on it soon
14:23 < splatch`> cool! :)
14:24 < Wombert> I'm just very busy at the moment, but I'll get back to darek as soon as I have time
14:24 < Wombert> there are lots of evil plans already on how to proceed over the next months
14:24 < Wombert> don't worry, there is going to be progress
14:25 < E_mE> very nice chairs there
14:25 < splatch`> Wombert: this week darek have holidays :)
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15:37 < Wombert> wu, zah
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16:29 < E_mE> Wombert: those chairs look rather snazzy
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16:43 < MrJeep_> agavi is now in the business environment
16:44 < MrJeep_> i mean in "a"
16:46 < _cheerios> amazon is addictive <3
16:47 < MrJeep_> hehe agree
16:49 < _cheerios> 3 more books on route. x-mas gifts :D
16:54 < Wombert> MrJeep_: hmm? :)
16:55 < MrJeep_> I'll be using Agavi a lot at my new job
16:55 < MrJeep_> for a lot of projects
16:55 < MrJeep_> open source projects
16:55 < Wombert> oO
16:57 < _cheerios> sweet
17:03 < E_mE> I hope i get this job i;m applying for
17:07 < E_mE> and i will be pushing agavi on there heads!
17:07 < E_mE> i shall say... agavi or your heads you designer mofos..
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17:50 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, i looked up ssh tunneling. good stuff.
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18:14 < _cheerios> amazon reviews to rescue when looking for a solid router <3
18:22 < _cheerios> 144,5e to setup a wireless home network o_O
18:32 < v-dogg> meaning what? 144 is a hell of lot for a normal wlan router
18:33 < _cheerios> adsl w/wlan + wlan router
18:36 < _cheerios> i dont want ethernet cables around my apartment this time...
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20:29 < MrJeep_>  Wombert, do you know if it's possible to reverse-engeneer a database with propel ? Starting with a database and then create a schema
20:36 < _cheerios> the propel manual has an entry on that, uses that older DB adapter propel used (in 1.2) for it. the schemas were not as pretty as hand-made, iirc
20:38 < MrJeep_> well, I've been looking at the propel user guide... but somehow I think I've missed it
20:38 < MrJeep_> (I'm so damn tired :(
20:40 < MrJeep_> FOUND IT :D
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22:01 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: pay attention to the dynamic port allocation, it acts like a socks proxy
22:01 < _cheerios> dynamic port allocation?
22:02 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: yeah, the -D option
22:02 < _cheerios> ah, havent checked that out. was doing basic -L
22:04 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: I use -D when tunnelling into work. Then I can browse/access local machines in the browser, having it configured with a proxy that is local ssh endpoint
22:07 < _cheerios> what would be the easiest way to get a clean $template (without any of the context baggage) ?
22:07 < MikeSeth> there's no context stuff in $template
22:07 < MikeSeth> ..is there?
22:08 < _cheerios> i got a 60meg vardump on $template
22:08 < MikeSeth> oww, vardump array_keys instead ;)
22:09 < _cheerios> hmm?
22:09 < MikeSeth> var_dump(array_keys($template)) 
22:09 < MikeSeth> :P
22:10 < _cheerios> ah, on this app i was stuffing the template with a lot of settings to work with Smarty. hmmms.
22:11 < MikeSeth> there's a new smarty renderer I hear
22:11 < _cheerios> i made my own earlier, probably covered. but will check it out when its out 
22:14 < _cheerios> ah, rossco's Flash class is set as an attribute, which holds the context
22:16 < _cheerios> i have a stupid idea i want to test out, but it might require a lot of agavi tweaking
22:17 < _cheerios> basically i want to gather all the generated variables of an action. stop time. process template later.
22:19 < _cheerios> well, action+view. there's no after-view hooks available, so i probably have to grab all the data in the renderer?
22:20 < _cheerios> and i have until thursday to have a working prototype :|
22:21 < MikeSeth> what's the purpose of that, and how is that different from moving the rendering into a filter, passing it data through the global request object?
22:21 < _cheerios> i need the variables. that way i can re-run the template later, without the client.
22:22 < MikeSeth> why not just save the materialized result for later lookup?
22:22 < _cheerios> a result of what?
22:22 < MikeSeth> of rendering
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22:23 < MikeSeth> perhaps if you could explain the actual problem 
22:23 < MikeSeth> because I don't see why'd one want to do what you're describing
22:23 < _cheerios> that's because i'm insane, but that's not helping me tackle this problem
22:23 < MikeSeth> which likely means that I don't understand what you're doing
22:24 < _cheerios> think of it as large-scale live debugging :D
22:24 < MikeSeth> do not want :D
22:24 < _cheerios> i do, and hence i need to solve this in about 24+hrs
22:25 < _cheerios> how could a filter help? filters are run before an action, or before a view?
22:26 < _cheerios> or not, heh
22:29 < _cheerios> some anime before sleep... i'll try a filter tomorrow, execution+time filters should go long way in guiding me
22:30 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: before and after
22:30 < MikeSeth> _cheerios: the filters are double-sided: they wrap around the subsequent execution
22:32 < _cheerios> if i manage to capture all require data, how would i run the same action while only populating it (no need for action+view to be run) for renderer to chew on it?
22:37 < MikeSeth> I suppose you can write your own execution filter
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22:51 < shoan> huomenta
22:51  * shoan yawns
22:52 < shoan> never been up at 4 am before ;)
22:53 < MikeSeth> yes, bed should be good idea
23:04 < Wombert> _cheerios: a wireless router shouldn't run you more than 100 bucks max w/ modem built in
23:05 < Wombert> MrJeep: yes propel can reverse engineer existing databases
23:05 < _cheerios> wlan router + adsl with wlan
23:05 < Wombert> eh?
23:05 < Wombert> adsl with wlan?
23:05 < Wombert> you have a wlan router :p
23:05 < Wombert> just buy a router with built-in modem, done
23:05 < _cheerios> yeah, but the phone jacket is in an awful place. i'd have to run ethernet cables thru my apartment
23:06 < Wombert> eeeh?
23:06 < Wombert> why don't you put the router next to the modem
23:06 < Wombert> that's the point of a wireless network :p
23:06 < _cheerios> it's still 2 piecs of hardware
23:06 < Wombert> or do you want cable ethernet at your pc
23:06 < Wombert> and bridge via wifi?
23:07 < Wombert> no, there are routers with built in modems, as I said
23:07 < _cheerios> yes, and ???
23:07 < Wombert> plug the router into the phone jacket, done.
23:08 < _cheerios> it's an adsl connection...
23:08 < Wombert> ehm?
23:08 < Wombert> what?
23:08 < Wombert> no?
23:08 < Wombert> the router makes the connection for you?
23:09 < _cheerios> scenario: homecomp, no wlan. phonejacket is like 10m away. solution: buy adsl w/router&wlan, buy a wlan-router, connect homecomp to wlan-router to access adsl?
23:11 < Wombert> no
23:11 < Wombert> solution: buy a wlan router kit w/ built in modem and usb wlan dongle for less than 100 bucks
23:11 < Wombert> plug router into phone jacket
23:12 < Wombert> plug usb wlan into computer
23:12 < Wombert> done
23:12 < Wombert> you're really making things too complicated there I think :p
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23:14 < _cheerios> that's one option, sure. not sure how much single dongles cost. plus the quality of such kits.
23:14 < Wombert> _cheerios: they are all fine, it's 2007, they all work
23:15 < Wombert> and a dongle is less than 20 euros
23:15 < Wombert> and as I said, you get a kit with a dongle for way less than 100 bucks
23:15 < _cheerios> ive seen wireless connections drop a lot whenever ive been using them
23:15 < _cheerios> even in 2007 :)
23:15 < Wombert> me not
23:15 < Wombert> never, actually
23:15 < Wombert> unless the reception was really bad, which is not gonna be the case
23:15 < Wombert> anway
23:15 < Wombert> home time
23:16 < Wombert> office is tidy and shiny :>
23:16 < Wombert> just waiting for ze chairs =)
23:17 < _cheerios> what brand router?
23:17 < Wombert> linksys are good
23:17 < Wombert> have had no problems with netgear either
23:17 < Wombert> belkin and dlink suck sometimes
23:17 < Wombert> but
23:17 < Wombert> really gotta go
23:17 < Wombert> see you tomorrow
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--- Day changed Tue Oct 30 2007
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07:13 < Whisller> hi
07:14 < MikeSeth> hallo
07:14 < v-dogg> huomenta
07:14 < MikeSeth> huomenta
08:15 -!- RossC0 [n=RossC0@80.4.120.163] has joined #agavi
08:16 < RossC0> Huomenta!
09:00 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #agavi
09:00 < _cheerios> huomenta
09:04 < v-dogg> MikeSeth: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/5193092.stm <- watch out, the anti-christ is coming your way
09:04 < v-dogg> (read on from "Gift from God" )
09:06 < MikeSeth> v-dogg: I know very well because I used to be involved with these people
09:06 < MikeSeth> they are creepy people
09:06 < MikeSeth> faith corrupts their minds and makes them deviants
09:07 < RossC0> End theory?
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09:40 < MikeSeth> RossC0: hmm?
09:42 -!- shoan [n=shoan@122.166.1.164] has joined #agavi
09:44 < splatch`> hello RossC0!
10:04 < RossC0> hello!
10:05 < RossC0> MikeSeth - End theory is the loony Christians theory for the second coming and judgement day
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10:12 < MikeSeth> RossC0: it's a little bit more complicated than that
10:12 < MikeSeth> but basically, yes, rapture and all fun associated with it
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10:32 < _cheerios> religion is for nutters
10:33 < RossC0> thats a sweeping statement
10:34 < RossC0> I read a funny article recently asking "why Atheists all seem to be angry"
10:34 < _cheerios> they listen to heavy metal and play video games?
10:35 < RossC0> I think people should either be pragmatic, or join my new Cult 
10:37 < RossC0> on the premise - if your going to be a religious nut - why not pay me (to save your sole) and belong to my groups of religious nuts.. 
10:38 < RossC0> (*sole - I'm actually a cobbler and don't have any experience in saving souls - but hopefully no one will notice the typo (well only until after they paid))
10:38 < RossC0> brb
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10:44 < splatch`> RossC0 my friend :)
10:46 < _cheerios> "im in the saving soles business"
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11:18 < RossC0> I know very Terry Pratchett
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12:15 < shoan> Wombert: :((
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12:40 < Xylakant> hi all
12:40  * Xylakant pokes wombert
12:41 < RossC0> heh Xylakant
12:42 < Xylakant> i noticed a problem with the AgaviWebResponse: the status code sent by agavi always forces HTTP/1.1 even when the request was sent with HTTP/1.0
12:42 < Xylakant> which leads to problems with clients that speak only HTTP/1.0
12:42 < Xylakant> is that by design or an oversight?
12:49 < Xylakant> hmm. no response...
12:58 < kaos|work> Xylakant: he's having lunch
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13:00 < Xylakant> guten appetit
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13:06 < Xylakant> IIRC, there was a list in the wiki with all attributes that agavi sets on the request - but I seem unable to find it
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13:31 < Xylakant> ok, http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/604 for the protocol mismatch behaviour. A patch is attached but might need a little bit of polishing
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14:10 < MrJeep_> good morning
14:12 < Xylakant> morning? 
14:12 < Xylakant> good morning to you ;)
14:16 < MrJeep_> hehe
14:17 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
14:34 < MrJeep_> which means ?
14:44 < Xylakant> cu all
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14:54 < v-dogg> MrJeep_: you don't know what HUOMENTA means?
14:54 < v-dogg> and how long have you been on this channel?-)
14:57  * RossC0 cries
14:58 < v-dogg> see, now you made RossC0 cry!
14:59 < v-dogg> apologize, kiss (no tongue) and make up!
14:59 < RossC0> eww
14:59  * RossC0 cries some more
15:03 < MrJeep_> `:-S
15:04 < MrJeep_> I was too shy to ask :-S
15:04 < v-dogg> it means "morning" in Finnish :)
15:05 < v-dogg> ze official agavi greeting
15:05 < MrJeep_> sorry for ruining your day RossC0
15:05 < v-dogg> yeah, I know, we are weird :)
15:05 < MrJeep_> lol!
15:06 < v-dogg> ("we" as in WE HERE IN ZE CHANNEL, not here in Finland!)
15:07 < Spica_> Why not in Finland as well?
15:08 < Spica_> I would consider it a slightly questionable habit when people voluntarily go into a very hot room, throw water on the stove to make it even hotter and then run out to play in the snow (naked).
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15:10 < Wombert> Spica_: ACK
15:10 < Wombert> but that's what the finns are like
15:10 < Wombert> that's why we love thenm
15:10 < Wombert> they are so weird :)
15:10  * Wombert hugs v-dogg 
15:10  * Wombert hugs _cheerios 
15:11 < Wombert> WHERE IS HORROS :<
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16:14 < Wombert> ZE CHAIRS ARE HERE ZE CHAIRS ARE HERE
16:14 < Wombert> :>
16:21 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@89.104.225.117] has joined #agavi
16:22 < E_mE> huomenta1
16:27 < E_mE> does anyone know of any software that can monitor if a connection is alive between to computers
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17:42 < MrJeep_> the chairs ?
17:42 < MrJeep_> what were you sitting on then ?
17:42 < MrJeep_> buckets ?
17:45 < shoan> lol
17:50 < Wombert> crappy chairs
17:50 < Wombert> :>
17:50 < Wombert> I'll take pics tomorrow
17:52 < Wombert> bai
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17:58 < _cheerios> woot woot
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18:55  * Wombert pokes eremit 
18:55  * eremit pokes back
18:55 < eremit> heyja :)
18:55 < Wombert> you still alive!
18:55 < Wombert> :)
18:55 < Wombert> leopard installed yet?
18:55 < eremit> yeah kind of ... 
18:55 < eremit> no ... and most likely i will not install it within near future :)
18:55 < Wombert> you're not coming to the php conference by any chance are you
18:56 < eremit> nop sorry ... 
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20:26 < jake> query
20:26 < jake> Templates often need additional stylesheets and javascript files
20:26 < jake> However, it's ideal to include those in the header instead of the body
20:27 < jake> What's the best way to accomplish this?
20:27 < jake> Just do something like appendAttribute('js', 'somefile.js') in the template and then use js appropriately in the header?
20:30 < _cheerios> View/addCss(lovely.css)
20:31 < _cheerios> View/addJs(ooomph.js)
20:53 < impl> Yeah, I just append them to a request attribute
20:54 < jake> that's what I'm doing :)
20:55 < jake> The only thing is, I'm using the yui toolkit, which has debug, min, and regular versions of the code
20:56 < jake> So I'm contemplating how I want to deal with that since obviously the yui environment should reflect the agavi environment
21:04 < _cheerios> good, for a moment i thought you were appending those files in the templates
21:07 < jake> I am
21:07 < jake> why would I want to have someone exit template editing to add css or javascript?
21:07 < jake> When they can just do {$rq->appendAttribute('js','somefile.js','myns')} in the template?
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21:10 < _cheerios> food for the brain!
21:27 < _cheerios> upgraded php, new apc version, and phpmyadmin won't work with it. geez.
21:29 < _cheerios> luckily there are workarounds!
21:43 < Wombert> jake: yes that's what I do
21:43 < Wombert> well you should do it in the view
21:43 < Wombert> not in the template
21:43 < Wombert> imo
21:44 < Wombert> you can either use request attributes, or template attributes
21:44 < Wombert> request attributes are typically the better choice because then, slots can say "hey I need that css file"
21:48 < jake> Well, I look at it like this, which type of developer is looking to add/change css and js files? UI guys. I don't want them to have to dive into the view to do that
21:49 < jake> but with a request attribute it doesn't matter, they can set it in either place
21:49 < Wombert> jake: then at least make helper methods for that in the view
21:49 < Wombert> addJavascript
21:49 < Wombert> addStylesheet
21:49 < Wombert> and so on
21:49 < Wombert> you have $view in the template, auto-assigned
21:49 < jake> sure
21:50 < Wombert> which reminds me, that should probably not be possible
21:50 < jake> I am totally avoiding writing this code. I'm doing all this minutia crap that is totally unneeded
21:50 < jake> what should not be possible?
21:50 < Wombert> mh no
21:50 < Wombert> I meant it should be possible to disable certain assigns
21:57 < Wombert> http://trac.agavi.org/ticket/605
21:57 < Wombert> that
21:57 < Wombert> :)
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--- Day changed Wed Oct 31 2007
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02:53 < shoan> huomenta!
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06:54 < v-dogg> huomenta
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07:17 < Whisller> hi
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08:11 < RossC0> HUOMENTA!
08:20 -!- _cheerios [i=jussiava@cs181073202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #agavi
08:20 < _cheerios> huomenta
08:21 < _cheerios> Your Amazon.com order has shipped \o/ 1/3 on the way :p
08:22 < ttj> Just got more theater tickets. \o/
08:23 < ttj> Right now I have 442e worth of theater tickets on the table. :P
08:24 < ttj> Now I just have to see if I can ever get my money back from the student association. :P
08:28 < _cheerios> btw. someone good here with networking? im wondering what kind of equipment is needed, at minimum, to share a single internet connection (wireless access point) between two computers (desktop+laptop) in a way that i can establish a connection from the internet to this IP, and port forward to the correct comp (desktop/laptop)?
08:28 < _cheerios> ttj, just $70 books for me :
08:29 < ttj> Ugh, Legal Aspects in Computing exam in 2.5 hours. Still need to read the slides. Catch you people later.
08:30 < _cheerios> is that 2 tickets or more? theater is expensive!
08:31 < ttj> 10 tickets.
08:33 < MikeSeth> huomenta
08:38 < v-dogg> Fatal error: Call to undefined function fromUtf8() in /.../libs/agavi/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php on line 428
08:38 < v-dogg> heh, missing $this-> if I'm not mistaken
08:46 < CIA-30> v-dogg * r2168 /branches/0.11/src/filter/AgaviFormPopulationFilter.class.php: Added missing the "$this->" in line 428 and trimmed trailing whitespace. Closes #606
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09:30  * MikeSeth stretches
09:30 < MikeSeth> CIA-30: isn't that grounds for RC8? ;)
09:30 < MikeSeth> err
09:30  * MikeSeth pokes v-dogg 
09:30 < MikeSeth> should I svn up from RC7?
09:31 < MikeSeth> oh boy, I should
09:32 < MikeSeth> EoN: mmmp new here?
09:32 -!- Wombert [n=Wombert@dialbs-213-023-052-058.static.arcor-ip.net] has joined #agavi
09:32  * MikeSeth pets Wombert 
09:32 -!- E_mE [n=E_mE@81.168.18.2] has joined #agavi
09:32 < MikeSeth> oh E_mE you looked for me yesterday? sup
09:32 < E_mE> huomenta!
09:33 < Wombert> 'sup MikeSeth 
09:33 < MikeSeth> alive, surprisingly
09:34 < MikeSeth> I got to work on a really annoying idea recently
09:34 < MikeSeth> Agavi saves the day once again..
09:37 < Wombert> glad to hear that, MikeSeth 
09:37 < Wombert> I'm enjoying the new desks and, most importantly, chairs in ze office :)
09:37 < MikeSeth> Wombert: PICS
09:37 < Wombert> yeah no cam :(
09:38 < Wombert> can use my cam phone
09:38 < MikeSeth> soon, soon I will have my office and mad chairs in it 
09:38 < MikeSeth> then I shall rule
09:39 < E_mE> sorry MikeSeth
09:40 < E_mE> i wanted to know if you knew of an app that runs on a remote server and keeps a live connection to a client or vice versa to tell when a VPN connection goes down
09:41 < MikeSeth> E_mE: umm, I suppose any monitoring package or even a simple shell script can do that
09:42 < E_mE> soon i will be get a machine gun and start gunning down my boss ;) hoho
09:42 < E_mE> i found out yesterday that about 70% of the fellow employees really really hate her
09:42 < E_mE> so im not alone ;)
09:42 < MikeSeth> haha
09:43 < MikeSeth> the perks of working for a heartless employer
09:43 < MikeSeth> did the trolls in the other town get back to you yet?
09:43 < E_mE> no not yet.. sent it last thursday...
09:43 < E_mE> but there is a contract for 5x PHP Developers in Cornwall too
09:43 < E_mE> might throw my CV at that if i can find out where its based
09:44 < MikeSeth> damn better
09:45 < E_mE> the General Manager of the sister company (a highly respected Wine man =P) has offered to give me a reference instead of my boss
09:45 < E_mE> so... i can shove my arse in her face >:D
09:46 < MikeSeth> E_mE: ahh.. you still have no idea how much profound effect a single programmer can have on their employer
09:46 < E_mE> well, would be great if i got paided and got the job the day after, id be like! Fuck you im off!! no 1 month notice
09:46 < MikeSeth> is that legal?
09:46 < MikeSeth> not around here 
09:47 < E_mE> well its a breach of contract.. meaning you wouldn't get your months pay
09:47 < E_mE> and we are payed for a months work rather then for a months work
09:47 < E_mE> opps
09:47 < E_mE> we get paid after 1 month work
09:47 < E_mE> rather then paied pre-emativly
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09:48 < MikeSeth> duh
09:48 < MikeSeth> well in here, you do need to give a notice
09:48 < E_mE> well the sister company use to be paid a month in advance
09:48 < E_mE> yes we need to give 1 months notice unless you have worked there for 5 years... then its 3 months notice
09:50 < MikeSeth> The handling of
09:50 < MikeSeth> 313 	     * error severities is done by the validator itself and should not concern
09:50 < MikeSeth> 314 	     * the writer of a new validator.
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09:51 < MikeSeth> I WANT TO HAVE CHILDREN WITH THE PERSON WHO WROTE THAT
09:51 < Wombert> really
09:51 < MikeSeth> not reallt, but it's really a scream of frustration
09:51 < Wombert> I thought it was a general consensus that the whole validation system is utter crap
09:52 < MikeSeth> Wombert: it's clumsy a little bit, but it's way more thought out than the certain other.. codebases I have to work with
09:52 < RossC0> Wombert: it is
09:52 < Wombert> yes, but it is horribly inconsistent
09:52 < RossC0> but its not too far off
09:52 < Wombert> yes, RossC0,  but the API is really poor etc
09:53 < Wombert> should have had a closer look at it, but now it's too late
09:53 < Wombert> btw MikeSeth 
09:53 < Wombert> you know what Doctrine_Configurable is right?
09:53 < Wombert> and you RossC0 
09:53 < MikeSeth> yeah
09:54 < Wombert> I proposed this to konsta yesterday
09:54 < Wombert> introduce a new attribute "vendor info"
09:54 < Wombert> $conn->setAttribute(Doctrine::ATTR_VENDOR_INFO, array(
09:54 < Wombert>   'org.agavi' => array(
09:54 < Wombert>     'context' => $contextOfThisConnection
09:54 < Wombert> :)
09:55 < Wombert> I first thought we'd need the ability to set any key/value on configurables, which right now is not allowed, but I think the vendor info approach would be even better
09:55 < MikeSeth> is it generally in Doctrine's habit to support namespaces like that?
09:55 < Wombert> as it seems most connection handling bugs in doctrine are fixed now, that implies that very soon, you could access the context via $this->getContext() in doctrine tables and records
09:56 < MikeSeth> Wombert: yes, though I am not certain that is a good thing to do
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10:01 < Wombert> in any case, I have a patch ready
10:01 < MikeSeth> i will be playing with doctrine code tonight
10:03 < MikeSeth> though i wont have anything specific that needs context
10:04 < MikeSeth> man, I've been reading through people's opinions on MVC implementations yesterday, it's horrible, most of them don't get it at all
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10:09 < Wombert> yeah MikeSeth :)
10:09 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I can dig up a hilarious post about CouchDB
10:09 < Wombert> couchdb is teh rox :(
10:10 < MikeSeth> http://groups.google.com/group/couchdb/browse_frm/thread/e1eac1af681baae3
10:10 < MikeSeth> I literally LOL'd when I read it
10:10 < Wombert> heh
10:10 < Wombert> agavi will come with a Phpcouch adapter
10:10 < MikeSeth> quote
10:10 < MikeSeth> "In short: nope. Django.db and ActiveRecord are both meant for SQL  
10:10 < MikeSeth> databases. I'm not sure what the best model for working with a  
10:10 < MikeSeth> CouchDb is, it doesn't seem like a typical ORM would be the best fit  
10:10 < MikeSeth> given how the views work. "
10:10 < Wombert> (I'm writing phpcouch atm)
10:10 < MikeSeth> <3333
10:11 < Wombert> $this->context->getDatabaseConnection('couch')->retrieve('12345');
10:11 < Wombert> see, that's the benefit of frameworks that don't tell you what UUUH ACTIVE RECORD to use
10:11 < Wombert> :)
10:12 < MikeSeth> Wombert: that post consists of 100% clueless discussion. And they're blissfully unaware of it.
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10:12 < Wombert> I think the most sensible way forward would be to declare a class in 
10:12 < Wombert> Python for ever single View on your CouchDB database. 
10:12 < Wombert> meheheh
10:13 < MikeSeth> i should start printing out wikipedia entries and faxing them to people
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10:16 < Wombert> related: http://www.igvita.com/blog/2007/10/29/boosting-activerecord-performance/
10:16 < Wombert> :)
10:17 -!- shrink [n=sh1nk@obc-r22-325-217-66-62-6.exozet.com] has joined #agavi
10:17 < Wombert> RossC0: soup.io any good?
10:18 < Wombert> the only things I'd like to see in tumblr are
10:18 < Wombert> 1) "code" post type
10:18 < Wombert> 2) automatic reblog note under posts
10:18 < Wombert> 3) optional comments
10:18 -!- shrink is now known as shrink0r
10:19 < Wombert> but
10:19 < Wombert> Posting to Tumblr will be unavailable during scheduled upgrades this Thursday, November 1, in the morning (EST). Our apologies for any inconvenience.
10:19 < Wombert> :>
10:20 < Wombert> http://blog.davidville.com/2007/10/18/11-1-07/
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10:20 < Wombert> :>
10:21 < _cheerios> is tumblr coming up with all new stuff Nov1st?
10:21 < RossC0> woot
10:21 < Wombert> they say it's gonna be ace, yes
10:21 < RossC0> comments you can do
10:21 < RossC0> but its a hack
10:21 < RossC0> code you can do - but its a ahck
10:21 < RossC0> *jack
10:21 < Wombert> tumblr or soupio?
10:21 < RossC0> *hack!!
10:21 < RossC0> tumblr
10:22 < RossC0> js - other services
10:22 < Wombert> yeh but I'd rather have it properly
10:22 < RossC0> BUT all the tumblrs that have comments seem to have no comments...
10:22 < Wombert> w/ gravatars and all
10:22 < _cheerios> tumblrs have nothing to say of interest bar quick laughs, no wonder :)
10:23 < Wombert> lunch ->
10:26 < RossC0> _cheerios: do you read my tumblr?
10:26 < MikeSeth> what is this.. tumblr thing.. you speak about?
10:27 < _cheerios> RossC0, when you mention it here on #agavi, ye
10:28 < RossC0> MikeSeth: its micro blogging 
10:28 < RossC0> _cheerios:  shift the web just for you
10:29 < RossC0> *I shift..
10:29 < RossC0> so sub to the feed dude!
10:29 < _cheerios> shift jack a sole, you, you!
10:29 < MikeSeth> RossC0: how's that different from.. non-micro blogging?
10:29 < RossC0> MikeSeth: agileweb.org
10:30 < RossC0> its all small bites, rather than essays or rants about no Java on Leopard - ZOMG KILL APPLE
10:31 < MikeSeth> oh
10:31 < MikeSeth> mmp
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10:32 < MikeSeth> so I can write "Rails = fail" and everyone would greet me as the liberator?
10:32 < MikeSeth> I'm in :D
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10:32 < RossC0> Rails doesn't really = fail thou
10:33 < RossC0> I think that one would require a ranty essay
10:33 < RossC0> :D
10:33 < MikeSeth> RossC0: http://groups.google.com/group/couchdb/browse_frm/thread/e1eac1af681baae3
10:33 < RossC0> Yeah seen it
10:34 < RossC0> Just don't have your model extending ActiveRecord - no brainer really
10:35 < MikeSeth> I don't think that's possible in Rails
10:36 < RossC0> Sure it is
10:37 < RossC0> Actually - as the conversation says Active Resource is a great fit
10:37 < RossC0> i.e. handles all the REST calls etc..
10:37 < MikeSeth> RossC0: so you could replace AR with an actual domain logic model?
10:37 < RossC0> Sure - not all Models have to be AR!
10:38 < RossC0> You may need to do some extra configuring thou
10:39 < RossC0> mind you I'd use it in Merb over Rails
10:45 < _cheerios> RossC0, how does soup differ from tumblr?
10:46 < RossC0> dunno - its new
10:46 < RossC0> wait until tomorrow and tumblr will win again!
10:46 < _cheerios> Looked like a clone, and I couldnt see ze difference but *shrug*
10:48 < RossC0> yeah its the one of the first things funded by Y Europe - to be released
10:49 < RossC0> but doesn't look as good..
10:49 < _cheerios> it has 2.5k posts today, seems like it'll have no trouble being popular
10:56 < _cheerios> ½a href=""¼hello½a¼ << didnt know about this
10:59 < E_mE> RossC0: do you write apps with Ruby in Mac OS X?
10:59 < E_mE> to make OS X apps
10:59 < E_mE> i hear the new IDE integrates it or so
11:00 < RossC0> Nope - would like to thou :D
11:00 < E_mE> you got leapold yet?
11:12 < Wombert> MikeSeth: go go go :) get a tumblelog
11:12 < Wombert> they're lotsa fun
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11:20 < Wombert> aaah fuck
11:20 < Wombert> fuck fuck fuck
11:21 < MikeSeth> what happen?
11:21 < Wombert> I need to apply for a passport
11:21 < Wombert> today
11:22 < Wombert> as of tomorrow, my fingerprints would be stored on the rfid chip
11:22 < MikeSeth> shit
11:22 < MikeSeth> what if you deactivate it?
11:22 < Wombert> that's not what I'm concerned about
11:22 < Wombert> I could put it into a metal case and done
11:22 < MikeSeth> then?
11:22 < MikeSeth> actually wait
11:23 < Wombert> I'm more concerned that the government will store my fingerprints in a central database
11:23 < MikeSeth> does this mean that ALL fingerprints are on file?
11:23 < Wombert> well they say they're not doing that
11:23 < MikeSeth> heh
11:23 < Wombert> I believe they're actually saying "not in a CENTRALIZED database"
11:23 < Wombert> which means each office stores the prints of applicants
11:23 < Wombert> and next year, there'll be a law that legalizes such a db
11:23 < Wombert> that's how things always go in germany
11:24 < Wombert> same with phone surveillance, road toll system etc etc etc etc
11:24 < MikeSeth> protests?
11:24 < MikeSeth> what phone surveillance
11:24 < Wombert> not the german people, MikeSeth 
11:24 < MikeSeth> are you kidding me
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11:24 < Wombert> nobody gives a shit
11:24 < MikeSeth> oh my god
11:24 < MikeSeth> I think it's time to start that global political party
11:24 < Wombert> try the same thing in france, they're storming the elysees palace the next day to hang the president
11:25 < E_mE> Wombert: same happening to some degree in the UK
11:25 < Wombert> yes but they're not storing your fingerprints
11:25 < E_mE> with ID cards... have retinor scan, finger prints
11:25 < Wombert> in exchange, at least london has gapless video surveillance
11:25 < Wombert> which sucks
11:25 < E_mE> yes
11:25 < Wombert> nah not retina yet
11:25 < MikeSeth> what do you mean gapless
11:25 < MikeSeth> 100% coverage?! 
11:25 < Wombert> MikeSeth: yes
11:25 < Wombert> I believe so
11:26 < Wombert> at least the inner parts of the city
11:26 < Wombert> there's cameras everywhere
11:26 < MikeSeth> dear god
11:26 < E_mE> they are investing face regongition heavily over here
11:26 < Wombert> MikeSeth:  this whole EU thing is fucked up big time
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11:26 < Wombert> guess why I want to get myself australian citizenship as well
11:26 < Wombert> you know, just in case
11:26 < E_mE> and the police are slowly starting to push that everyone should submit a DNA record
11:27 < E_mE> the police have a DNS of over 2 million people on there database
11:27 < E_mE> and slowly starting to go... well we might as well have everyone...
11:28 < MikeSeth> http://www.techdo.com/your-worst-nightmare-rfid-powder/
11:28 < E_mE> they are using dirty tricks like... if you are suspected of a crime or so... they can request a DNA sample from you... then if you are released without charge they have the OPTION to either delete the DNA record or keep it on there database 
11:29 < E_mE> and i think pretty mike 99% of the time, they save the record into the database
11:29 < MikeSeth> heh
11:29 < Wombert> okay NO
11:29 < Wombert> WHAT THE FUCK
11:29 < Wombert> THEY ARE CLOSED
11:29 < Wombert> ZOMG
11:29 < Wombert> 8 to 12
11:29 < Wombert> are they kidding me?
11:29 < Wombert> fucking hell
11:29 < E_mE> :S
11:31 < E_mE> Wombert: that is a VERY small RFID tag :o
11:33 < Wombert> ERRRRR
11:33 < E_mE> opps.. sorry. i ment MikeSeth
11:33 < Wombert> I hate this fucking country
11:33 < E_mE> go to Fugi ;)
11:34 < Wombert> you mean Fiji :p
11:35 < E_mE> hehe yes
11:35 < Wombert> but nah thanks, too many coups d'etat
11:36 < E_mE> mmm okay... how about africa 
11:36 < E_mE> no where more free then africa
11:36 < E_mE> :o Netherlands ;)
11:36 < Wombert> netherlands = eu = disaster
11:37 < E_mE> you dont believe in the EU?
11:37  * RossC0 ascertains that Wombert is guilty
11:37 < RossC0> the jury is out of what he is guilty of
11:37 < E_mE> mmmm Wombert Africa then ;)
11:37 < RossC0> :D
11:38 < Wombert> yes I have something to hide if I don't want my fingerprints stored :p
11:38 < E_mE> guilty of Gross miscoding =P
11:38  * RossC0 doesn't care
11:38 < RossC0> the UK they'll add it
11:38 < RossC0> we have more cameras than anywhere
11:38 < RossC0> and still the pictures they produce look rubbish
11:39 < E_mE> i hear its well over 2 million cameras in london alone
11:39 < E_mE> though my town i live in has 3 CCTV cameras watching over us all day and night
11:39 < E_mE> and there hidden in some kind of dome thing
11:40 < RossC0> Britain has a staggering 4.2million CCTV cameras - one for every 14 people in the country - and 20 per cent of cameras globally.
11:40 < RossC0> yet 80% of crime unsolved
11:40 < RossC0> woot
11:41 < E_mE> i always wonder who is sitting watching all those cameras, it would mean that about 4 million people are employeed to watch them or so
11:42 < RossC0> The average Londoner going about his or her business may be monitored by 300 CCTV cameras a day
11:42 < E_mE> but can be sworn at over 600 times a day =P hehehe
11:43 < v-dogg> ouuuuouu... 
11:43  * v-dogg ate too much
11:55  * RossC0 going BDD with and Agavi Rest server
12:18 < _cheerios> ze huh?
12:46 < E_mE> Wombert: what layout flavour is your PHPDoc?
12:46 < Wombert> no idea, look at the build ml
12:46 < Wombert> xml
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12:56  * E_mE hugs PhpDoc :D
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14:19 < shrink0r> hi all
14:20 < Whisller> hi you ;)
14:20 < shrink0r> can someone tell me how the name is called for the enable_caching setting in the settings.xml?
14:20 < shrink0r> ^^
14:20 < shrink0r> I'm talking about agavi of course
14:21 < shrink0r> just in case ^^
14:24 < RossC0> shrink0r: its in factories.xml
14:25 < RossC0> <execution_filter class="AgaviExecutionFilter">
14:25 < RossC0> 	<parameter name="enable_caching">true</parameter>
14:25 < RossC0> </execution_filter>
14:25 < shrink0r> oh ok
14:25 < shrink0r> thx
14:25 < shrink0r> I was wondering why it just didn't want to work
14:25 < shrink0r> :)
14:32 < Wombert> default is on
14:34 < shrink0r> hmm, that's weird
14:34 < shrink0r> I just applied the setting
14:35 < shrink0r> and caching now works
14:35 < shrink0r> I didn't change the cache setting/rules in the module cache folder
14:36 < shrink0r> big thx anyway, I've been trying to figure it out since hours
14:37 < shrink0r> I hope I can figure out a smart interface to route the agavi cache to memcache in order to speed it up
14:39 < Wombert> overwrite ExecutionFilter's methods for that
14:39 < Wombert> 1.0 will likely have improvement in that area
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14:51 < _cheerios> shrink0r, dish out the code when you're finished! :)
15:01 < _cheerios> oh man, second infinite loop within a month. im losing it. : |
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15:08 < _cheerios> Wombert, how do I get the $container when working within the user object?
15:09 < Wombert> you don't
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15:09 < shrink0r> sry my english isn't the best
15:09 < shrink0r> what do meen with "dish out" ?
15:09 < Wombert> publish
15:09 < Wombert> :)
15:09 < shrink0r> :) mkay
15:09 < shrink0r> I will
15:10 < _cheerios> how do I get it for use for an action's getCredentials() ?
15:10 < shrink0r> I hope end of this week
15:13 < _cheerios> i need ze container for my extended rbac implementation
15:13 < MikeSeth> http://img.4chan.org/b/src/1193843401893.jpg
15:18 < _cheerios> hmmzm, AgaviSecurityFilter needs work then
15:24 < MikeSeth> Wombert: how's that 201 bug doing? filed a bug report?
15:31 < Wombert> _cheerios: the user cannot know the "current" container
15:31 < Wombert> that would be totally illogical
15:31 < Wombert> yes, security filter would be the way to go then
15:33 < MikeSeth> Wombert: I'm talking to a guy who works on the streams code
15:34 < Wombert> it's not 201 specific
15:34 < Wombert> I want an http context option that prevents the error throwing
15:34 < Wombert> I'll just do this myself and write to the internals list
15:34 < Wombert> it's pretty trivial I'm sure
15:35 < MikeSeth> alright.. or you could bug pollita directly
15:37 < Wombert> is she online?
15:40 < MikeSeth> not now, but she'll prolly show up 
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16:04 < _cheerios> Wombert, filtered for now so i can get this thing done and then worry more about the illogical and the komplikated.
16:15 < Whisller> cya
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17:06  * MikeSeth pokes all
17:06 < MikeSeth> http://trac.agavi.org/browser/branches/0.11/src/request/AgaviWebRequest.class.php line 247
17:07 < MikeSeth> am I seeing a bug?
17:07 < MikeSeth> anyone up for a quick fix?
17:07 < jake> why do you think that's broken?
17:08 < MikeSeth> it returns $key if $default is null, what's the point?
17:10 < jake> what should it return instead? null?
17:11 < MikeSeth> probably
17:11 < jake> seeing as the functionality exactly matches the description, are we sure changing that behavior won't break anything?
17:11 < MikeSeth> I mean if you do AgaviWebRequest::getSourceValue('REMOTE_ADDR'), why would you want to get back "REMOTE_ADDR"
17:12 < MikeSeth> though this is unlikely scenario..
17:12 < jake> if ( AgaviWebRequest::getSOurceValue('REMOTE_ADDR') == 'REMOTE_ADDR' ) { do something }
17:12 < jake> I suppose because null might be valid?
17:13 < MikeSeth> hah
17:13  * MikeSeth smacks $this
17:14 < shrink0r> ^^
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17:16 < jake> although SERVER_NAME could be a valid SERVER_NAME
17:17 < jake> this is a chance for the NullObject !
17:17 < MikeSeth> can one implement an SPL interface to respond to is_empty and is_null?
17:18 < MikeSeth> speaking of which
17:18 < MikeSeth> why are we still using getAttribute on data holders, we could do [] instead
17:18 < jake> yeah... I think that's crap :) It's like pseudo-operator overloading
17:19 < jake> which always makes me uncomfortable
17:20 < MikeSeth> I bet Wombie has some long winded, confusing and completely correct explanation
17:21 < kaos|work> MikeSeth: imho this doesn't make sense
17:22 < kaos|work> (since it's in the phpdoc it probably does ... but i don't see it either ^^)
17:26 < kaos|work> and from looking at the changeset which introduced it i think that behaviour is never used anywere
17:27 < kaos|work> and
17:27 < kaos|work> if(preg_match_all('/\:/', preg_quote($SERVER_NAME), $m) > 1) {
17:27 < kaos|work> heh
17:27 < jake> no that's the right thing to do
17:27 < jake> it does make sense
17:27 < jake> You want to do something like AgaviWebRequest::getSourceValue('REMOTE_ADDR', 'Not Set')
17:28 < jake> Since if it returns null, REMOTE_ADDR was set
17:29 < jake> Although returning $key is kind of strange, but returning null doesn't make sense either
17:30 < kaos|work> jake: Since if it returns null, REMOTE_ADDR was set <-- you mean not set ?
17:32 < kaos|work> the feature itself may have its use ... but the implementation of this in that way is just wrong imho (i would use an optional reference param indicating if a result has been found)
17:34 < kaos|work> and i don't see any reason why that method needs to be public 
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17:55 < _cheerios> woot woot
17:55 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: what's the right way to get $_SERVER contents?
17:57 < kaos|work> $_SERVER  ? xD
17:57 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: well IP and primary server name
17:57 < kaos|work> i think there is no facility which wraps the $_SERVER stuff
17:57 < _cheerios> giving the User a $container wasnt so straightforward when I tried it. A filter is run after credentials are checked, so I need two injection points atleast o_O
17:57 < kaos|work> i even think it was on purpose ... but womb knows the details ;)
17:58 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: so what's the right way to query the client's IP address?
18:00 < kaos|work> using $_SERVER
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18:05 < _cheerios> MikeSeth, http://www.devpartment.com/posts/mootools-php-moohp/ :)
18:08 < v-dogg> uhmm... wtf is that?
18:08 < v-dogg> besides yet another toolkit calling itself framework
18:09 < _cheerios> These pop up atleast once a year
18:09 < v-dogg> haha, props for the first comment
18:10 < v-dogg> "This whole idea makes me cry."
18:12 < v-dogg> hahaha, I really love this: $t->SE("body")->newLine();
18:12 < v-dogg> "Body adopts  <br />" 
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18:17 < _cheerios> i need to learn new languages, i cant understand code anymore: (1..3).map(&'x -> y -> x * y').map(&'[2]') => [2, 4, 6]
18:18 < v-dogg> looks like javascript
18:23 < _cheerios> an example of upcoming ruby 1.9 features; (1..3).map(&'x -> y -> x * y') produces an array of three functions, one that multiplies by one, one that multiplies by two, and one that multiplies by three; .map(&'[2]') actually takes each function in the list and calls it with the parameter 2.
18:26 < _cheerios> (x -> y -> x * y produces a function with a parameter, x. It returns a function (y) that returns x*y)
18:26 < _cheerios> pretty compact stuff
18:29 < v-dogg> I'll take readability over a few more key strokes any day
18:36 < _cheerios> *shivers* reading too many blogs, i cant actually tell whom the commenters are by their first names alone
18:36 < _cheerios> s/cant/can
18:49 < MikeSeth> kaos|work: $_SERVER isn't cleared out?
18:49 < kaos|work> nopes
18:50 < MikeSeth> hmpf
18:50 < MikeSeth> anyway, victory, I've finished another Agavi project and it saved me tremendous amounts of effort
18:50 < kaos|work> cool :)
18:50 < MikeSeth>  <html>
18:50 < MikeSeth> <!-- (C) City Club Casino 2007 -->
18:50 < MikeSeth> <!-- Powered by Agavi (http://www.agavi.org) -->
18:50 < MikeSeth> :D
18:51 < kaos|work> :D
18:54 < _cheerios> :)
18:54 < _cheerios> link love, ace
18:55 < _cheerios> i have to add that too
19:03 < Wombert> MikeSeth: that is intentional
19:03 < Wombert> the point of return $default is that you can set sources to fixed values
19:04 < Wombert> <parameter name="sources">
19:04 < Wombert>   <parameter name="SERVER_PORT">443
19:05 < Wombert> so... jake had it perfectly right ;)
19:06 < Wombert> MikeSeth: only HTTP_* vars are removed from $_SERVER
19:06 < Wombert> since those are user supplied
19:06 < Wombert> and potentially dangerous
19:11 < _cheerios> "43,000 years in jail" spain one upped america there
19:12 < Wombert> but
19:12 < Wombert> party
19:12 < Wombert> ->
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19:13 < _cheerios> probably not the 0.11 release party
19:18 < _cheerios> "British pensioner Peggy McAlpine marks her 100th birthday by paragliding off a 760m (2,500ft) peak in the Five Finger Mountains in northern Cyprus." that's just cool
19:18 < _cheerios> http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44210000/jpg/_44210097_grannyparagliderafp416.jpg
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20:33 < jake> hahah
20:33 < jake> "probably not the 0.11 release party"
20:33 < jake> awesome
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22:07 < _cheerios> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7063603.stm life is still so fleeting in iraq, all those american diplomats being (possibly) forcely assigned there must've wet themselves
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--- Log closed Thu Nov 01 00:00:03 2007